Seeds of Destruction flagging - 6 keys per week?

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Njustlight, Dec 2, 2022.

  1. Xyroff-cazic. Director of Sarcasm

    This thread really took a fun turn when a bunch of people who have never even done SoD content on a TLP server started throwing spaghetti at the wall to figure out what their opinions are about the flagging process
    PathToEternity likes this.
  2. Njustlight Journeyman

    Thanks!
    Angeliana likes this.
  3. Valcron Elder

    I hope to see something out of this, flagging pretty rough on TLP's
    Njustlight likes this.
  4. Penelo Lorekeeper

    Would also be nice to see them buff the spell rune drops on some of these expacs. Can be rough getting everyone their spells in era without splitting content or relying on an expac having a super low man boss (like Hearol in TSS)
  5. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    SoF I will agree it is very rough getting everyone the Rk III spells. Going forward I think things will be a bit easier, as we do have some ways to increase the flow of runes. There are a couple events in Korafax that can be 1-2 grouped for runes/gear. Underfoot there are not than many spells to get, so that should be easy, and in HoT things change for the better. When you get a rune for a certain level in HoT, you can use that rune to get any spell you want from that level. No more having to get a ton of unwanted or unused spells in order to get the ones you really want. Should help save your raid/guild on runes.
    Njustlight likes this.
  6. Njustlight Journeyman

    Honestly, I don't think that's as big a deal as people think. To me, that falls into the same category as gearing... people need to do their research on it. Like getting a wizard their nukes or a cleric their buff is definitely nice, but you know that in a few weeks you're going to replace that completely with a Rk. 1 spell from the next expansion. A monk on the other hand, is going to use Crystalpalm until VoA, so it's worthwhile to just pass Glowings to all of your monks to get them the extra couple % on that discipline.
  7. McJumps TLP QoL Activist

    So, while I agree with you some things last longer than just the one expansion, the other side of that argument is the fact that the Monk might use that ability 7 or 8 times on a raid, if they are using it as soon as it is available again, whereas the Cleric or the Wizard might be casting that spell hundreds of times over that same period. The argument that you have really made here is that those runes should go to the cleric and the wizard first, since they will only benefit from them a short time. As long as the monk gets that disc before the end of the xpac, its fine since it has longevity. See how that works? :p

    Thankfully, going forward we shouldn't have any more issues like this, so everyone can get the spells they need.
    Logulai likes this.
  8. Njustlight Journeyman

    Agree to disagree lol. It's not really on topic here, but my view is that on a TLP where you have limited time to farm stuff you should allocate where possible for most long-term benefit in order to ensure that the long-term users are covered. In the case of Glowing runes in Crystallos, I would 100% advocate that the the first X glowings should go to your raiding monks in order to ensure that they actually get a needed disc, and then move on to the other classes, and I argue that in the same way that healing foci should go to priests first, 2h weapons to berserkers, bows to rangers, etc.
  9. Ishbu Augur


    You are describing a loot council guild. I think most people are playing in DKP guilds.

    Assuming dkp, unless something is absolutely necessary for the guild to continue progressing, there is no need to prioritize/funnel gear or spells to anyone in particular.
  10. Morrigan Bowjobs

    A hybrid system can be beneficial, and is in fact some times needed due to the ill informed. Normally, loot councils decide every aspect of loot and which exact person gets that piece. In a hybrid system you can denote a class or classes have priority on a specific category of loot and once those receive the item it opens up to anyone. Like the person above stated Bows for Rangers, 2hand for berserker, AC augs for tanks etc.
    There is still competition between the class, or cross class in the case of tanks, and not one person is being delegated the loot. This would prevent ill informed or malignant player from winning or running up the cost of an item that would get little use over a class specifically designated.
    Example of Bard, pally/SK winning a raid bow over a ranger. How often are those classes using the bow? To shoot once to pull? As stat stick when many other range items are available to them while a ranger is mostly stuck for bows in that slot? How about AC or Hdex augs to pure casters? Why does a tank need to spend 3 weeks worth of dkp against a pure caster? Is 25 AC randomly gonna save them when trash rounds them either way? How about warrior, ranger, monk getting a 2 hander over a berserker? The berserker uses the 2hander 24/7 while a warrior may randomly swap to it or use while soloing? Majority of the time they are dual wielding or sword & board. Ranger/Monks don't use them except for a burn or is worse than dual wielding.

    So, sometimes a dkp system with rules or priorities should be in place so people get the most benefit out of the limited resources and helps guild progress. However, these situations would only be used sparingly. If jewelry is all/all and has good stats for both melee or caster no rules imposed. Or if visible pieces anyone can bid to turn in for their class specific pieces. Same with cosmetic things like illusions, mounts, etc.
    It just becomes silly when those examples I give repeatdly happen.
  11. Njustlight Journeyman


    What @Morrigan said. It's not a loot council, it's intelligent prioritization. And it doesn't require a loot council or guild officers to enforce either... individual players can do this themselves with a little forethought. I main a berserker. I will pass on Sharpshooting items if rangers legitimately don't have an updated focus for it, because that benefits them way more than me, and therefore the raid. But this is also why I didn't bring up gear/spells in my original post on this topic - loot distribution is 100% within the discretion/power of the guild/raid/players to handle as they see fit and everyone is going to have different methods for handling that based on the composition of their raiding force and what they agree upon. Key drops that result in unnecessary time sinks are NOT within the power of your raid force outside of extraordinary measures like splits and such, and are a far more appropriate conversation item when asking for fixes.
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  12. Ishbu Augur

    I literally said "unless something is absolutely necessary for the guild to continue progressing"

    You used 5 paragraphs to try and refute what I posted to conclude with the same sentiment, lol
  13. Ishbu Augur

    There is a massive difference between some players choosing to pass on gear to allow others to get it and the guild dictating where it goes. Every DKP guild jokes about people colluding the fact of the matter is we almost all do it, because as you raid with people you form relationships and you would rather see those friends and allies get something more meaningful for them than be selfish and take it yourself. But again, thats very different than your previous post that was speaking much more generally saying certain classes should get priority on certain spells or certain gear, period.

    Edit - Hell the idea that the first glowing runes should go to raiding monks is absurd. Monk dps is not making or breaking progression for a guild. Realistically the only thing that is going to halt guild progression in an era is going to be tanks needing sufficient gear levels. There may be extreme examples of a very specific new spell or ability be necessary for a specific encounter, but you wont need everyone of a class to get it, just enough to accomplish the goal.

    None of this content goes away when a new expansion launches. If monks, in this case, need that discipline and didnt get it over the weeks and weeks of the era, the good news is it just became even easier to farm it with small numbers to ensure they do get it with the release of the next expac.
  14. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Just because there might not be a "need" doesn't mean even in a DKP system that drops might not be funneled to a class or couple of classes in order to improve overall performance and help get through raids faster.
  15. Ishbu Augur

    Im sure that does happen, doesnt make it good.

    A guild is able to clear the content, so now you are telling people they arent allowed to use their dkp for upgrades for their character because its being just freely given as priority to others just for fun, hope it drops again for you after we give it our priority people we want having gear, only to what? Repeat the process in a month or 2 for the next expansion?

    Terrible system. But again, I am sure there are guilds out there that do this, just like there are loot council guilds and a variety of other pretty awful systems that have existed over 2.5 decades of MMOs.

    DKP is already awarded to everyone who shows up regardless of effort or ability, prioritizing unnecessary items past that is ridiculous.

    EDIT - Actually maybe thats just a personal worth/pride thing. People who are absolutely 100% ok being insignificant, not mattering in the slightest, happy to blend in the crowd and follow everyone else like a sheep are probably cool with this. Anyone who has a little more self worth than that, should not be.
  16. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    And someone using their DKP to buy something that will never be used on raids isn't good either. If you notice what was being said is this is about a hybrid system and not a loot council as you are trying to make it out to be. This is also talking about a set of items and not everything on raids and there is nothing wrong with ensuring that some important drops go to the people who will best use them instead of someone picking something up that will never get used during raids. Just showing up on raids doesn't always mean a lot.
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  17. Arclyte Augur

    [IMG]

    Rule of Acquisition #6: Never allow family(or guild) to stand in the way of opportunity.

    yea pure DKP sucks the same way pure capitalism sucks
    Rasper Helpdesk likes this.
  18. Njustlight Journeyman

    You are purposefully misconstruing a remark that was made for the pure purpose of saying "I should be able to spend my DKP on whatever I want, however I want." And honestly, if that's how you feel that's perfectly fine.... for the third time, that very sentiment is the EXACT reason that this post is about KEYS not LOOT.
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  19. Logulai Journeyman


    lol... this is the goofiest thing i've ever read on here. People play TLP's to do the content in era. Otherwise, they would just make characters on a live server and plow through it at 120.
  20. Logulai Journeyman


    yeah and for us non mega guilds it took 3 weeks.