The yearly question: will this expac be cut n' paste?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Vizier, Nov 3, 2022.

  1. ttobey Developer

    I don't think any of the animators went on to EQ2.. I came onboard right after luclin for PoP, but EQ at the time didn't have a lot of great animators. All of the npcs were outsourced to a local San Diego company, and the quality was pretty hit or miss. The original models, (in my opinion) are pretty terrible animation wise too. The weird jitteriness of all the old characters is due to a lack of an IK rig in the software of the time, so animations had to be eyeballed to keep their feet planted on the ground.
    Rijacki likes this.
  2. ttobey Developer

    https ://vimeo.com/395984973
    That's a really old demo of mine, but you can see the troll we were working on, second anim in.
    Had a bit of flavor of the original troll but updated.
  3. ttobey Developer

    Move the :// over to the https. It wouldn't let me post it otherwise
  4. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    That's a great strategy btw.

    Troll 2.5 was bada$$
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  5. delthran New Member


    That’s really cool, thanks for sharing that! Were there models in that demo reel that aren’t in the game? I didn’t recognize the three headed dog.
  6. ttobey Developer

    Yeah, that's probably from a Harry Potter game that never came out when I worked for EA for a bit.
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  7. ttobey Developer

    And speaking of Troll 2, there's a hilarious documentary on prime I saw last night. The Best Worst Movie about the making of Troll 2. I never saw it, found the movie, and it is the worst movie ever.
    CrazyLarth, Skuz and minimind like this.
  8. Rasper Helpdesk The Original Helpdesk

    I watched Troll 2 for the first time this Halloween. My lord...

    I'm also amused that the documentary is directed by Michael Stephenson, who played the boy in Troll 2.
    ttobey likes this.
  9. Andarriel Everquest player since 2000

    Every year i look forawrd to raising my corruption 10 points /sarcasm off
  10. henry0918 Journeyman

    Why can’t you guys return to the root and make the game like 1999 like when the game was in Verant’s hands

    Remove all those god damn corpse summon crap and stop the use of in game map

    Eq has lost its soul dumbed down and Become so scripted and generic
    Why can’t people accidentally attack npc in city area anymore ?
    Yea just like 10000 mmo out there

    When Everquest was in Verants hands it was the best game on the planet, hardcore MMO'ing that forced you to make friends/alliances if you wanted to go far in the game.

    72 man raids that took over an hour to kill one boss and took prolific planning and execution to complete by all in the raid.

    The worst thing to happen to it was the casualisation, marking the beginning of the end of those fantastic days.

    Sadly, a trait that most MMO's adopt today and ever since.

    Great things about EverQuest:


    1) Long travel times and death penalties
    2) Group dungeon crawling and community building
    3) Newbies and casuals admiring the Hardcores and their special loot/armor look

    Zero instant gratification, and the scope just seemed epic. The first trip across the Karanas. Or looking off the boat and seeing the Cyclops trouncing around their island. You just felt small.

    I also enjoyed that minor things had major meaning depending on level. Still remember trading a SSB that was given to me by a warrior in the top raiding guild on Innoruuk. It was from their SSOY farm, and I traded it for my first PGT. He gave me one to wear and one to sell because he had a pack full of them. Always ended up with 27 helms and a single sword it seemed.

    Sydsloot Halflingpunter, 50 Barbarian Warrior...guy seemed like a god to me as a lo 20's scrub inspecting him to see the best gear available in vanilla.

    OK, I really enjoyed camping guards. Don't know why :lol: perhaps it was the good XP or getting to help newbies when they run to their guards and find them dead. As a mage I could usually help them with their trains, and buffing them was fun for me. Not everyday a mage feels useful :D

    So here is my list of guards killed.

    Steamfont: Gnome guards were plentiful and decent money.

    Misty Thicket: Guards along the wall, had lowbie druids cast lull so I could easily break the spawn

    Neriak 3rd Gate: all of the wandering guards near the floating eye.

    Thurgadin: Had to chain cast my earth pet at lvl 55 to kill one of them. not worth the XP, but you do get a cool shield.

    Erudin: Don't remember where in Erudin but I remember he used LH, which sucked.

    Qeynos Hills: Random guards, just for fun.

    Butcherblock: Many dwarf guards, little ankle bitters can put up a fight.

    Heck, anything that moved that I could kill I tried to. Just to see what it dropped. I had some horrible faction problems, but it was all worth it.
    I loved the freedom to make such decisions. THE FREEDOM of Everquest
    Brontus likes this.
  11. henry0918 Journeyman

    Have you heard about that indie new mmo Ember’s adrift ?
    It managed to capture that early eq spirit and lots of eq player over there playing
    Even fires of heaven dude are there and people playing are dead serious just like in eq
    Like kick you out of the group because you needed something you don’t really need
    But they will still escort you to the entrance of the dungeon first lol
    Brontus and Vizier like this.
  12. Arkanny Augur

    that's a chimera from riftseekers sanctum, Omens of War expac if i'm not mistaken, been a long time xD
  13. Brontus EQ Player Activist


    You and Fanra are right. I went back and watched the video interview with Jeff Butler and Shawn Lord on YouTube and Jeff explained that due to some personnel issues, they were severely shorthanded had to bring animators in from other SOE games like Sovereign. I honestly don't think EQ needed new animations. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. I have a feeling that Kelly Flock is the one that suggested new animations.

    I do like the original EQ animations. Walking, running, and combat are great. The Human monk is terrific. Who can forget the ogre animation where he scratches his but? What about the amazing dwarf barrel roll? The original skeleton is incredible compared to the "new" skeleton.

    For me, much of the magic of EQ was the stylized character art in tandem with the original animations. EQ had a signature art style back then and I think they should have stuck with it. Blizzard has a very strict style guide for all WoW artists to adhere to and this ensures that the art assets are all cohesive with each other. From what I can observe, I don't believe EQ had an art style guide. Compare the goblins from classic to Kunark and they are worlds apart in style. The art style seemed to change from expansion to expansion, at least in the early years.
  14. sieger Augur

    I think people confuse "I have nostalgia for something" with "that thing is good." I have a ton of nostalgia for EverQuest's original models and animations, but I don't think they are good, and TTobey has pointed out the number of problems with the original animations that I suspect most fans of them simply overlook because recognizing them would interfere with the rose-colored glasses nostalgia view people have of them.

    The Mario sprite from Super Mario Bros. is iconic, but I would have zero desire to see Mario rendered that way in a 2020s era Mario game.
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  15. sieger Augur

    I completed a TLP all the way until it reached live in March of 2021, so I have now been on live for around 1.5 years. This has given me the perspective of having done all recent expansions and farmed heavily CoV / ToL, and I've done all the 9 events on beta for NoS.

    It is undeniable the total amount of content is not as high as it was in say, Rain of Fear or Veil of Alaris, but I think everyone knows when SOE spun the company off the staff size shrank. But I don't view the expansions as "Copy and Paste." There's been new zones / new stuff in every expansion, it is true that the expansions have leveraged old zone files but usually in creative ways that people like, but there have been genuinely new zones each expansion. The Burning Lands expansion had a lot of stuff that was really new in terms of just look / feel in the game. ToV / CoV / ToL did retread old expansions, but again with new designs and new zones.

    Without knowing more about the specific criticism, I don't know what is meant by "copy and paste", it doesn't sound like you have played the modern expansions at all, so from someone who has--that claim is not accurate. There are elements that are basically just straight carried forward--spells and AAs for example have not received significant overall rebalances in a bit, and new spell lines / AA lines have largely ceased. I assume some of that is staff constraints but TBH even if they never introduced a new spell or AA the ability bloat in EQ is pretty extreme when compared to most other MMOs, if anything more AA consolidation and pruning of spell lines no one uses would probably be a better move than more new ones.
  16. Flatchy Court Jester



    Freedom 35...
  17. Tarvas Redwall of Coirnav, now Drinal

    I get the impression that when they use old zones the process is not as straight forward as first pressing ctrl c, then ctrl v, and finally renaming the file. Ditto the spells, AAs, items, quests, raids, and everything else that is involved in making an expansion. It's all seems to be time consuming no matter if it's a rehash of old content or completely new.

    @Aristo: you could probably buy some time back if you would just name the upgraded spells "Firebolt XXX" or "Complete Heal XI." No need to go back and retroactively rename spells. Most of us will get it, the same people will still whine, and you will personally get more time to brew the perfect cup of coffee or whatever does it for you during the work day.
  18. Warpeace Augur


    Players have stated something to this effect for years...and ignored.

    I'm sure it's a higher-level decision requiring new names for upgrades spells in the same line.
    Tarvas likes this.
  19. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Yeah, whatever dude, P99 is that way -->

    Here is the one single thing in your longwinded rant that I consider a salient point.

    EQ did used to have more freedom, now the game is quite firmly on rails, and it is all the poorer for that.

    I don't hate the progression system, I hate that all EQ has now is that, outside of the Progression there is nothing left, it got reduced, it got very agressively pruned, it had a great deal of what made EQ fun stripped away.

    EQ is far too streamlined, it's lacking a whole lot of fun side-quests & incidental oddities that take you off on weird adventures.

    It's like EQ has been on an Austerity program since 2008, skeleton crew, making skeleton content for players who have adapted to famine levels of content & character development.
    Annastasya, Metanis, Vizier and 4 others like this.
  20. Marton Augur

    This.

    100x.
    Vizier likes this.