What is everyone's thoughts about the AA Marr's gift? It would be nice if they either changed it to be targeted gift of mana, or gave an additional one like the clerics have that allow the paladin to give mana to another player.
Marr's Gift is great. Pretty much on cooldown while soloing along with the two unity clicks. Pretty much the only reason I can make it through a lessons burn on my paladin while using DP instead of FoD (DP is a mana hog). Sure I'd like more mana returned and faster repop...who doesn't want more of a good thing. But there are a dozen other things I'd want to change for paladins before even considering Marr's Gift. And I certainly don't want it player targetable. Too much of a chance I'm on a wrong target when hitting.
Not really. The only things we really use that eat away at our available mana at this point are group heals. And chaining two non stop while splashing and nuking so that you're always on cool down, its impossible to go oom and almost impossible to go lom. You can chain valiant and PD and upbraid to hott group heal and never drop below 95 on an event, for example. Its not like rangers.
Pretty sure you'll drop below 95% within the first 45 seconds if you're hitting those on refresh. Add in keeping protective up, some occasional patch heals and our other short term buffs and on long events (especially if it has any mana drain components) and you'll have to be careful or swap from DP to FoD.
I often hear veteran Pally/SK players say that it's very difficult to go oom. Does our overall mana regen suddenly spike in the late 90's, 100's, or 110'? Or does some new AA or gearing get introduced that helps? I've got a level 91 group-geared paladin. When pre-buffed with Chanter/Beastlord mana regen, and grouped with a Bard singing mana songs? I definitely cannot do non-stop stuns, crushes, and heals. Am I safe and comfortable? For sure. I'm never fretting over mana. But am I pacing myself? Yes. I'm not clicking non-stop, because I'd run out after a few minutes of chain pulls.
I can't speak for Paladins other than from observation, but for SKs it is very easy to maintain 80-90%+ mana through an entire raid event (or nonstop group grinding), excluding mana drains or if you're using our DoTs. From observation of Paladins in my groups during raids, they seem to use a bit more mana during the same events (and struggle more to recover once they are OOM, for whatever reason).
Generally, they are talking about RAIDING not regular play. Overall mana regeneration does not spike so there is no magical fix for mana when playing in regular play, particularly in 30+ minute non-stop killing sessions. There are a few tricks I use when on my paladin and in regular play if mana becomes a concern: -Use FoD instead of DP as DP is a mana hog if it is on cooldown. -Look at your rotation and mix in some low cost stuns in place of more mana expensive spells. -Unity clicks and MG should be on cooldown always -Use defensive discs constantly...less damage means less healing needed -Armor of the Inquisitor and Group should always be on and of course, if OOM, let yourself med to full. Probably need a little break anyway.
I would check their casts for Disruptive Persecution, Composite Force, and Confluent Blessing And see how much they are doing alliances
They are mostly referring to raiding (as mentioned previously) and it really depends on the raid force. Myself and the other paladins in our guild have no problem going OOM - all the time. We are often raiding with imperfect setups (lack of bards, lack of healers, low DPS, etc...) and things drag on longer than they do for other guilds. We also deal with more deaths and it's unlikely that we're able to overpower events with sheer DPS output. Good or bad, fun or not, our reality is just not the same as what others experience. Regarding the original post, no - we should not be getting a way to give mana to another character like a cleric can. There's no reason to steal that from the cleric class - just my opinion though. I would like to see the refresh timer on Marr's Gift reduced or the values increased or something else along those lines. SKs don't have as much of an issue with mana but that's at least partially because they have mana taps - we don't.
That is true, and the other side of the coin. Our Shei runs with 45 in raid take about 6 minutes. A full raid it can be done in under 5. So that's another reason I probably don't see a mana issue unless I die. Primal Vamp is probably the event I go lowest on mana due to doing chain group heals, and I don't recall getting below 50-60% on it.
There is absolutely no way I can get behind having a targeted version of this spell and then fielding 20 tells per raid asking for it. Are you serious?
Yea this isnt even remotely accurate. Unless there is a mana drain on an event paladins do not have any issues whatsoever staying above 90% mana. If you have bards and beastlords doing their thing its not unusual to end an event at 99% mana after having casted a thousand spells as a paladin. Its pretty weird to be honest.
I tried and couldn't get below 70 mana on Sunday on swarm leader. Two group heals, splash, DP, and any other spell I could get off in between that cost decent mana.
Well you're talking group game so it's a bit different, for SK's it does get better after 105 ish because you get better returns on the torment line of spells and if you're using your bite line as well. Paladins get Marr's gift which helps a lot. Also while leveling your gear likely sucks, once you start getting into good gear you'll have a way bigger mana pool that will take longer to drain and since most players have some breaks in their gameplay the bigger mana pool means it just takes longer to run out. If you have 75k mana it takes 3 minutes out of combat to med to full from 0 with OOC regen. If you have 200k mana it still only takes 3 minutes OOC to regen to full OR it takes 67 seconds of ooc regen. So even if there's a tiny bit of a lull in your pulls and you get to sit for a moment you get way more mana back when you have way better gear because of how ooc regen works. Then on the raid side there's a lot more going on with beastlords doing a mgb of paragon and other things which is why these guys don't run out of mana on raids. In group content wearing average or bad gear you're going to run out of mana sometimes.
Paladins should slowly be going through mana. with twincast, splash, protective, valiant, and remonstrate or whatever is in that slot on my bind, I'll slowly loses mana over the fight, but it's like 10min of casting to run oom
Not sure about others but I throttle my mana usage as I get low to just the essentials to let it recover. I can and have done non-stop stuns for a very long time. That mostly comes down to timing though. If you cast them as soon as they refresh, your doing it very wrong. Get your timing down so the next stun is landing as the previous one fades, almost never go oom. It's not the cost of the stuns that does it, it's the cost of the heals from all the stun time you wasted by overwriting stun timers. There's a good reason I don't do a mash macro for my stuns.
