What would your suggestion to make EQ greet again!

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Burdi, May 15, 2022.

  1. Bernel Augur

    I believe this is how the Vitality system works. Maybe they could make use of that somehow. If you're not aware, vitality is an exp-sharing system that comes with fellowships. It's meant to enable certain people in the fellowship to level faster and catch up to the other members. As the fellowship contributes exp, the person's vitality bar fills up and they get more exp per kill until they've used up the vitality. They could make vitality boosts available to lower-level characters so that they would level faster without having to be part of a fellowship.

    But a greater problem is that it gets more challenging to live to the end of the fight to get exp in the first place after 70 or so. The mobs start to hit pretty hard, and just surviving an encounter to get exp gets pretty tough. My theory is that they started tailoring the exp path to end-game raiders who have top gear and can withstand these tough fights. But wandering adventurers with gear from world drops or the bazaar are undergeared for the content. And considering how thin the population is at these levels, there isn't a good way to get raid-quality gear necessary to be able to fight. Probably what would be a greater help than an exp-boost is some kind of way to mitigate incoming damage and increase dealt damage. This would allow the lower-level player to better survive fights and get exp at a good rate.
    Chikkin likes this.
  2. Conq Augur

    A big improvement for me would be a button to ignore all the TLP things. The pop-ups for every expansion/server launch for starters. And the ability to do the same on these boards would be awesome too. /ignore TLP posts.
    Conq
    Metanis and MacDubh like this.
  3. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I get where you are coming from, other players have suggested ways to allow some form of soloing for classes that aren't really outfitted with the toolsets for that, such as 2 mercs (so a dps class would use 1 tank & 1 healer for example) but EQ has always gone the route of "this is a group & raid game not a solo game" and leaned into that a lot.

    I think the main reason is cost, it's far cheaper to create raid & group content for the small expansions we get than to worry about creating a solo-path through the game. Players boxing is effectively soloing by another name/method. If the devs were to try creating a solo-path as well then the expansions we are getting are going to get even smaller and I am sure nobody really wants that to happen.

    Problem with that solo path & with heroic upgrades is it isn't a system that is easily maintained.
    While the side-kicking would require more up-front development it would pay off in the long term by being more sustainable - the updates the team do every year would naturally extend into it anyway, if they used the methodology I outlined (if that's feasible to begin with).

    Shrouds are not the right answer, nor is mentoring in my opinion - players who are max level going down to lower level content really get nothing out of that, and that was a big part of why players do not really use the shroud system - besides not actually playing your own character, powerlevelling is simply a better use of the higher/max level player's time.
    Low-Level Players going up to the level of the highest level player(s) in the groups and earning "gear that they cant even wear yet", will still grow into that gear, it's not going to be useless.
    Fact is that EQ dev team want EQ players to only get reasonablly rewarded on a max level character in the current content, anything else will provide only level-appropriate rewards and level 90 exp to a level 120 character is basically nothing, it's a waste of their time by design.
    After all this is why they nerf XP in old expansions once you outlevel them.
  4. MacDubh TABLES!!!


    Heroic Adventures were the right idea, they just had some serious balancing issues coupled with the fact that you would earn rewards you can't use (level 75 getting level 100 drops in TBM for example).

    In my mind there is a viable solution using a TBM style approach. A couple things would need to be addressed.

    • Make T1 of an expansions equipment scalable by level you could avoid the nightmare aug system of TBM
    • Ensure that missions can be completed with a single player and merc.
    • Either find a way to properly scale named mobs abilities or put in place abilities that scale naturally as their level changes (ie no level 75 named that has a level 105 equivalent mana drain)
    • Provide spell vendors that can use mission currency to buy 75+ rk2 spells (up to previous expansion)
    This could still provide rewards to level appropriate characters, however the main rewards would be saved for the typical Missions/Named as per every recent expansion.
    Would this be too much work for the devs? I have no idea, but it could give returning players a much more obvious path to grouping range without having to research decades of ancient web pages and forum posts trying to figure out how the heck to get from 75-120 when they haven't played since the Sleeper was in his tomb.
    Dre. likes this.
  5. Arkanny Augur

    Changes that make the game easier and soloable would ultimately kill EQ imo. EQ strong suit has always been the fact it's a group focused game. If anything it should try new ways to make older content relevant for newer players again, and to bring in more players to group together. Maybe a master server that puts everyone from 1-100 together?
  6. Brontus EQ Player Activist

    1. Require that every dev re-apply for their current positions
    2. Hire devs that are genuinely passionate about EverQuest and who actively play in their leisure time
    3. Insist that devs actually play EverQuest on company time and walk a mile in the shoes of the players
    4. Require devs to play the level 1-10 newbie experience in all starting zones
    5. Insist that devs regularily communicate by video and via forums each month to the players
    6. Give all devs a FedEx day where they can work on new ideas for EQ
    7. Bring back live, dynamic quests and invasions
    8. Elminate mobs that can summon except for deities and dragons
    9. Remove all root and snare immunities from mobs
    10. Allow levitation to be used in any zone
    11. Allow all NPCs to be attackable
    12. Fix all existing bugs
    13. Give all EQ devs a pay raise
    14. Allow all EQ devs to earn extra money in their spare time by working on Quality of Life issues and bugs via Patreon, GoFundMe, etc.
    15. Hire a dedicated product evangelist
    16. Establish a modern social media outreach program to bring more players into EQ
    17. Reduce the toxicity of the forums
    18. Use the in-game poll mechanic to get the opinions of players
    19. Sell the entire EQ franchise to Elon Musk
    Metanis and Chikkin like this.
  7. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    Is this a passive-aggressive attack on the current team? Some of your comments are straight up mean.


    :rolleyes:
  8. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    The first step is a good way to lose talent because that is a good sign that the company is looking to downsize and get rid of people.

    Also I am not sure why you want to lose any of the limited dev time we already have to playing the game instead of working on the game.
    Ulrin and Ozon like this.
  9. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    Trying to get devs fired is as toxic as you can get.

  10. uberkingkong Augur

    TLPs, I would not be surprised if a lot of the playerbase is from the live servers itself.

    They make live servers more dead, and TLPs don't last long.
    So live players sticking live start quitting because server is losing players, friends leaving.
    Those live players quit/take break (couple years break, not a quickie)
    TLP players come back to live like a couple months later, those live players they played with probably left because there buddies went to TLP and they thought they quit.

    So, basically TLP draining life out of live servers.
    They be pushing TLPs like every year too, so life being drained out of live servers every year.

    So I agree with TLP nonsense.
    If your going to do TLP, it's gotta be a big one. Like 95% of the people like whats happening, super looked forward too.

    Not just, TLPs to meet the quota that upper management put out. Lets dish out this TLP because upper management wants a TLP every year, so lets start dishing out nonsense TLP.

    Little do you know it (TLPs) is impacting live servers. draining them.

    Just observation can't type make great.... If you used the poll feature (IN GAME poll feature) asking for something to find out which market segment the current playerbase is in, I think the modders would be surprised and have to rethink things. Need to get the agenda right. Not saying, a total shift all the way, but may want to relax somethings.

    use the poll feature in game to help make decisions or gathering data.
    This game is not seeing eye to eye with the playerbase. This playerbase is a different breed. EQ isn't a cool hip game either, its a grindy got plenty of time, old school days kinda game. Really should consider another EQ game if your going to go after the cool/hip. Or slowly put in things, make changes for the better if you going for the long run in EQ.

    Also, you have EQ2 to do all those experiments, no need to do them in EQ1. Doubt EQ2 community cares about good ol days, old school ways of gaming, etc. That EQ is.

    So just know your playerbase.
    Use the IN GAME polls, people in game have plenty of time, they click everything. Your excuse should not be bad data, this community is so easy to get data from.
  11. Iven Antonius Bayle

    The vitality function of the fellowship system is broken and to complicated. With a wrong click all vitality does just poof which does happen when opting out. The experience should always flow from the higher PCs to the lower PCs when being opted in and never into the opposite direction.

    Your theory is nearly right, Bernel. Non-raid content is way to easy for fully raid geared PCs which does mean that the power gaps are generally much to large. Bazaar geared FTP PC vs raid geared AllAccess PC ! Another problem is the huge power boost of mobs and gear in expansions with an increased level cap. For a non-raid geared PC it currently is like moving at level 35 right into Karnor's Castle (lvl 40-55 mobs) without the chance to leveling up in the Dreadlands or Frontier Mountains before.
  12. Stymie Pendragon

    I believe the current state is self-fulfilling in that regard.

    People that try to comeback hit a wall around 70, and although having a sidekick is well intended, it relies on on an outside resource that is generally unavailable. Even with a sidekick program in effect how does a returning player catch up to the pack without asking someone else for help? That solution, to me, is a modified version of power leveling.

    As long as they keep live and TLP tied together, I don't see a good way of working this problem out. I have mentioned a scalable buff in the past. They can modify it as needed to help only folks on rulesets that they want to give an edge in catching up. I'm sure there are potential issues with that solution as well.

    Either way, the status quo is not conducive to growing the game in any appreciable way.
    Hobitses and Skuz like this.
  13. Ariana Augur

    EQ isn't a game that will retain new players. The changes required to bring in a new audience would probably alienate the people who are still playing. These are changes that should have been happening over time, but never did due to design philosophy. They should be focusing on current player retention for EQ1, not new player acquisition.

    High level suggestions:
    - Boxing should not be required or an optimal playstyle
    - Default state when you log into the game is solo - why can't I do anything in my default state?
    - Get rid of the button/ability bloat. Tens of thousands of AAs is a little bit ridiculous.
    - Redesign combat to something more engaging than multibind and spam it. Consider ability rotations, active tanking abilities, multiplicative combat abilities, etc.
    - Redesign classes such that they retain complexity and allow for a decent skill gap to allow for mastery of the class. Think about class balance during redesign
    - Rethink AA, consider something that scales better with levels/expansions
    - Consolidate servers as much as possible
    - When you're tempted to add another time sink, just don't do it. Instead, remove existing ones.
    - Slow down on the expansions. Focus on a solid one every couple of years. Consider WoW's content patch approach. As possible add content spanning levels, not just top end content.
    - Give players a reason not to raid log. Daily quests, incentivized alts, etc.
    Chikkin likes this.
  14. Chikkin Augur

    I had to give you a like based solely on the energy and creativity and conviction that oozes from your post.
    Brontus likes this.
  15. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    Are we talking like Walmart Greeter when we try to make Eq greet again?
    Stymie likes this.
  16. Nennius Curmudgeon

    Make Norrath Greet Again
  17. Iven Antonius Bayle

    This is my solution

    It could also not hurt to revamp the shroud system for the use of mentoring. The PC monsters are much to weak and should receive a special window with preset spells and combat abilites. I hope that this will be integrated into the new UI. The few times where I used a shroud to team up with a low level PC were unsuccessfull. I used shrouds between lvl 60-70. All classes had horrible mana and endurance regen rates and the enchanter fairy was even about being totally useless. I do remember that the haste buff was the best ability.
  18. uberkingkong Augur

    EQ needs to bring back roleplaying to make it great.

    EQ too much focus on serious groups, raids. It needs to chill, and have roleplaying stuff in it.
    Watch this video


    EQ needs to chill and focus on roleplaying aspect to make it great as it once was.

    Expansions end game only, for people 115-120 only 120-125 only.
    Thats how you make EQ not great.

    Theres more to EQ than end game only stuff and raids. They've been going with that way for past 5+ years, its nothing but milking a cash cow product is all. It is nothing to do with making EQ great as it once was again.

    Chill vibes,
    Roleplaying.
  19. Brontus EQ Player Activist


    No logic or argument expressed here on the forums or elsewhere can replace the benefit of devs playing and experiencing the game firsthand for themselves. There is no subsitute for direct, hands on experience with a product or service. Many companies now require their staff to engage with their products and services. All DoorDash employees at HQ are required to do a Dash one a month. This keeps them in touch with their front level employees and their customers.

    Would you trust a chef that doesn't eat his own food?

    Playing your own game as a dev gives you insights that would be otherwise impossible to get. These very forums prove that as none of us players here are EQ devs yet all our insight is based purely on playing the game and then expending mental energy to solve the things that we think are not working correctly. Unlike the devs who have the ability to make the game beter, we have no such opportunity. We are like people who throw pennies into a wishing well, somehow hoping our wish comes true.

    When I was starting out in the video game industry, I interviewed with Sigil and they told me that one of the requirements of working there was that all employees were expected to play Vanguard on their own time and keep a number of active characters. They did this for a reason: because they know that developers who actually play the game are better developers than those who do not. I also suspect that since most of them were ex-SOE employees, it was well known that at the time in the early 2000s devs were not required to play EQ. Brad and Jeff knew that was a problem and attempted to rectify that with this policy at their new company.

    If every DGB dev played this game daily, on both live and TLP servers, I believe the quality of the game would drastically improve. There is no subsitute for walking a mile in a man's shoes.
  20. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    Do you work for, or affiliated with, another studio or gaming company at this time?