What is Darkpaw doing to Bring New Players to EverQuest?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Brontus, Mar 17, 2022.

  1. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    Everyone has a utopic vision for this game with limited regards to the finite resources required to implement that vision. And, surely, by following their vision, the players will come and the glory days will be relived.

    One person wants a perfect TLP ruleset.

    A second wants a single player friendly game.

    A third wants a brand new tutorial zone with all the bells and whistles.

    A fourth wants 12 raids with each expansion.

    A fifth wants a massive expansion with new race, new class, and new epics.

    A few will want EverQuest 3 in the latest and greatest engine.

    Some will even say, "Find an angel investor and do all of the above."

    The fact that the OP pointed out the graphics of rusty weapons highlights the sort of idiosyncratic (peculiar) dissonance within the community.

    Edit: I have noticed a spike in TLP players posting on the Veteran's Lounge which lends credence to the idea that these types of threads and posts are yearning for a (real or fictitious) gloried past. I suspect the progress - or lack thereof - of other MMO vaporware is not helping their itch so the EQ forums becomes a de facto pressure relief valve for alternative venting and theory-crafting.
  2. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Outside the scope of this thread? That seems to be what you are focused on.
  3. Dre. Altoholic

    No, my proposal was entirely about helping new players - not about what you think other people might want if there's actually a limit to the number of servers the game can have.
  4. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    Making a new server with very little population does nothing to help new players as should be seen from the fact that new and returning players are pretty much always directed to the highest population live servers or a TLP server. There is nothing served by directing them to a server with very little population that is level capped at 70.
  5. Dre. Altoholic

    You have already made this argument. If there is a record for sounding like a broken record, you've broken it.
  6. Xyphen Maximum Augur

    You're right about one thing -- you definitely sound like a bunch of kids. I don't play on a TLP, though (hence my sig).

    Rizlona (and maybe others) allow unlimited accounts per computer. I don't see much F2P about Live aside from the ability to login. My enchanter can't use any of the gear or augs he has, can't sell in bazaar, can't activate any mercenaries (aka can't rez myself), can't purchase any more AA.

    How many Terror of Luclin group missions are there? 4. How many raids are spinoffs of those missions? 4
    How many Claws of Veeshan group missions are there? 4. How many raids are spinoffs of those missions? 4
    How many Torment of Velious group missions are there? 4. How many raids are spinoffs of those missions? 4

    I'm sorry you feel threatened by negative opinions of a (segment of) game you play. That has to be rough.
  7. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    EverQuest's F2P is very generous for a triple A MMO title.

    WoW only lets you play up to level 20.

    FF14 only lets you play up to level 60.

    EverQuest F2P Benefits:

    • EverQuest unlocks a expansion for free every year.
    • EverQuest offers Tier 1 F2P useable gear and spells/discs.
    • EverQuest does not have an anti-box policy or code for Live.
    I actually suspect EQ's boxing playstyle enables the generous F2P model. Perhaps, the executives see All Access and expansion/marketplace revenue from multi-boxers as a fair subsidy for F2P accounts.

    Edit: If ToV unlocks this year, players will be able to play to level 115 for free.
    Celephane and CatsPaws like this.
  8. CatsPaws No response to your post cause your on ignore

    Perhaps your enchanter needs to check this out for F2P enlightenment
    http://eqshadowknight.net/showthread.php?p=229070

    Your Enchanter may also want to activate a merc if it needs a rez. Not sure why you cannot activate a merc? My F2P have mercs that rez.

    But I am usually using Token of Resurrection since we are in battle and mercs are finicky about battle rez. So my Ranger or whoever throws one out using Tokens.

    You can purchase more AA - they have a feature in the marketplace and while it is not very cost effective there is also the option to Auto Grant here and there by paying for one month.

    Like they say, no one would buy the cow if they give the milk away for free. :D
  9. Xyphen Maximum Augur

    Let me clarify my OP. I'm not criticizing F2P's offering as a whole -- I'm responding to the title of this thread, which is "What is Darkpaw Doing to Bring New Players to EverQuest". Since this is posted in Veteran's Lounge I'm assuming the OP is asking what DPG is doing to bring people to Live and not TLPs (else it would be posted there instead).

    My argument is that Live is poor value for a new player. It just has archaic concepts and convoluted systems relative to the simplicity and accessibility of TLPs and newer MMOs.

    If DPG wanted to make Live appealing for new players, I would start with:

    1. Heavily discount additional xpac purchases and/or monthly fees for alt accounts
    2. Add an LFR tool so non-guilded players even have a chance to raid
    3. Collapse the number of abilities/spells down into a succinct group. Classes don't need 40+ abilities to click. Ideally to a number that could be keybound w/o needing to click.
    4. Level squish and AA squish
    5. Get rid of all the abandoned systems and things they stopped maintaining. Pretty sure no one is using that built-in MP3 player.

    It's because he used to be active and his mercs are J5. Regardless, I only logged him in to attempt to enchant restless velium (which it says I can't do without buying Terror of Luclin).
  10. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    You sound like a broken record with the claims that a level 70 capped server is going to help new and returning players with false claims that people would want to go to it over existing servers with higher player bases or their existing characters. There is plenty of evidence that a new live server will end up being a dead server based on existing servers.
  11. NecroDotty New Member

    Restless velium is from cov expansion.
  12. Sissruukk Rogue One

    I have seen some new people come in. But they usually leave within a month or two. The main culprit of this is a lot of us want to be nice and help out and think that by PLing the new people and helping with gear is enough. But little time is spent in actually teaching the new people (or even returning players) how to play their characters. We churn them through the levels and gear, then dump them out and say, "Here you go, have fun!" The other thing that is bad about this system of helping is that because they were hand-held from the start, they expect it to be the norm. I am not saying to not do this, I am just pointing out that PLing without instruction hinders more than helps.

    There needs to be a better way to guide new/returning players on how to play their class. And play it at 100+, because that is when the abilities and spells get repetitive.
    Velisaris_MS, Nennius and Dre. like this.
  13. Velisaris_MS Augur

    This is the problem in a nutshell.

    When there's a new (or even returning) player added to the guild, I do everything I can to help them level and explain as much as I can...because outside of the guild, they're not going to get ANY help whatsoever. I'm not gonna lie...I get burned out after a few days of helping them because there's just SO MUCH about the game that needs to be explained...stuff that veteran players know by heart and are just instinctive at this point.

    It shouldn't be all on the players to teach new people. Daybreak needs to do something to help.
  14. Bernel Augur

    Unless EQ has some massive changes to simplify gameplay, this kind of "hard mode" filtering of newbies is probably okay. There is a never-ending list of hard mode things to learn and figure out on your own. If a player is the type who needs hand holding or wants gaming on rails, then EQ probably isn't the game for them. Better to find that out sooner than later. Some newbies are fine with figuring stuff out and will research and experiment to get stuff done. That's the kind of newbies that will fit in with EQ. However, those kinds of newbies are hard to find. It would take targeted and costly marketing to find them and get them into the game. A generic "Get Newbies into EQ" campaign is going to scoop up a wide range of newbies who aren't necessarily going to have the personality or desire to figure out how to play EQ.

    Certainly there are many things they can do to help newbies, but it should be to help the kinds of newbies who will fit in with EQ. There are many other games better suited for players who prefer a more casual and straightforward game (e.g. WoW). It's probably not worth trying to make EQ a game for generic newbies since it would likely take away a lot of the "special charm" EQ has. I see a lot of usefulness in doing stuff like helping returning players figure out all the new stuff added since they last left so they can quickly get back into the game. But I'm not so sure there's a justified payoff for making the game more conducive for WoW-like players.
  15. Sissruukk Rogue One

    I don't think it is a matter of filtering out noobs, it is more the system we players have set up to help others, and that is by primarily PLing and gearing. But this sets up some high expectations for the noobie or returning player.

    1) PLing requires a person or persons doing the grind for you.
    2) PLing means you are in groups, not seeking out a group.
    3) Getting geared out by others shows you don't have to work for it.

    So this sets up the expectations that someone is going to do the work for you, you are always going to have a group, and you don't need to do anything for gear. On top of that, there was no real instruction on how to play your character. When you get done with the PL and gear, we pretty much send you on your way to the cold, hard world of EQ. There are hardly any groups, even in guilds, because we go back to our cliques once done PLing someone, and no one takes the time to take someone under their wing to show them how to play their toon, or even point them to the right resources beyond "google it."

    *Raises hand* I am guilty of all the above. Many of us are. But I think from the PLer's point of view, we have done it so many times, tried to go above and beyond for a new or returning player, only to have that investment leave in a month or two, that we have burned ourselves out on properly helping others. It is time consuming. Heck, it takes over an hour for me to get someone set up in the guild hall with anchors, showing them the guild lobby and how that works, and just explaining the basics.

    So, what is the answer? I don't know. I am certainly not going to tell people to stop helping others, nor will I stop helping others. I just think, like Velisaris said, DPG could give us a hand, even if it is a little one. Perhaps they have something in the works for the level increase on the Heroic Character beyond questing to get a J5 merc. Perhaps an instance like Gloomingdeep that can cover most of the basics (movement, questing, etc. that is covered in Gloomingdeep).
  16. Dre. Altoholic

    Agreed. It has always taken a degree of masochism to succeed in EQ. What's bizarre to me is the vocal minority of the player community who prefer the game remain unfriendly to new players, rather than entertain ideas about change for the better.
    There has been no shortage of fantastic ideas in this forum. Growing the playerbase doesn't seem to be a priority for those-in-charge however.
  17. Hekkthebank Now I am become Death, the destroyer of worlds

    I hear that darkpaw only listens to Waring McDonalds and Skuz.
  18. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    They listen to you too Hekk
  19. Velisaris_MS Augur

    Because it's easier and cheaper to spew out a couple of new TLPs every year to retain the current crop of 20+ year players than it is to go out and try to cultivate the next generation of 20+ year players.
    Dre. likes this.
  20. Kindertime Journeyman

    I shroud to help new players. I suggest everyone else do the same. PL people needs to stop.
    I know it would make a lot of people mad. The fact that a lvl 120 player can group with a leel 90 player makes zero sense. The grouping leveling restriction needs to be moved to 10+1 after level 100 and if that's to hard of a change to make, then make it universal.

    My apologies to the PL lovers.