Review of TOL expansion

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Fian, Dec 11, 2021.

  1. I_Love_My_Bandwidth Mercslayer

    So suddenly disagreement with Skuz = lack of understanding? Sadly, the false pretense on which you support this argument is the problem. Anyone who disagrees with Skuz doesn't understand Skuz. What a farce.

    Lack of empathy is what I would say. I love questing. I love RPing. I don't skip the text and I don't ignore the lore. But I bet you do - and you're worse off for it.
  2. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I support the option of grinding because there is not an "active play" alternative for a player who wishes to catch up that cannot find groups.

    How did that suddenly mean I hate questing, or Roleplaying?

    That kind of either/or statement shows a very black & white way of thinking that does not lead to a productive discourse at all.

    I actually love questing, I love the Lore of EQ that comes from the quests & progression system but in EQ that means having access to a group, or being a fully self-sufficient boxer because unless you have friends at your level, or within XP range (any lightbulbs switching on yet?) you cannot do those quests at the level they were designed for, you have to (and this point should be hammered home) out-level those quests....

    ...how do you outlevel them?

    ...think on it for a few moments before replying.

    I am, or at least was, a mostly self-sufficient boxer, I was working on levelling my 4th box so I could have a real tank instead fo a merc tank after running into issues with the merc tank one too many times.

    I am cursed with the ability to see things from other people's point of view.

    I like the XP ToV missions gave, but why did that mean mob xp had to be so completely gutted & hurt casuals who enjoyed the grinder playstyle by making thier method of gaining XP so much more onerous?

    Good XP Quests & good mob xp should co-exist yet somehow everyone seems to think they no longer can & are willing to throw around pointless accusations to support the new direction, nobody who wants to grind wants to destroy the ToV /ToL quest xp, yet so many act as if that's what they want when it isn't.

    Just because I want EQ to step back to when it was a sand-park does not mean I also want to dismantle the progression system I would rather there were far more than questing & mob killing that granted XP....

    In New World for all of its flaws it actually rewards xp for pretty much every activity that exists

    gather a tradeskill material node....get xp
    craft an item....get xp
    kill a mob....get xp
    complete a quest...get xp
    run a dungeon...get xp
    do pvp...get xp

    I would love it if EQ broadened the XP-gain avenues to a broader range of activities...not less.
    Skrab and Velisaris_MS like this.
  3. Skrab East Cabilis #1 Realtor

    Krono.
    Vumad and MageGuy like this.
  4. Kazint Augur

    If you think Gribble grinding was good xp then we're experiencing the game very differently.
  5. Alnitak Augur

    Ok, please teach me, where else a group of 95-100's can get 60% of the level in 45 minutes of playtime? I am genuinely interested, i have a couple alts to PL.

    Also, if you remember - when RoS was released they've had that disaster with incorrect scaling of HA's, when Gribble missions were a death trap for a group of 105's for about a week or two, and then it was tuned down to the current scale. And while CoTF was current, Gribble was easier than it is now and gave slightly more experience.

    Personally, I do not like Gribble missions at all, but I do those under Lesson when I PL my alts. I also try to check if Clayton Teek gives out daily task in Dead Hills, so I run a combo: Clayton task, pop the Lesson just before the finish, then rush through all 3 Gribbles before Lesson expires. I gives good 75-80 % of a level at 100 or so. These days I do it with just a single lvl 115 toon, and in-era it would take a good group, but it was doable nonetheless.

    I have no idea where a group of 100's can get better experience than that in CoTF.
  6. MustardonWatermelon Elder

    I didn't realize how cool the shadow ornament was. Is that not able to be obtained anymore?
  7. Ravanta Suffer Augur


    Just wanted to tell you that I love your freudian typo.
  8. Szilent Augur

    Preorder bonus, gone forever
  9. Treage_Imminent Elder

    My take on the change from mainly grinding to predominantly group quest experience for leveling is that it's short sighted. Returning players are at a real disadvantage. These are just my opinions, and I know many won't share them.

    Like many, I came back to EQ after having left during PoP. I restarted during TBM and mostly moloed to 105 towards the end of EoK on the FV server. I ended up taking a break around RoS launch due to a number of factors. Reviews of that expansion didn't sound like something I would enjoy since much of it was locked behind group progression, so I didn't buy or play it.

    After I ran Splitpaw dry of exp at 70ish, I gained a few more levels and then mostly leveled using Gribbles. Everything else seemed to be either too hard for a pittance of exp, or it required an impossible to find group. Also, the mobs doubled in dps (hit like trucks) versus anything I played prior, which I wasn't prepared for even with max level gear as a mage. I really enjoy the gameplay in the 1-70ish levels. Just the right amount of abilities and challenge for me. :)

    So now if I want to re-enter the game I am left with a couple of options that have left me choosing, "None of the above" as Brewster would say.

    As far as I can tell at 105, I can pay for a large number of task adds, pay for a power level, join a family guild and hope for some kind people to carry me, or mindlessly play the mobile game that isn't actually mobile. None of those options teach me how to play my class btw. Ohh, and grind mobs for a ludicrously low fraction of a percent per kill. As they iterate on this design it makes returning harder for people in my position since the gap keeps widening with no end in sight.

    My opinion is that they need to address this sooner rather than later. A lot of time has already been lost. A somewhat simple solution is a scaling buff that is re-applied upon death. They can decide when, or if, it's applied, and how much strength to give based on server rules or player level versus current max. It could be adjusted as they see fit as a single "knob" to turn.

    I don't dislike the idea of a side kick type system either, but it sounds more complex to implement compared to what I'm proposing. I'm probably wrong about all of this though. /shrug
  10. Fian Augur

    I have a warrior friend who doesn't use Overseer at all. After completing all quests and missions in TOL he was 118 and I think about 10% away from 119. Not sure what point that proves, but gives some raw data on what questing alone will get you.
  11. demi Augur

    it proves he still has a lil over a full lvl to be max .. and at .01% per kill grinding (sense he doesn't use overseer) would take a freakin long time
  12. Treage_Imminent Elder

    The point I was alluding to is, what do you think would be the case if your friend had taken a break and came back 2 years after the expansion launched? Also, what if his former friends were no longer playing, or his guild had been disbanded?

    Both scenarios are quite common, and molo isn't normally an option for many of the challenges designed for a 6 person group.

    Obviously, it would be more difficult to complete those same missions and quests once the max level players had moved on. That’s been the case for a while now for returning and new players. Slow grinding and Overseer are pretty much the accepted options other than asking for help from the server community that's now working on new, higher level activities. Having friends or a guild is the way to go, but it's not always possible.

    Unlike some game developers, the EQ team seems to keep their finger on the pulse, and I hope they're aware of the issues that I and others have been talking about. Spending some time lowering the barrier of entry/re-entry so that more fans of the game return sounds worthy of the resource costs to me.:)
  13. MageGuy MageGuy

    aye aye, and Beta reward too, which is super cool. thx devs.
  14. Szilent Augur

    don't believe beta reward's been identified or distributed yet

    I think a number of participants would be happy with a second copy of Shadow Sword Ornament :p
  15. MageGuy MageGuy

    Well, they've made it to my 7 toons. Go take peek :)
  16. Szilent Augur

    ah I see. because different sources, they're listed separately instead of as qty:2
    MageGuy likes this.
  17. Windance Augur

    I just finished up Basilica of Adumbration and have to say I have very mixed feels.

    - The zone is really nicely done and it was a pleasure to explore.

    - The portal pads where you "jump" over and get "ported" to the side rooms.... where horrible to do. At one point the party got split up with one person floating down to the ground level before getting ported to a spot and we ended up having agro on 3 different floors.
  18. Vizier Augur

    The person in your scenario is expected to LF guild the moment they log in. It will not take long, the servers are active. Once guilded he is expected to Overseer and taskadd his way to usefulness and loot the myriad of rots that will be upgrades.

    To me the above scenario is horrifying. I like to do things for myself and have my own adventures camping gear while leveling up. Sadly, that aspect of the game has been obsoleted by idle mechanics and trivial content design. I'm skipping this expansion. Hopefully things will be better next year.
    Treage_Imminent likes this.
  19. Skrab East Cabilis #1 Realtor

    Overseer wouldn’t be so bad, if it was for mobile. Spend some idle time checking Overseer and stay engaged with EQ, while you’re away is a good philosophy.

    They whiffed hard on not getting LoN out to mobile platforms, too.
    Treage_Imminent, Vumad and Fenthen like this.
  20. Corwyhn Lionheart Guild Leader, Lions of the Heart

    Most folks dont want to spend their time experiencing all the content alone. And getting through ToV COv And ToL alone is probably zero fun also.

    Plus the ONLY way many of them finish ToV CoV and ToL is waiting for someone, anyone to give them a task add. They never really experience the content so your point is what?
    Treage_Imminent and Skuz like this.