Overseer Elite Agents change?

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Bobokin, Dec 10, 2021.

  1. Bobokin Augur

    Omission of key facts to make it sound simple is implying that it was "simple." If that is not so, you would not have had to come back and add those facts to make a point which actually supported my premise.

    I was wondering how long it would take for someone to play the "You just want it easy" card. You win a cookie. I always advocate for casual players. I am not the only player that believes this is a problem with the enjoyment of the game.

    This isn't about easy mode, it is about time. I did not ask for elite agent selection. I did not ask that less than 27 commons be needed for one elite. I did not ask for the randomness of any other level be changed. All I asked for is that elites be exclusive - like they already do in other areas of the game.

    If we are being logical about this, ALL agents that cannot be used more than once should not be able to be recruited more than once. How could I recruit two of a rare or elite agent if there is only one of them? is one an imposter? Is one a Doppelganger? I could ask for total exclusivity, but I haven't.

    If the premise behind overseer was to help casual or returning players catch up, then making this change should not be a problem. If it was added to give Everquest a money making card game on the side, then it will be dismissed outright. Since Everquest relies on loot boxes and now "pay to win" perks to generate income, I suspect the latter is the case. Be careful what you disagree with because the slippery slope has been buttered, and this game could slide into the abyss.

    Are you?
    Knighted likes this.
  2. Maedhros High King

    You asked for duplicate elite agents to not happen anymore. which means the elite echo is gone, which means you want to take away the ability to downgrade a duplicate elite into 2 rares which I have done countless times. That is what I demonstrated. You want to change the game to suit you better without acknowledging that the very change would hurt other peoples play strategy.
    Velisaris_MS likes this.
  3. Inga Elder

    I think the odds of doing what you stated are about 0.0000578, so 1/17300. It is low, but not too low for EQ RNG.

    The only way to avoid this is stockpiling duplicate agents before new ones are added.

    Uncommon is harder for me as there are more agents and the new ones are all non-Iconic. My main account has 3+ new common/uncommon agents, except for 1 Stalking Fury.
  4. Kalvenie Elder

    You might already have them. They don't appear at the top in the Elite list on the Agents tab... I have them - had to scroll down to see them...
    Knighted, Bobokin and Maedhros like this.
  5. Bobokin Augur

    Good call. Both accounts do have Avatar of Bristlebane, so that is 11/14.
    Knighted and Kalvenie like this.
  6. Bobokin Augur

    Why does that matter?

    If you take three rares to make an elite, and you retire the elite, you get two rares.

    If you take three rares and retire them, you get six uncommons, and they make two rares.

    Either way, you receive two rares.
    Knighted likes this.
  7. Maedhros High King

    Because its about quantity of chances to get the agents youre looking for.
    Is there some kind of bizarre world that you live in that you think you will be totally complete with Rare agents by the time you start working on elites?
    I have finished elites way before I finished rares, uncommons and commons on both the initial release and the update to overseer.
    Its ok if you don't understand why, you don't need to.
    What matters is that the change you are asking for negatively affect anyone who has more than the most basic understanding of how upgrading and downgrading agents work.
  8. Bobokin Augur

    The quantity of chances are exactly the same.

    Yes, it is a bizarre world where math actually counts.

    OK, and how is that relevant? If you have three rare duplicates, you can get two other rare chances by making them elite and retiring that elite or retiring the rares and making two more rares with the uncommons. It doesn't matter how you get there; you still get the exact same result.

    There is only one person here who doesn't understand here, and that is you. I even gave you the math, and you still can't figure it out. Here is another opportunity for you.

    It takes three rares to make an elite. A retirement of that elite gives you two rares.

    It takes three rare retirements to make six uncommons. It takes six uncommons to make two rares.

    If you have three extra rares, you can get two other rare chances by going up or going down. It doesn't make a difference at all which you choose. The retirements math works at all rarity levels the same because it must do so to avoid players gaming the retirements system.

    If you have all of your elite agents, why are you making more elite agents? Do you get an inordinary number of elite agent recruitment tasks? Even then, under my proposal, you could retire one elite agent and know you would get it back upon being granted the reward.

    Why don't you run through some examples, and then show us exactly how it will negatively affect anyone in any way. Don't just tell us; show us.
    Knighted likes this.
  9. Maedhros High King

    OMFG you are a lost cause man. I have given examples.
    In your argument, the only way to get rare agents is by combining 3 uncommons.
    Your ridiculous request was to make it impossible to get duplicate elite agents. Which means there are no more elite agent echos and no way to downgrade a duplicate elite into 2 rares.
    Holy hell man this is my last post.
    Congrats on dumbest thread of 2021.
  10. Bobokin Augur

    No, I just proved that combining uncommons has the same outcome as retiring an elite.

    Again, in what specific circumstance would you need to to that if elites were exclusive? I don't think you understand the math of this, and that is hanging you on this one point.

    You are digging deeper and deeper into the rabbit hole of irony.

    Why would you want duplicate elite agents once you had them all? Before you answer that, please tell us how you are going to get these duplicate elite agents. If you are not getting them from either converting three rares or completing an elite agent recruitment task, which I have already covered in detail, where are you getting them that changes the math?

    There would be elite agent echos. You would rarely need them, but you could still get them in the way I stated above.
    Knighted likes this.
  11. Maedhros High King

    Ok last try.
    I will use small words and keep it really simple like a children's story book.
    There was once an Everquest player that was trying to collect all the agents in Overseer.
    The EQ player, lets call him Maedhros, had wonderful luck with RNG when it came to collecting Elite agents and got them done pretty quickly.
    Unfortunately, Maedhros did not have very good luck with RNG trying to get his rare agent collection.
    He knew that he could combine 3 uncommon agents to make 1 rare agent, but Maedhros also knew a secret.
    Maedhros knew that in the process of trying to get his rare agents, he was ending up with a bunch of duplicate agents that didnt do him much good. The secret Maedhros knew, was that he could combine 3 rare agents to make 1 elite agent.
    Why would he do that you ask? Why so he could then retire the duplicate elite agent and use the echo to obtain 2 more rare agents, giving him 2 more chances with RNG to get the rare agents that he was still missing.
    Maedhros was smart and did this to give him more quantity of chances to get the agents he was missing, and because he was generous, he told other people the secret so they would have better results in their Overseer collections.
    The end.
    tanith likes this.
  12. Filter Augur

    omg that is funny. Thank you sir.
  13. Bobokin Augur

    Little Maedhros fumed and fumed when he was told that he could get those same two rares by retiring the same three duplicate rares he was going to use to create one elite for six uncommons and converting those into rares. He hustled and he bustled. He thought others dumb because he knew better, and his way must be the only way, but little Maedhros could not figure out that what he knew was not a secret, and in the end, it wasn't even needed for him to complete his task.

    Poor little Maedhros.
    Knighted likes this.
  14. Bobokin Augur

    3 Rare > 1 Elite > 2 Rare

    3 Rare > 6 Uncommon > 2 Rare

    Either way, you get the TWO RARE that you want!
    Knighted likes this.
  15. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    You can only do that assuming you already have all the uncommon agents. If you don't have all of the uncommon agents and don't get 6 dupes from the down conversion you won't get 2 rare agents back.

    I am also guessing the overseer xp rewards scale based on rarity and it wouldn't surprise me if a single elite gave more then 3 rare.

    As a side note why stop with no duplicate elites? Why not make the same change for all the iconic agents that can only have a single one in use.
  16. Bobokin Augur

    Wouldn't you want the uncommon agents that are not dupes? It isn't like getting uncommon agent dupes is difficult.

    A single elite always give two rares. Otherwise, the system could be gamed.

    I mentioned that in a post above. They could, but there is far less risk/reward for iconic uncommons, and even rares, than elites. Elite agents require 27 common agents just to take a hack at one. If you get one you don't have at random, that is not a big ask. Your question is a big ask. I am sure they wouldn't want it to be that easy.
  17. Waring_McMarrin Augur

    I would want to get those from common conversions as getting a common isn't that hard.

    A single elite can give 2 rares or it can give you xp in any of the overseer quest categories. Granted you will likely want the 2 rares but if you have all the agents and have not maxed all the categories it could be worth it.


    It is no different then asking that for the elite agents. It is expected that you will get duplicates the only question is how hard should it be expected to get the last couple of agents.
  18. Maedhros High King

    I am not contesting if there are other ways to do something, that was never the question.
    I would also tell you that there are already ways to get all the elite agents so just do that and quit whining.
  19. Bobokin Augur

    You certainly did contest that there were other ways to do it because you whined about it time after time and then made up a childish sarcastic story. Did you finally figure the math out?

    If you have nothing to add that is constructive, why are you still here?.
  20. Bobokin Augur

    Then do that and use them for rares. If a driver is at a "T" in the road, and the driver can turn left or right, does the driver complain because he wants to turn right most of the time, or is the driver happy when he is allowed to turn left?

    Yes, retirements can give experience too, but that is not what we are talking about. In any case, if your elites are full, you could retire one and know you will get it back if they are exclusive. There would be no change there except the order. That whole argument is moot.

    It is different because neither 3 nor 9 equal 27.
    Knighted likes this.