Shadows of Luclin, 3rd expansion. It had zones for early/midgame such as Shadow Haven, Jaggedpine Forest, Tenebrous Mountains, Scarlet Desert, Marus Seru. So many to list all. Hopefully there will be zones designed for early and midgame in Terror of Luclin for newbies and returning players!
SoL had content at the levels the majority of the player base were at the time of release, ToL has content at the levels the majority of the current player base is.
Oh so this expansion is just for current players? Nothing for returners and newbies? Oh ok gotcha. I'll let my friends know they gotta grind 60 levels if they want to even see anything of this expansion. So no need for them to return because nothing to help them out. No need to buy the expansion because 0 things for new/mid level player zones. Gotcha I thought this would be a classical expansion, you know where they give zones for people starting out and at mid game, just like the original Luclin expansion did. But this expansion has 0 things for starting out, returners. I gotcha, so no incentives for them to come back. They'll have to grind 60 levels by their lonesome, which no one wants to do to catchup in content that was designed for groups, and the end game players at the time (ex. VoA, is for people who just finished HoT and group game, not some molo'er with bits and pieces of gear) I gotcha. ToL, don't buy it because it offers NOTHING for us under lvl 110. TOL is not an expansion for people returning or want to start and give EQ a try. So no reason to buy it. Gotcha Greedy end game players, want another expansion with 100% of the zones designed for them, just like the trend has been for over a decade. No zones for returners/mid gamers, it's all zones for 100% for greedy end gamers.
It probably a better use of resources to focus on existing players than to try and woo new/returning players. With limited developer time, keeping the existing player base engaged is more cost efficient.
There's like 27 previous expansions for newbies and returning players to go through. And current player base > returning/newbies. Catering to a new crowd and letting your current player base (which is the majority of the players) is a horrible business model to follow. TLPs are available and recommended for new/returning players, so that way you can play and catch up and continue to play in "current content" as expansions release over time. The old Shadows of Luclin expansion still exists and has things for players just starting out and returning. There's nothing stopping you from going through that expansion/zones.
Yes, you guys are missing the point HoT end game only content 100% end gamers zones VoA end game only content 100% end gamers zones .... TBL end game only content 100% end gamers zones TOV end game only content 100% end gamers zone CoV end game only content 100% end gamers zone Fast forward to CLASSIC EXPANSIONS. Oow, there is zones not for end gamers, ex. Dranik Scar NOT 100% end game content Luclin, there is zones not for end gamers, ex. Paladual Caverns NOT 100% end game content TBL??? It was designed for people who were end game RoS going into and playing it. NOT a molo'er 5 years later trying to do content designed for END GAMERS on RoS moving onto the next 100% end game expansion. An expansion 100% end game, next 100% end game, next 100% end game. Is not an expansion for returners. Those are just end game content that was not meant to be MOLO'ed VoA??? NOTHING for returners. Yes its old, outdated, but is it for returners??? NOPE, that was for end gamers HoT. So don't go around telling me 27 expansions worth, only the first 14, which was since 2007, had mid/newbie zones in them. 14, yes FOURTEEN YEARS later, zero catchup. Every expansion since 2007 has had ZERO PERCENT mid/newbie level zones. Wondering why no growth? Because there is ZERO incentives for someone to return or to give this game a try. 100% content for greedy end gamers. Oh no 1 zone for newbies/midgame? Unacceptable, have to have 100% of everything for us, end gamer greed. They don't care about growth, its all about sustaining and if you leave you leave. Slow death. Been over a decade, make some newbie/midgame ZONES. Zero NEW midgame/newbie zones, and 120 levels to grind? That'll be a long time. Don't expect new growth because aint none of them going to pay $$$ for an expansion they'll never see. They make expansion 100% for sustaining aka 100% for end gamers. Don't expect new faces, people returning. You made ZERO effort to bring them back with the expansion, that means ZERO people coming back or trying the game.
Expansions that did have "mid-game" content(relative to release date): RoK(1+) SoL(1+) PoP(46+) LoY(46+) LDoN(20+) Omens(46+) TSS(1+) CotF(75+) TBM(scaling is broken currently)(75+) Thats it, (I think) If you consider "mid-game" as 15-20 levels below "then current" max. You are absolutely correct that ToL offers nothing for the mid-level returnee. Someone who is 15-20 levels behind, will have many expansions that will feel new to him.
Time Locked Progression servers attract returning players, and even get some new players too. I highly doubt the amount of new / returning players Live would attract is more than TLPs. I also doubt that it would bring in more Live subs than would be lost by focusing on catch up content as opposed to end game content. It just makes more business sense to spend limited dev time on new expansions that keep your current subs happy and let the TLPs sweep in the new / returning crowd.
I have come back in 2017 to the date and made my first comeback toon on live server and started relearning the game in Gloomingdeep Mines. Not TLP, not FV, just good old BB server. And I was pleasantly surprised how much effort EQ team invested in making my return enjoyable: noobie gear, fast-leveling zones, mercenaries, all the bells and wistles. And I've enjoyed levelig up to 46 to go back to Plane of Innovation and have a major nostalgia moment. And by the time I have outgrown TSS and went to SoD I already had a teammate, which I just met in PoI, also a returning player, was a member of the guild, which promised me an experience bonanza once I hit 75 and can come to DH and do HA's (turned out to be false, because DPG has just nerfed HA experience before I dinged 75). I did get Paragon gear in SoD and then went to HoT and later to Argath. And at that time my team was already high enough to join guildmates on various adventures. And it all was fun through all this time. Soooooo, it is YOU who is missing the point. DPG has made alot of effort to bring me back, and I (myself) and my teammate had come back to EQ. YOUR evaluation of end-game expansions as a blocker for returnees is WRONG! Just stop it ! You have an OCD! You have posted so many times already about catching up in EQ that it is very clear that YOU have issues. You could have already leveled up to maxx since you have started complaining. Returning players are typically very experienced EQ players, and they like EQ and they know what they want from EQ. They have quit EQ all those years ago because real life happened. And now it happened again and those people can come back to the game they love. So, please, STOP asking to delute the game with lower level content. Just learn to level up through hordes of tough mobs.
Yes, exactly. Because now that CoV is over and ToL is coming out, guess what, CoV is made for returning players because CoV is 110-115 levels. That is now a "returning players" expansion since you're leveling up. Everything prior to ToL is now a catch-up expansion. Unless you are level 115 (soon to be 120), all expansions are catered to you and your "returning" play style. Let me give you a great example based off this quote. Max level is 115. Soon to be 120, as I just mentioned. VOA is max level 95. VOA is now a mid level zoned expansion. It is perfect for returning players who are leveling up and in the 90-95 level range. 90-95 is not "end game", therefor VoA is currently not "end game content" and falls under that criteria of now "for returning players". It's all part of the leveling process. Moving on from zone to zone and expansion to expansion as you move forward. ToV + CoV were for those who were going 110-115. Now ToL will be for those going from 115-120. Until you run out of zones for your level range, while leveling up, your complaint is invalid. There are 27 expansions worth of zones for returning players to visit. Every expansion that is released does not need a 1-max level spread on it....and why is that? Because you have 27 expansions worth of content to cover yourself for 1-115.
I was a returning player once. I was level 85 with some SoD raidgear/paragon, and most of the server had completed TDS at that time. I went the route of HoT, VoA, RoF for group-progression (and a few SoF-quests for fun; crystallos-key and hills of shade-quests + some deadhills). In addition, I joined "low-level" open raids on my server(mostly VoA, RoF, CotF raids). I was raid ready for TBM, when it was released, and I had a lot of fun while I was catching up! I did not once run out of content. "Returnee content" is what you want it to be!!
I mean I think it's fair not to get new "mid-tier" expansion content because DBG essentially gifts everyone older expansions as they fall into "mid-tier". Those expansions are relatively empty even when they're free, so why should DBG expect people to pay for comparable difficulty/benefit zones? I'm kind of playing devil's advocate, not sure I understand the benefit of splitting leveling routes when the mid-game is so sparsely populated as it is. To me I think they're smart to have a linear progression now, like it's the same reason Crescent reach was added & the only option for new players. Keep us casuals/lowbies all herded in the same zones.
the new expansion will be 120, so mid level is 60.. upper midlevel 80-85 or even 90? that's nearly 40 zones (the void has 5 or 6 off of it) for mid level range to come back to and enjoy, not counting RoF, HoT, or VOA zones.. there are plenty of places for mid level returning players to explore, enjoy and XP. Top end players will have? 7.
Are you guys trying to be smart with me or what. 1. Let me ask you a question Back in SoF What was considered mid game? By the way you guys are acting like smart-alecs, you'd say 40. Believe me 40 was not considered mid game back in SoF. 40 was not considered mid game. Just like 60 is not mid game, if you still 60, you aint even close to mid game yet. At least 20 more levels before you closing in on mid game. 2. Also, mindful of what your zone listing, your listing EQ in its glory days. Your not listing zones for HoT and beyond. No is complaining about 1 to 80. 3. The person talking about "I returned in TDS", that was 7 years ago, times changed. There was no decade drought of no mid/newbie level zones. 7 expansions later of no catchup its gotten worse. It may not been so bad because it was just beginning the 0% mid/newbie level zones per expansion. 4. smart-alecs again, saying "why focus on newbie/midgame", nobody said they had to focus on it, just make ONE expansion from the past decade not be 100% end gamer only. Is ONE expansion out of a decade that is 10% mid/newbie level zones too much to ask? Apparently it is with greedy end gamers wanting end game only content. Over a decade of 100% end game only. 5. Returners are fed up with progression, they did it, got the EQ out of there system, there was enough progressions happening. They want to experience whats new with EQ now. No one wants to play progression for a couple months and then watch everyone leave because its not as they remember or something else. Then come back awhile later and 'oh everyone is so far ahead, well i'll play a different game then' 6. The thing is everyone is so far ahead, you need catchup content because no one wants to play a game where everyone is at end game and they stuck early/mid game and getting to end game takes forever, not enjoyable early/mid game, mid/game designed for people at end game. VOA that was designed for people end game HoT TDS that was designed for people end game CotF EoK that was designed for people end game TBM CoV that was designed for people end game ToV ... DoN that was designed for people starting anywhere in the game TSS that was designed for people starting anywhere in the game Just because TBL is unlocked, doesn't mean thats mid game catchup content. TBL unlocked means I can play it, but its gonna be hard as because its designed for people end game RoS. A returner doesn't spend a whole year in RoS and then decides to go into TBL, they are trying to catchup to CoV, now ToL. They not gonna be fully decked RoS gear. So they all gonna get whooped by TBL content NOT DESIGNED FOR CATCHUP TDS NOT DESIGNED FOR CATCHUP/midgame TBM NOT DESIGNED FOR CATCHUP/midgame VOA NOT DESIGNED FOR CATCHUP/midgame TOV NOT DESIGNED FOR CATCHUP/midgame .. DoN DESIGNED for ANYONE/CATCHUP TSS DESIGNED for ANYONE/CATCHUP We aren't asking for content, we are asking for content for CATCHING UP. 6. Linear path theory? TSS was designed for it to be soloable to 75, it wasn't designed for linear path. Everyone goes to the zone thats best to catchup in. When you have 90 to 115 NOT DESIGNED for catchup. Theres a gap, it needs to be addressed. The early/mid/end game gap its just like salary. 70% is considered low/early 25% is considered mid 5% is considered end game So basically over a decade the developers focused (they went 100%) on end game only content, which is 5% of the potential population it could have. It's putting 100% of the eggs into the end gamers. Usually in stocks its wise to put a lot where there is potential, but not all. VoA, now its mid game, but when they made VoA, it was not designed for anything mid game, it was designed END GAME ONLY. ... So basically, its not that we want content, aka an expansion is released. Thats for free to 2 play. TSS, when you fought a named in the 60s, they felt like catchup nameds. VOA you go fight a named, did you slow it, did you mez their adds, did you do this did you do that. The named was designed for END GAMERS, not ordinary named, it has crazy mechanics feels like your at end game but your really 30 levels behind. Goto City of Mist, fight a named, back when lvl cap was 60. Its ok, just an oridinary named. Not a named designed for END GAME aka VoA, did you slow it, did you mez adds, did you do this and that, did you do this and that. These nameds are end game nameds. But this is now considered EARLY mid game today. So basically mid gamers are feeling like they at end game because the content at the mid TODAY was DESIGNED for end game. HOWEVER, theres no one around. You are not end game, you are NOT EVEN CLOSE TO END GAME, 10 expansions behind, your gear is not ready for end game (VoA is end game, but it isn't). VoA designed for people who spent a whole year in HoT, but today.... YOU didn't spend a whole year in HoT getting ready for VoA. And so on. 20 more levels of this. ALSO See the dilemma Also, people keep thinking HoT is a mid game, thats 10 expansions behind, thats not mid game. People keep brining up content before HoT, but then after HoT, they have tough time saying whats good. Uh.... after HoT? Uhhhh. Gribbles? Idk. At 85, HoT is not mid game, keep dreaming. Your a decade into dreaming. 35 levels to catchup, 10 expansions behind. Mid game is when you start to get some respect, a lvl 85, thats just some ordinary player, nothing special. So so many issues, because its been over a decade and not addressed.
1) We're not back in SoF....so that's irrelevant. We're in CoV 2) That's because there's so many zones available in those level ranges that you'd have to scroll to see those zones And that's how the game works. 90-95 is made for people who did 85-90 95-100 is made for people who did 90-95 100-105 is made for people who did 95-100 See how that works? And there's plenty of zones and expansions and options to do that. You gain levels in this game, not sure if you're aware of that. You have to complete level 1 in order to get to 2, and 2 to get to 3. It's called leveling You don't have to do the progression. God knows I've skipped most of it. But you have to go through the levels. And certain levels are made for certain zones. 1-115 there are specific zones for specific levels. Use them Quick edit: Incorrect, you can use ToV gear at 110 (TBL levels) which help trivialize this.
Here is what a "CATCHUP" is in EQ: be high enough level, so you can group with the majority of server population and get experience from adventuring. Today it is being lvl 85. You can molo yourself from 2 to 85 (as many people posted as self-example) or get a lvl 85 Heroic Character. That's it, the end of stage-setting for catching up. Now - get friends or join a guild. And enjoy "catching up" at unreal pace. Just stop dragging everybody down to the level of your own inability to find teammates. EQ is not and never was a solo game. It always did and is requiring cooperation with others.At one point or another you need a team to progress. It is possible to level up to maxx molo, but is is a very long, lonely and depressing effort. And you have already stated before - you want it done quickly. It's not gonna happen - either find a team or do it really slow. I understand your inner demons but no, you can not get what you want by whining about it over and over and OVER again. No means no.
All of those expansions are designed to be a part of a future catchup path. None of them is a "complete path" to endgame, but why is it important that the whole path is contained within a single expansion? The game has an excellent selection of content for all levels. It is true that the path is narrow at high levels(as in you can't skip ToV progression if you want 110-115 within a reasonable timeframe). If you just want to be max level as fast as possible, you should complain about Heroic upgrades not taking you high enough(a valid complaint). But I really can't comprehend it, if you claim that low/mid-levels don't have enough content. You could argue that there is not much molo-friendly content to do, as many places requires half a group to do the content at the correct level. Are you talking about people catching up alone, or as a group? TSS also required a group for many encounters...iirc. I think most people here are just confused about what you want...Why would people have a problem with catching up in the existing expansions, is it about not being quick enough? Is it that there is no efficient "molo-path"? Could it be solved by adjusting the xp-curve? or by adding higher "hotzones"? Every expansion, that raised the levelcap, had at least one easy zone where people without endgame gear could grind xp. Those zones forms a catchup path if you think about it.
