ehh i just see the other stuff repeated.. could someone repeat that instead? no want help ok... if that, or talking about or maybe ideas of whatever it is they want to see and how we can go about it, that could help someone there on Zek or others showing any support, to work on or talk about that stuff instead with their time they'd be better off working or talking about those things instead of being reminded of the others or remphasizing dev time or content or all these other stuff that won't go anywhere. multiple people know what Zek should be working on? maybe someone could make a new thread and detail it for them? or atleast ever mention it other than "they" know about it...
i don't really care about the forums, never have until some of this stuff recently was asked to look at and it might be interesting. I don't think giving indication or saying in another way, that noone cares, as that's been an accusation; helps anything... anyways, if people knew what the devs cared about or wanted to see maybe that would help those that do care about the Zek server and are talking about it now on the forums? i was recently in a rather lengthy conversation between people on discord and they said they are gonna come up with a plan and another thread they will post in several days or a week or whatever talking about another approach they also said they are no longer interested in asking for anything to be worked on now or trying to give anyone an impression they want something addressed right now and they are aware that the company already has a work cycle they are working in and don't have time and instead they are gonna come up with a document talking about a long range 1, 2 maybe 3 year out plan that they can write up and submit and ask for time some time in the future and aren't gonna try to ask for anything in the short term cause it's not worth time considering the situation they likened it to how overseer was worked on for a long time and rolled out upon near completion. so, that's where these few people driving these current items are at in thinking about it all now and they understand not to expect anything in the short term so looks like they will have a lot of time on their hands to work on other things like whatever the devs/gms want to see from zek over the coming years... no expectation in the short term they said
Zek isn't for the weak that's for sure I think if they simply put a cap on player damage, it would solve a large amount of the current issues people have with the imbalance. The same cap wizards currently hold, for example, a druid can one tick with a single dot, but wizards can't one shot nuke? It makes no sense. I don't want to see the cap removed, I want to see it added to all pvp related dmg. Wizards currently hold a 40% max damage cap, so obviously this can be done. Fights would be harder and take just a bit more skill, like old EQ "zek servers" used to be, fun times! Also, for those who come along and say pvp doesn't belong in EQ, I want to ensure you have at least experienced it, and know why you feel it doesn't belong... I'm a female in RL and I main an enchanter, so I'm not out there on Zek playing some "OP" class, and I certainly don't "wreck" anyone haha.. but I do have a great time regardless. Then again, like I said, it's not for the weak. If you take things seriously, in a video game, then by all means, stay put, on blue
What is there to experience? Zek players keep coming to the forums and tell us how broken pvp is. We keep hearing how some classes struggle while others are op and can just mass slaughter at will. I seen posts where a few classes can kill in a couple of seconds as it is and one shot people. If they are killing people with a single hit a 40% max damage cap just means it will take them 3 hits to kill instead of and for some classes that will still mean they can kill you in a couple of seconds. The problem it is seems that EQ was never really designed for true pvp especially how it is in the modern gaming world and with the size of the dev team as it is they can't support it anymore. From what I have seen most modern pvp games make tweeks to class balance monthly if not weekly in order to keep it moving smoothly as the game progresses. They tend to focus not only on unbalanced abilities themselves the players actions as well. Meaning that if one class/ability becomes overused in the game they will rebalance to help encourage other class/abilities to be used.
You just don’t understand PVP math. If you just apply a 40% damage reduction to everyone, it will make the OP classes worse and the weak classes...worse, lol. It’s so easy for the devs to fix just think about it. If you don’t believe me, we can just do some simple math with 2 fictional players: Player A and B both have 100 hps Player A does 50 damage Player B does 120 damage If we apply a broad 40% damage reduction to everyone: Player A now does 30 damage Player B now does 72 damage Boom PVP balance is fixed, just like they wanted, lol. It definitely doesn’t take balancing each class and ability across the leveling ranges that would be very time intensive, and is a struggle for PVP only games to balance.
So many things in this thread. Bottom line though: -They aren't changing damage numbers or changing how code works on Zek, absolutely for the foreseeable future. Pursuing that now is a waste of time, trust us, no offense, it just is. -They want to see some fictitious number of users regularly on Zek before they change any stance (which is basically "no soup for you"). They don't even have a specific number in mind, you can't question or bargain with them. They just think "there aren't enough, prove us wrong". If you want anything to change on Zek, you're best served trying to get more people there. As to some other things... -People talking about it being a gank fest, or woe is me my little level 2 got killed by a high level player are telling tall tales. I noted right away, they have to shroud. There is a level limit. Not as much ganking goes on there as people seem to think. I've been playing it like a ghost town live server. Not been impeded by pvpers at all. You can tell from general a community is there and coming back, small but with their own personality. -A certain S*k*xxxxxx person coming on here and going all whack job. Now is talking smack in general chat over there. As I point out in general chat from time to time, Forum Quest is it's own game, and you failed at your first attempt. Instead of now complaining, learn from your mistake. Keep on advocating for Zek, but get real y'all.
the pic below, the thread taken off of is on a site called elite gaming lounge where a complete copy of all the old archived forums are supposed to be? I haven't seen this thread but this pic i could copy, not sure if this person is agreeing with someone else or restating what someone else said prior, told me it was their doing or they made zek's pvp anounce channel happen through working with devs? atleast at some point there was a dev that had some time and worked with Zek on finding out what might best be worth the devs time. for me though, never having been interested for the forums before, i like what I am seeing here and I don't have a problem with who initiated it or viewed it as complaining but i contacted them via discord through someone else to chat a few days ago, interested to talk with em, guess he wanted to chat to anyone hahahaha, "dude i can't get on the forums, all my stuff is suspended bannerammeredhammered have you read ....." maybe i should not have, wants to talk all day this guy. anyways he gave me 3 photos of 3 forum replies so i combined them into 1 picture the best i could to do him a favor, he thinks it's his claim to fame lol, i don't know some of these ideas are decent and he said he's gonna work long with some others and for me to expect something awesome in a few weeks or so, more forums stuffs, probably cause he's banned lol, we'll see lol, not going so good so far i don't think, cool enough guy though
I don’t think you’re supposed to post on behalf of a suspended account. Plus, those screenshots are from 11 years ago. It’s time to let it go EQ moved on and is happily married to PVE. Go out and make an EQ Red emulated server and show that it can generate 20k unique users.
Sorry, a 40% damage cap wouldn't decrease anyone who can't do that type of damage. Lets use some common sense. I'm not going to get into a math/coding argument here, but you seemed to misunderstand what I was saying so I'll respond. It's a cap on damage inflicted to not allow a player to be impacted by more than 40% their health in a single shot. Be that arrow, dot, nuke, etc. Wizards (best example since this DOES exist already) can 3 shot I guess, but by that time your opponent has probably healed/recovered. I'm not sure why you would fail to see how this would be beneficial, 3 shot is a massive difference to a one shot dot tick insta death... To not be able to recover in 3 hits is a user issue, not a broken system. It does give every class a recover/counter fighting chance. There is never going to be a time that an enchanter can inflict as much damage as a ramping warrior, to expect that is ludacris. I play an enchanter, so I say this fairly. However, a druid not being able to cast a single spell and insta killing gives me a chance to utilize what skill I do have to fight back and possibly even, win I've seen enchanters get kills, it's possible, I've seen every class do so - even a lucky cleric now and then... There are some extremely skilled long time players on zek who know all the cool tricks, I admire it and try to learn from them. Many cry hacks or exploits .. in some cases it's possible but most of the time it turns out they just know their toon, they know pvp, they are skilled and utilized the tools available. But that's another story for another day !
11 years dev post linked lol, time has passed since then ? Judging by the wall of texts going on,despite a lesser aggressive tone, I would not be surprised that peanuts is Sokkon speaking of him at the third person lol.
Sure the difference between a wizard who can one shot you is significantly different from a wizard who can kill you in three shots. Mostly because that represents a difference of like two to six seconds in a fight. However, the difference between a rogue (for example) who can kill you in one shot vs a rogue that can kill you in three shots is not a significant difference if we can honestly say it is a difference at all. Melee can lay down three hits in almost no time at all. Certainly it doesn't take them so long that you could actually heal yourself before they kill you. There just isn't the time and that has nothing to do with skill. This is an example of why flat damage reduction or making it so no class can deal more than 40% of an opponents health in a single hit will not accomplish all that PVP needs to be viable. Those answers are merely Band-Aids, not only are they band aids but they're too small as well. As Dreamweaver already pointed out, people keep assuming that these things are simple fixes. Whether they assume that because it already exists or because it seems simple from their limited knowledge or experience. However, we have no evidence to support such claims. We do not have any idea what would be "easy" and what wouldn't.
[quote="FawnTem I definitely didn't say it was the fix to all fixes. Damage caps (on damage received) would make an impact, if you play on zek or experience current pvp you will know this is true. A rogue can NOT one shot. They can kill fast, for sure, but it is definitely not a one shot. A skilled rogue is deadly, and awesome. Band aids btw, do in fact help fix owies, they cover a wound so the wound can heal. Yes, it might take require some stiches, a splint, maybe even a full cast or surgery... but please toss the kids a band aid. Some people are determined to see pvp die altogether, some want to see Zek removed entirely, I'm not sure why that is. No one is making anyone play there. I do highly suggest giving it a real shot though Honestly, despite broken pvp factors it is fun and there are some amazing peeps. I saw a few comments where people are upset over zek players coming on to the forums, I didn't realize the forums were restricted to only blue server players? I know some on zek have been playing this game since launch, that would definitely make them a veteran to this game. Aren't forums for conversation and suggestions? As for damage caps - is it all that's required? Of course not, but don't silence my ask, I'm definitely open to hear further suggestions, if you have a better idea or theory please do share
Sokon, if we add up all the different forum accounts you’re posting from Zek it’s still not enough to make PVP a thing.
All I am saying is that Zek players seem to be fairly unrealistic in their assessments of what all needs to be done to fix PvP such that it is viable. Yes, people have been putting forth plenty of ideas and thats great but I am skeptical about whether those fixes even if you got them would fix PvP to the point where you all would actually be satisfied. It seems to me that the first step in getting anything done for Zek would be in you guys generating more numbers on the server. Sure there are always going to be those people who won't come because PvP is broken (and you can't get that fixed without people but they won't come without it being fixed ad nauseum) but there are other ways to get people there. I can tell you that the only times I have swapped servers (which has only happened twice outside of merges) I did so because I had friends on my destination server. Perhaps the first thing Zek players should do is start cultivating friendships outside of Zek and on the forums. I can tell you people complain about Zek players on the forums not because they are not welcome but because for the most part they have not been... the most charming players around? Making friends and changing the perception of Zek server is something that is attainable and within your power to change, maybe you should start there.
But that is not balance, that is just a blanket damage nerf and that doesn't prevent the classes with the ability to instant kill to nearly instant kill instead. With your example it just changes from 1 shot to 2 shots to kill the other player and that doesn't leave much time to respond or react. Not to mention there are classes that could use a pvp boost and not a nerf.
Thanks dreamweaver again for taking time to respond to this thread. I'm well aware they have responded to other threads. But please, let them know, we're asking again. And we'll continue to ask. Fawn Templar Thank you for your support. Fawn Bobbybick You also Bobbybick We already know they responded to other threads. What I said was, they didn't respond to THIS thread. So we're not given up that easily, we're asking again and again. I'm glad Fawn and Boobybick are the type of players that give up so easily, however we are not. We're here to fight for change, whether its liked or not. You don't see us trying to derail your blue server threads, but instead helping support them. For example: We aren't on the "Wizard's Love" thread saying. "Don't you guys get it yet. Wizards are a dead beat class, just move on and play another class. Devs have no intention of fixing that class, and not enough players that play it" Or on the CoV HA thread says, "If its to hard for you group gear characters to beat the HAs, go play an easier game like WoW" We know PvP needs a major revamp, but atm we're just asking for Band-Aids. We have some ideas we think are easy (not very time consuming) for them to implement and fix. Will it solve all the problems, no. But it will atleast be a start. As pointed out they have already capped the damage of single target nukes to a max of 40% of the targets health. We're just asking that they also implement that same cap on DoT spells as well. The same thing they have already done with single target damage spells. We understand the PvP Math perfectly, its you that fail to understand it. But we didn't post here to try to explain it to someone that wants to make comment on something he has no knowledge of . The 40% damage is based on the (target player's) health, not the damage dealt by the attacker. Its already been applied to some classes, just not all the classes. We're asking that the classes it hasn't been applied to be included to help balance it out. I'm sure it wasn't the Dev's intention at the time and we're TRYING to bring it to their attention now. Yes we already know Melee is broken as well, they can quad hit. So maybe instead of nerfing them to 40% cap, make it 10% or 15% cap, meaning there quad hits do in-between 40% to 60% total heath damage to the players target. Certain class abilities have already been nerfed altogether in PvP like Manaburn, Lifeburn, AA Snare, AA Root, and AA Dispel. Do this for all the classes like the SK Harmtouch, and the Lifeleech ability. Warriors AA Rampage. So a Warrior is able to AA Ramage an entire Raid that is raid buffed and kill everyone in the raid. Its too OP, and needs to be fixed or nerfed. We're asking that they take away the PvP rez effects they ADDED. It does nothing but lock up the character for 15 mins. While at the time, it might have made sense, today it doesn't, just hinders playtime. Remember when Wizards and Casters had to sit and open there spell book to med? Well they don't do that any longer. Removing some code that was added only to our server, doesn't seem like something that would require too much of their time. But the whole point is, we're here trying to provide FEEDBACK to the Devs. So they can maybe fix a few things. Not argue with players from blue that don't play on red. I'm glad you have good numbers on your server, but we're are not here to try to complete with your server numbers. However, atleast get it right and compare apples with apples, not apples with oranges. We have 80 MEMBERS, which play around 240 characters. Yes we do box also and we do play and pay on multiple accounts. We DON'T have just 2 guilds on ZeK either. What we have is 2 raiding guilds on Zek. There are many other guilds on ZeK, just not as big as the 2 raiding guilds. We are excited about having 80 actual members playing in our guild to Raid. I don't know, maybe that's not a big number of members for a guild on blue, but the point was, we're showing we are growing. We do have more numbers on the server, and we do have more players that want to come back and play. In fact many of our players have already left over the years because these changes weren't made. There is actually such a big support for PvP that an emulation called Rise of Zek was actually created where hundreds of players play. As a show of support about 10 months ago, we had over 100 players that play on Rise of Zek log their old toons on the ZeK server just to show DayBreak that there was an interest in PvP both on the ZeK server and in a PvP progression server. What would it take for some of these players to come back? Some of the changes we're bringing to that attention of the devs to actually be addressed. That's simply not true. 30 players came to the event, not 12. 12 players won the 1st, 2nd and 3rd prizes consisting of 100 kronos. My guild hosted the event, with Faazed donating the prizes. Again someone speaking from inexperience. It was L85 for a reason. Anyone could make a L85 Heroic character and come join in. A L85 heroic guy from one of the blue servers, actually came in second place, go figure. Other prizes including mounts, Heroic Character upgrades, CoV expansion upgrade and illusion clicks were actually rand off after the event for "anyone" that participated. BTW any character can be server transferred to ZeK for FREE. Meaning you could have gear up any L85 character on your server however you liked and transferred over to ZeK for free. We posted this event on these forums a month in advance. Even when we try to do something nice for the EQ community as a whole, you guys still rip us.
