I can't be the only one....

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Retromancer, Dec 26, 2020.

  1. Retromancer New Member

    to feel as though it's time to retire my character (I've had since 2001) and hope that after this somewhat at best, mediocre expansion and the EQ brand newly acquired by EG7,

    a new EverQuest comes out? I really don't mind even if EverQuest gets a remake starting with the original zones, I would put my monk to rest, and start reincarnate him into the new world in a jiffy.

    I know some are going to say "but,look what happen to EQNext!!", EQ next bit too much to chew, made promises that couldn't be kept, and of course the most dreaded move, was taking in all that EQ next Landmark trailblazer backer money and then poof! game is shut down while leaving a very bad taste is the mouths of many,

    if done right, making an update EQ game while keeping the core game mostly the same, and by mostly, I mean combat, spells, abilities would still be in familiar territory, while adding something new here and there, I would also remove the whole "spell / combat ranks" system as well, I always prefer to quest or take down a very formidable foe and find a rare spell drop, it makes it seem that more rewarding and worthwhile, where as the rank system, it feels like im going through my inbox spam folder.

    maybe I am just old and senile (maybe crazy?), but I truly do wish I could experience a new version of EverQuest and have that old magical feeling again at least one more time before I too end up passing over to the otherside.
  2. Lianeb Augur

    Can i have your stuff?
    Herf, Annastasya, Metanis and 4 others like this.
  3. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    This subject has been hashed out and rehashed over the years. Be prepared for all types of responses.

    I will say, from an objective standpoint, the gaming industry seems to have changed dramatically over the last 10 years or so. There's been much more focus on mobile games and "get rich quick" type of development. (The only real exceptions are flagship games for major multinational corporations such as Microsoft and Sony). You can see the struggles of substantive MMO game development in Pantheon, Ashes of Creation, and others. Other games such as Cyberpunk 2077 have received negative reviews for the lack of depth. Former devs have said that modern development of a AAA title entails between $500 million and $1 billion. (This is why I believe EG7 was willing to pony up $300 million for Daybreak Games). Therefore, the plain truth is that it is highly unlikely there will be an EQ remake.

    We can yearn for glory days but it is far better to live with forgiveness (of the past), in the moment, and with acceptance. We can hope for more reinvestment but we have to be pragmatic.
    Gyurika Godofwar and Skuz like this.
  4. Tappin Augur

    EQ2 gets more than us, but makes less. We need more development.
    Gyurika Godofwar likes this.
  5. AlmarsGuides Augur

    An Everquest remake would never work because of how toxic online communities have become since EQ's original release.

    Everyone I have talked to who played on a TLP server complains that it was, "The most toxic community I have ever seen". Only people who don't say that are usually the ones being toxic and unable to recognize they're part of the problem in my experience.

    Point is, Everquest is a game built on grouping/forming friendships and alliances etc etc. That's all impossible to do when everyone is insanely toxic. Arguably this is why boxing has become so popular in the last few years (and why I originally started boxing). I like being able to still enjoy this game without having to deal with the toxic players on a daily basis.
  6. toodlem Elder

    How many stars can I give this post? * * * * *
  7. Retromancer New Member

    I can see what you are saying with current gen games and development, but I am sure a remake for EQ couldn't possibly go in the $500mil-1Billion range, but would it really cost that much to do a remake for EQ? I mean if we look at the current subscription players or just the majority of EQ players, I am sure a remake using an older engine wouldn't cost that much since the players wouldn't care too much about how cutting edge grx are, point of reference to that statement, I have seen a video of a lone guy who re created kelethin and it looked very good, I doubt he put millions into it, a lot of time put he probably put in? no doubt, I think the most time consuming would be re-doing the code,

    I don't think I will start another TLP if they ever announce another (which I know are their cash cows), but the only way I will restart fresh would probably be on a remake if it ever happens, actually, I could be wrong, but I would think majority of TLP players would probably jump over, and EG7 would have a fresh game to work with, instead of having devs to tip toe over ancient code and make stuff work
  8. Bigstomp Augur

    Spam style ... headline. Checkmark. You win. Yes. Retire.
  9. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    The $500 million-$1 billion number comes from various former and current gaming devs Shawn Lord has interviewed on his Twitch. I believe Landmark and EQNext development cost SOE in the realm of $300 million before it was shuttered.

    Whether you go with the old engine or new engine route, the development process is much more labor and resource intensive than you think. Even current EQ1 devs scoff at mentions of separate TLP code, new epic quests, new races, or new classes for EQ1 (minus bit or coding limits).

    If you want to stay within the EQ realm and don't care for graphics, you could try Ebay for a copy of 'Champions of Norrath' (and a compatible console).

    You could also send your suggestion to the P99, TAKP, or Project EverQuest staff.

    If you want a fresh start on an MMO, your best bet is to wait around for 'Pantheon' or 'Ashes of Creation.' But you'll likely be waiting for a very long time - if at all.
    Nennius and Xianzu_Monk_Tunare like this.
  10. I_Love_My_Bandwidth Mercslayer

    Replying in your own #iquiteverquest thread?

    Classic. See you in game tomorrow.
  11. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I've watched many of those former EQ dev streams & they are very informative on how EQ got to where it is today but also on the industry in general "after EQ".

    While it is true to say that to develop a AAA MMO - with all the accoutrements of a title that has been around for 15-20 years would be very expensive & that a lot of players would have the expectations that an MMO right out the gate would have at least all of the trappings of an EQ or a WoW - as in well developed character development paths, sophisticated crafting, raiding, dungeons, a loot progression system, secondary character development paths, opportunities for different character builds etc. etc. I also think that a new MMO can "start small" getting in the basic systems at launch and a small but well designed game world and that could be done for a lot less than the 300m to 1b assumed for a AAA.

    The problem is EQ is a very well known brand within the MMO aware demographic, anything less than a AAA top of the line EQ 3 would seem like a huge let down.

    Until such times as a AAA 1bn EQ3 is feasible, if it ever is, then I think the MUCH smarter investment is revamping the existing titles. I hit on this is another post but there is so much that EQ & EQ2 can do within their games to bring them into the future kicking & screaming. And that can be done a bit at a time rather than an all-in-one-go new game costing millions approach. It isn't easy to do, but it can be done. The primary thing I think that needs to happen is getting better tools into the developers hands.

    EQ2 has better tools, faster tools, easier to use tools, that's why EQ2 pumps out more content & can do so faster with much the same number of people as EQ has (I assume) equip EQ with tools that are that good and the creation teams can also pump out content at a higher volume more quickly.
    Such tool creation is costly but it pays off long term, and there may well be a lot of preconditions to that which require changes to EQ, some of which may already have been done. EQ is being modernised in many ways, it takes time to do all the necessary groundwork behind the scenes before the customer-facing changes can go in though.

    That's where I hope the near future of Daybreak/Darkpaw lies. Ideally that revamp of EQ & maybe some revamp for EQ2 also, will pay off & strengthen the studio enough to allow it to be in the position to create the EQ3 or EQ Next the company will need to make at some point to pull in a new audience.


    A new EQ MMO is not going to come in the next 2-3 years though in my view.
  12. Benito EQ player since 2001.


    I think it is noble to want the best for EQ.

    In fairness, as an EQ2 player myself, a good amount of EQ2 players complain that their expansion is small. EQ2 is built on a much better engine and infrastructure than EQ1. EQ2 was built for the future if you will. True, though, it feels like they get more content proportionate to their population and revenue.

    Without trying to be a negative Nancy, I believe it would be very difficult for the EQ1 to grow horizontally (more features, modernization) or vertically (more content) without trade-offs - at least if they departed from the game's current development cycle. If the team works on new or better features, or modernization, they sacrifice meat-and-potatoes expansion development. If the team works on expansion development, they lack time for modernization and features. (Even if they devote time to modernization, the return on investment may be minimal; i.e. Dragon Hoard). If the team tries to expand (add devs), there is a steep learning curve due to antiquated tools and game engine (even risking critical failure). I think the game has hit a proverbial ceiling - not only code/bit-wise but also knowledge-wise.

    Additionally, the issue with piecemeal development is that support and interest can wane or plummet. Look no further than 'Pantheon', 'Ashes of Creation', or 'Star Citizen.' People complain about vaporware and infinite Alpha.

    EG7's seems more focused on LOTRO and DCUO investment. That is not to say they do not appreciate the EQ franchise. We are probably well-positioned for years of investment. (And Darkpaw Studios is hiring additional employees). Even with better known titles such as WoW and Final Fantasy in a stronger market position, it seems that most companies don't want to stomach redevelopment. The market is much more focused on "get rich quick" and "bang for your buck" type of development.

    All things considered, EQ1 is doing good for its age.
  13. Xianzu_Monk_Tunare Augur

    Not exactly sure why they would be focused on either of those; as according to the released financials both are less profitable than EQ.
    Andarriel likes this.
  14. Svann2 The Magnificent

    I went back and tried eq2 while i was bored in the summer, and its nothing like I remember. The graphics seem so cheap and the movement seems off. Did they change it radically in the last 10 years?
    Yinla likes this.
  15. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    DCUO has a far bigger revenue per year than EQ has so it can afford to run at a lower level of profitability. The smaller the game is the higher the profitability needs to be for it to still be worth investing in the future of but so long as it turns a profit the game is stable.

    Higher margin of profitability of course is always desirable, but scale plays a factor.

    As an extreme example Amazon for years ran at a very tiny % of annual profit as it used most of the profit as reinvestment and secured fast growth but the sheer scale of Amazon's turnover meant that their low profit margin was still a staggering amount of money.
  16. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    I believe EG7 is citing the release of Lord of the Rings and DC Comics related movies and television series as reasons for investment. Daybreak Games also possesses a Marvel license.
  17. Andarriel Everquest player since 2000

    I wish they kill off eq2 and just concentrate on eq1! and while there at it no more tlp servers!

    Andarriel
  18. Svann2 The Magnificent

    And dont get me started on dragon hoard!!1
  19. Vaeeldar Augur

    TLP is a cash cow for them - I’ve never lasted more than 3 weeks on one personally but as long as they are the company money I’m all for it, it increases funds for eq overall.
  20. Metanis Bad Company

    To the OP. There are many ways to rekindle your appreciation for EQ. I suggest you discover what passes for TV in today's current culture! You'll return to EQ quickly! For all it's flaws and blemishes, EQ remains an astounding entertainment value!
    Sissruukk and Skuz like this.