No, i don't want exact numbers. No, i don't' want to min/max everything, include haste, stats, etc. What I want to do is search for a list of weapons that give me a dmg / delay. Then, i want to know which ones to choose, from a keyboard, without going in game. I understand the rough formula is dmg*2+dmg bonus/delay for primary, and offhadn is dmg*2/delay then times like .63 to combine the two weapons for a theorital dps. But, what I don't know is the dmg bonus, allakazahm doesn't give me that info at my level. For all intensive purposes, for straight comparing weapons (again, i'm not talking end game, i'm talking comparing something like jade mace vs lamentation and similar), what formula should I be using, knowing that I will not know what the true dmg bonus is for my level? End goal is to basically find best, affordable weapons for leveling, that's about it!
With normalized dmg bonus you don't need to include it in your calculation, just look at the dmg/dly ratio. Keep in mind that a same-ratio weapon with a higher dmg bonus (slower delay) will perform better against high AC/MOTM targets.
Thanks, that works for, say, comparing 2h to 2h, but how do I do that for comparing a pair of dual wield weapons vs another pair of duel wield weapons? Or pair of duel wield weapons vs a 2hander? I work really well with real life examples, so let's do some gorilla math and let me know hat i'm doing wrong or right please: 2hander: Ornate Rune Blade: 19/30 Gorilla math DPS = 19/30=.633 Throneblade of Ykesha 33/51 Gorilla math DPS = 33/51=.647 From this math, Throneblade is better. Marginally, but better Now it gets confusing for 1 handers, but let's make it simple. A pair of lamentations, 9/19, what would the dps be? Primary would be 9/19=.47, but I know the secondary will not perform at the level of the primary. so, what do I do for the secondary for this gorilla math? How do I know when to use dual wield over 2h for straight gorilla math dps, on straight leveling, on trash mobs?
We've all been down this road in one form or another. It gets worse later when you have to figure in procs. I'm not being a smartazz, but here's the short answer: It doesn't matter. Just take the one with the best ratio. Or, if you are having aggro issues, take the one with the best proc aggro and ratio combination.
If you have 2 weapons both with the same ratio but with different speeds wouldn't you want the faster weapon because MOTM blocks so much damage that the fast swings makes up for it?
https://www.raidloot.com/items filter by xpac your'e in and older, slot and weapon ratio. Lot of filters to work with, careful, it gets intense.
For the first question, what do you use for secondary, you use whatever your second best (highest ratio) weapon is (with the highest ratio already being used in your main hand.) It's not really any different than picking what goes in your primary. For comparing a dual wield combo to a 2h weapon, now basically you just need to parse the two and compare. Testcopy and try both on dummies in the arena for an hour, then compare the parses. I'm not aware of a great easy formula that will get you there.
Thanks - the formula I have works great, i just don't know what the damage bonus is, per weapon, per level, so it makes it hard to make a shopping list. Comparing ratios is easy for picking a best primary, or a best secondary, or a better 2h over another 2h, but it doesn't tell me, roughly if a 2h is better than a specific 1h combo. yes, there re procs. Yes, there is mitigation, yes, there is all that. But, at it's base, it all starts with simple dmg/delay, and that is simply all i want to know. Remember, this is just trash mobs, leveling, not a raid with end game gear. If I have to use the dmg bonus, then i will, but then I have to learn how to know what the bonus actually is, per weapon, per level. does anyone know that?
Obviously parsing is the best, but that would require me to have the weapons. I'm looking to do the math on paper so I don't have to buy 100 weapons and test, i want to buy one set for my best dps. also, are there dummies in progression with velious being the last expansion unlocked?
I toyed with this sort of mathing it out entirely too long before I started parsing, but really you need data. I highly recommend just getting gamparse, doing a /testcopy, and running your own tests with the test dummies in the arena on the test server. You say you don't want to min/max, but you're already thinking SpreadsheetQuest At this point in progression though you can generally just trust ratios, there's very few exceptions where weapons will "surprise" you on parses; only one to surprise me this round of TLP is Wurmslayer. For leveling, it really won't significantly matter. Unless you're getting twinked with some god-tier raid weapon, everything that you'll have easily available will mostly parse within 5-10% of each other. For comparing dual wield to a two-hander, I'd parse it out. If you don't/can't, then think about your level and your skills. Dual wield, double attack, and triple attack are really ineffective when their skill caps are low. Two-handers will generally do poorly when double/triple attack are low, and likewise your offhand weapon will feel pretty useless when you first get dual wield. The answer to this question really depends on your class and level. There's also damage caps leveling (at 10? and 20?), so slower, high-damage weapons will suffer at low levels.
I can see how it may seem i'm min / maxing, but i'm really not. I'm just trying to find the best combo of weapons or 2h for the money for leveling, that's pretty much it. I have no idea of two lamentations will out perform a truncheon of doom, as an example, and that's literally all I want to find out, examples just like that. Real example I have right now, that I will answer with parsing, is Wu's Quivering Staff (2hb, 23/28) vs 2 stave of shielding's (17/28 1hb's). I think the staves are better, but who knows. Again, i can't parse, because I do not have said weapons. If I had said weapons, yes, parsing tells me what i need to know. Btw, what is the recommend parsing software nowadays?
I'm not aware of what this is, there are NPC's that give you weapons to try? Or, is it just an npc you can attack that wont' attack back, aka, a dummy?
It is an npc that you can attack and won't attack back. You can customize it a bit too to simulate different opponents.
The stave of shieldings will be better by a bit. iirc a peacebringer or tstaff will beat them though, except at the low levels when damage is capped. All of these are going to be close enough that I wouldn't personally worry too much about which I had leveling up.
I went down this path many times over the years. Really you're concern is how does a primary only weapon (2h) compare vs a Primary AND secondary weapon (1h + 1h). If you REALLLY want to be sure, take a single weapon, parse it in primary, then parse it in secondary. Put a Fire beetle eye in the other hand. If my memory serves, when we were doing Ragefire in Classic/Kunark/Velious I think we considered offhand to be about 1/3 the dps of mainhand with the same weap. Given that I'd say Mainhand + 1/3 Offhand = 2h. Or if we have your exampe: Wu's Quivering Staff (2hb, 23/28) vs 2 stave of shielding's (17/28 1hb's). 23/28 = .821 17/28 = .608 17/28(*.3333) = .202 .821 = .608+.202 .821 = .810 Or, about the same DPS.
That's exactly what i need, a rough guess - 1/3 of normal dps in off hand, that will be perfect, thanks!!
