Froststone Teleport in Dwarf Heritage Crate

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Benito, Sep 25, 2020.

  1. Benito EQ player since 2001.

    This does not matter to most people but, if someone is on the fence about upgrading to the Premium Edition, the upcoming Dwarven Heritage Crate will have a Froststone Teleport (likely placeable in Housing or Guild Hall). However, the teleport may be ultra rare or a result of the Dwarven Art Collector achievement. So the Premium Edition's value is derived from the Restless Coldain illusion, Tizmak Metamorph, and Restless Snow Griffon. It's less of a big deal than TBL Premium Edition Fire Platform vs. Wishing Lamp.

    Spell data for Dwarf Heritage Crate courtesy of EQResource:

    Pry Open the Dwarf Heritage Crate:

    Familiar: Crag Chick:

    Familiar: Dire Wolf:

    Familiar: Arctic Wurm:

    Familiar: Odiferous Skunk:

    Familiar: Transforming Telmira:

    Summon Dwarven War Worg:

    Teleport: Underfoot Monument:

    Teleport: Thurgadin Statuary:

    Teleport: Brell's Temple:

    Teleport: Froststone Gate:

    Teleport: Kaladim Overlook:

    Teleport: Icewell Keep Audience Chamber:

    Illusion: Dwarven Sentinel:
  2. Nilwean Elder

    That goes to SOV Frostone, not TOV Frostone

    If it was TOV it would say crystaltwob
  3. gnomeboss Augur

    wts velium. pieces, bricks, and blocks.
  4. Sobmre Augur

    bah i found it first!
    Benito likes this.
  5. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Any way you slice it people are gambling their money or daybreak cash awarded from subs /krono for only a chance at something that might be in the loot crate.

    I don't gamble, and these items should be regulated by the gambling authorities in each country, while they aren't there is a very high chance you are getting ripped off or exploited.
    Bobokin and Duder like this.
  6. Sokki Still Won't Buff You!!

    It's no secret the most desired items are the rarest. I've opened several and never got a mount or illusion, I usually end up buying them with krono's. If you don't want to take a chance on the crates just buy what you want from other players, the good items aren't usually cheap though.
    Andarriel likes this.
  7. Natal Augur


    Someone is in for a surprise the first time they click it after paying a few hundred dollars for it then ;)
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  8. yepmetoo Abazzagorath

    Are baseball cards packs regulated by gambling authorities?
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare and Andarriel like this.
  9. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    No idea I'm from the UK and baseball isn't really a thing here.
    We have things like the Panini Football cards but those are generally purchased from bricks & mortar shops or their online store and not from inside games as they are completely separate from any online game.
    They are easily differentiated from game loot boxes though as they are closer to stamp collecting & you have a physical item being produced & traded.
  10. Andarriel Everquest player since 2000

    wow really? LOL should just be regulated in the UK.

    Andarriel
  11. Zamiam Augur

    the items in the heritage crates usually are not the expensive if purchased with pp or krono .. the last illusion I bought the orc pawn bought for 2 krono .. I waited till for awhile so the prices came down and yes there are people who will try to sell for like 5 + krono , but if your wait and be patient you can get the items for a decent price..

    again I paid for my items through pp in game and bought the krono from pp so no in R/L monies were used :p a win win for me ..
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  12. Andarriel Everquest player since 2000

    yea i got mine for 3 krono's but when stuff is new there pretty expensive.

    Andarriel
  13. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Belgium & the Netherlands already banned them, the UK government opted not to ban but is keeping a close eye on the issue as is the US FTC

    after the 2018 Gambling Regulators European Forum16 jurisdictions (Austria, Czech Republic, France, Gibraltar, Ireland, Isle of Man, Jersey, Latvia, Malta, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Spain, the United States and the United Kingdom) signed an agreement to investigate the role of loot boxes in digital gambling. It remains to be seen what the outcome will be across each jurisdiction but, given that Japan is making tremendous strides with its self-regulatory approach, it is hoped that others can learn the same lessons and help to spread awareness of the loot box epidemic.

    Further reading: http://www.gref.net/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Synthesis_final-draft_v4_clean.pdf
  14. Xianzu_Monk_Tunare Augur

    The US will not do anything about them, because as others have pointed out, there have been things that work the exact same way for decades before there was an internet or even computers. There is no difference whatsoever between these things and collectible cards or other such things. Governments who have been banning them have been overreaching.
  15. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    No, the Governements that banned them did so because they broke their national gambling legislation, that's fact not overreach, and there are plenty of consumer groups in the nations within the GREF who are adamant that the lootboxes on games qualify as gambling & feed into gambling addiction.

    Let's not forget the amounts of money involved make a powerful argument on their own, its why any legislation that involves gambling is fraught with difficulty.
    Lootboxes in 2017.2018 were fast approaching 50% of all videogaming income & were on trajectory to become more than 50% by the end of 2021, Covid-19 may either cause a downturn in that or more likely an increase.
    China for all its ills took a different stance & instead forced game publisher's to publicly state the % chances of each item in any lootbox being found.
    A better option for games is a combination of public admission of the actual chance to win any individual item in a lootbox alongside option to purchase any lootbox item individually, but games publishers (rather than developers) are really keen not to make those numbers public. That asymmetry of information is at the root of most consumer groups complaints about the lootbox phenomenon, consumers are expected to trust the publishers that they are playing fairly while being unregulated by anything and no protections for consumers should any publisher be acting maliciously.

    The issue is not one to be lightly shoved under the carpet either and some game companies are taking the matter seriously & looking at the self-regulation route as a way to avoid getting into government regulation territory.

    https://www.gamesindustry.biz/artic...microsoft-to-require-loot-box-odds-disclosure

    There was an open-forum held by the US's FTC on the subject that had some very interesting feedback:

    John Breyault, VP of public policy, telecommunications and fraud at the National Consumers League.
    "The evidence that's been presented raises a lot of key questions that we think are appropriate for the FTC to investigate. First of all, are loot box odds being manipulated to incentivize continued play for eventual monetization," he asked. "When I buy a Magic: The Gathering pack or baseball card pack at Target, my odds of getting a rookie card or a rare card there are fixed. It's a physical thing. But when you're opening loot boxes online, those odds can be manipulated based on a variety of factors. If that is indeed the case, what factors are being used to influence loot box drop odds? "
    ............................................

    Online Performers Group CEO Omeed Dariani. His company represents content creators on a variety of platforms and has a client list ranging from Cohh Carnage and Angry Joe to T-Pain and Dragonforce. He explained that he was asked to represent "the gaming community" on the panel. He explained that the community does not have a monolithic position on loot boxes, but did offer a general takeaway from his discussions with gamers.
    "The community mostly thinks loot boxes are gambling," Dariani said. "Of the feedback I got, there was a wide variety, but over and over we had people coming back to this idea that if it's not gambling, it feels like gambling. Even though we can pretty clearly say loot boxes are not exactly the same thing as entering the lottery or sitting in front of a slot machine, they do have some of the same feelings that gambling does."
  16. Xianzu_Monk_Tunare Augur

    No, it's overreaching. No one at all is buying these things because of a gambling. No one is doing these things because they want to gamble. People buy these things because they want to get stuff from them. When they don't get exactly what they want they whine to their government that they should have gotten what they wanted. Nothing more.

    Nothing in EQ, or any loot boxes in general, are at all like either the lottery or a slot machine. All loot boxes and in EQ you are 100% guaranteed to get something, what you get varies, but you get something. With gambling you are almost guaranteed to lose and get nothing. With gambling you are in fact guaranteed to have a net loss, as the majority of the time you will loose, a minority of the time you might break even. With loot boxes and the similar mechanics within EQ you always get something, just not always what you like. Within EQ specifically, you can trade these items to others for what you want or for in-game money. In general you come out with a net positive, even when you do not get exactly what you are wanting.

    In that quote by John Breyaulty, he is incorrect in his ascertain that getting the rare rookie card or the super awesome card from a CCG are set odds. First, the rare rookie card isn't something you will know till years or even decades later; and that will depend on both how many people kept that card as well as how well the player does in their career. Second with the CCG card the odds are not set until after they stop producing that run, before then the odds are always changing as they print more and decided, typically by usage and power, what cards are popular and reasonably powered and which ones are popular and over powered. They change the rarity as the run goes, not at the start. In the same ways the odds for loot boxes change as their run goes, but typically contrast to things like sports trading cards or cards from CCGs, as the run of a loot box goes, typically if there is any change it is to increase the chance that you can get the rare/hard to get item. None of these things have odds that you know before you buy, because what's best or hardest to get changes with time.
  17. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    See you're wrong.

    Buying a lootbox or pulling the lever on a slot machine you do exactly the same thing, you are playing a game of chance & wagering your money vs the chance of getting something you want - winning or ending up with something you don't want - losing, that's gambling, and the slot machines actually play by much fairer odds than lootboxes since those are regulated.

    You can cry about "but you get something not nothing for your money" - sure if you consider a shrink potion, bind potion or heal potion useful you won someting, if you aren't even going to use those things then all you won is a handful of bovine excrement, and I absolutaely laugh that anyone is going to want those things in exchange for well pretty much anything that is desirable from a crate.
    So go ahead & spend four hundred bucks to get something you want, if the odds are even that good which they often aren't & accumulate a large heap of Bovine excrement in the process, you still got played & the only winner - as always when you play against the house is the house.
    Bobokin likes this.
  18. Xianzu_Monk_Tunare Augur

    No, you do not in anyway do the same thing with a lootbox. You are guaranteed 100% to get something from a loot box, every single time period. The specifics of what you get vary. You are not wagering anything, you are not gambling anything. A slot machine however you are going to either get less than you spent or lose everything you spent more than you are going to even break even. The chances of you coming out with a net win over any period of time with a slot machine is close to zero. Anyone claiming that they are anything close to the same thing is simply lying to themselves.

    People buy the potion packs far more often than they do the higher dollar items. The fact that you don't use them does not mean others do not.

    People spending $400 in microtransactions on a game has a problem with the game they are playing, not with gambling. Further, anyone spending $400 on EQ microtransactions is really going about the game wrong.
  19. Sissruukk Rogue One

    So, to take it a bit further here: I pay a monthly sub. Therefore, I should always get what I want from loot chests every time I run a mission or a raid.

    The odds of getting what you want every time you do something in the game are all based on RNG. This is how they keep you coming back to the game, to rerun missions and raids until you eventually get what it is you are looking for. Some people get what they want on first try. Others have to pay a full month or two (or beyond) before something they want drops (heck, I am still trying to get the aug off of the Ambassador of Loving). Or buying loot boxes. I don't see this as gambling. This is how the game was intended to be played, including loot boxes. I willingly take the chance against the RNG every time I log in and do something. Sure, FTP and Silver accounts get basic gear, but if you want the premium stuff, you have to pay to get it, and to run missions/raids to get beyond the basic stuff. All of that is putting you against the RNG.

    What all of this really boils down to is responsibility and accountability for one's own finances.
  20. Fian Augur

    If Europe wants to regulate games with a random number generator, then they can block access to EQ game and be left behind. Frankly, Europe is becoming a pain to do business. We might as well just embargo their products and let them return to the dark ages.