If you are using things that automate the actions of your characters, then you are cheating. The only person you are really cheating is yourself tho. Your not really playing the game if you automate, and you are impeding your ability to actually become good at the game.
The real issue - is that even if someone is cheating - usually nothing is done about it. I am playing on Aradune right now, and I have seen the robo campers - no one answers a tell, they warp in seconds before a named mob / PH spawns, kills it, and warp out. Then 2 hours later rinse and repeat. Then you find the items they are camping being sold for Krono in the commonlands. But how do you know they are cheating? When 2 identical mages, with earth pets, pop in front of the throne in the Sarnak Fort, appear using the same animation of someone casting a Translocate, Nuke the mob, then disappear using the SAME animation of a translocate (upright ring of fire) what am I to think? Many people have reported it - they are ALWAYS THERE - and nothing is done. This blocks real players from getting gear and keys - UNLESS you are willing to pay.
At the risk of outing myself as a cheater, back in the day I routinely used to use unauthorized third party hardware to do exactly what you are doing. I used a kitchen timer.
isn't the test server called the test server so they can "test" their patches to make ure they work b4 putting them on live ones? or am I missing the point of test?
I thought this was an academically interesting question... in the law, something's not "illegal" unless it's explicitly spelled out. A lot of effort goes into evaluating suspected violations via the legal system. (Obviously that's a much more important area to get right, I'm not comparing cheating in EQ to crime and punishment, but there are similarities) In a game, particularly EQ, this same paradigm doesn't apply. We have a single brief paragraph about cheating, using many ambiguous terms that just raises more specific questions. I don't have any particular insights, I just thought it was an interesting topic given the wide spectrum of what players (or DPG) could consider to be cheating. PS - To the person saying I should post using my in-game name... I did... Trebla on 7th Hammer (Tunare) server (and now Aradune as well). Not sure why it was assumed otherwise.
The reason for the ambiguity is to allow the parent company to act upon a whim without legal repercussion. It's quite similar to states in the USA which operation on a "right to work" policy. If they spelled out all of the conditions, you could contest a judgement/action. Since it is so vague, unless it explicitly is a violation of some other form, you have no recourse against it.
I want to add to Wyre Wintermute's point in that it's also vague because a program might be allowable/not allowable under different circumstances/uses. For an easy example, many people got suspended/banned for having virtual machines running the the background of their computers while playing on Miragul. Apparently people not playing on Miragul but had virtual machines running were not in trouble. The easiest way to think about it is if the program gives you an unfair advantage over a player not using the third-party tool, it's fair game to get suspended for using. Best advice, if you have to ask or think about it, play it safe and assume its not allowed.
This gets back to the initial scenario that made me think about it (and is almost verbatim what I said in my initial post). A stopwatch is a "third-party app"... it gives you a potentially unfair advantage over a player not using it. I didn't mean to drive this conversation to "what will get you banned"... I'm curious what other players think is cheating? Stopwatch? Waterbird? Log monitor (Gina)? Packet sniffer? Where do individual players draw the line?
This seems to be the case in everything I've heard. Standing still in a zone and letting a mob run into you is cheating depending on if you can answer a tell or not. You can sit at your desk and not touch the keyboard...that's fine. Just don't leave the room when that tell comes!
Well, that rule is in reference to the Unattended Gamplay policy. It is against the rules to leave your character unattended while in play. They give a specific example in the policy of how you should log or at least go somewhere more remote (i.e. corner of zone). People have been sitting at their desk doing nothing for years. In fact, you had to sit an do nothing for extended periods of time as part of the game design due to: -The original recovery mechanic that kept regeneration slow, the current "rest" state that accelerates regen after being out of combat for awhile was a later quality of life change. If U recall correctly, we use to have the spell book up to meditate so unless you were chatting, there was no reason to touch your keyboard. -Camping, mob respawn timers use to be longer and there use to be less content. So people would sit waiting for the desired name from a particular spawn to pop, and before that there might be a many hours long queue to wait in. If another camp wasn't open in the meantime you could end up just sitting and waiting, could often chat but often people would just do other stuff. If you're not doing anything, and you ignore a GM's tell. I think its fair for them to assume you're AFK unless you can point to another box you were focused on. (Per others, they have reversed suspensions in that boxing scenario.)
That's 20 paid accounts (regardless of how it's paid for) and they would be financially ruined if they banned those teams across the board. There is a 64 toon team run by a single person on one of the TLP's and no matter what happens (short of a blatant attempt to hack a server, but even that I doubt) they would quickly be broke fools to ban it or anyone running similar. They wrote the rules and they can change or "bend" them as they see fit. Your recourse? Spend your sub money elsewhere.
Comparing real life law and what is illegal to what rules can get you suspended/banned is just plain silly.
Are you familiar with Right to Work? Many people think that it means you have the right to employment and it protects you from termination. Right to Work laws prohibit the compulsory requirement to join a union. Prior to the law, a union could negotiate that all employees must be members of the union, and if not, could be prohibited from working said job. You have the Right to Work *despite* not being a member of the union. It does absolutely nothing to protect you from your employer and has no impact what-so-ever on "judgement/action". The opposite actually. It is a law designed to take power away from the unions who are trying to force employers to give more benefits or protections to employees. The conditions of right to work are pretty well spelled out. Very little vagueness is involved.
The rules specifically stipulate "Absolutely No Automated/Unintended Game-play". The key word here is "automated", or using a process that replaces human interaction in order to operate the game. A stopwatch is a secondary device that does not interact with or operate the game in any way. Using stopwatch calculations (old fashioned wind-up mechanism, app on a phone, your brain) is a secondary tool, not unlike looking something up in an app on your browser (maps, loot tables, etc.), which is also not automated/unintended game-play. Automated/unintended game-play is using software or devices that replace human interaction. These could be 3rd party programs or physical devices that run scripts (macros) that perform pre-recorded mouse and/or keyboard interactions. This includes gaming keyboards that store key combinations, software that allows you to script or record key combinations and mouse clicks, etc. These devices and 3rd party software create 'unintended' game-play, because human interaction is expected to be employed when playing the game. This expectation becomes null and void by these devices and programs because: a player who uses these devices/software 'plays' the game without physically touching their keyboard or mouse for as long as the script will run, gives a player the ability to perform actions endlessly (e.g., while they sleep, etc.), and undermines players who are playing according to the rules (e.g., logging out when they sleep).
I think they may have loosened the definition from time to time. For instance at one time it was OK to use something that saved you mouse clicks. There is a famous program that gets your posts automatically deleted if you mention it by name. The powers that be seem to let it go if you are just using it save mouse clicks during attended play, but they won't say as much because of the way it can lend itself to cheating. There's stuff that specifically is illegal on multiple counts like interfering with the data stream and allowing you to do something that can't be accomplished using the standard client. I think broadcasting mouse clicks over a network to other instances of the game is specifically still prohibited, just not enforced. Kind of like it is ok to own a fast car as long as you don't exceed the speed limit. I still hate the RMT/Krono and the grief they bring. There is an upside, Krono prices are typically lower then subscription prices. I guess some people see RMT Krono at ~$8/month as a low enough ceiling that they will play but the DP ~$15 is a pass. Ditto for people that pay to have their characters power leveled or multi quest buy their epics. If you would rather drop $150 getting power leveled because you find leveling too tedious, well I just don't know. You probably don't add much to the community compared to a person that plays the game the way it was intended. They do add $15/month to DP so I temper my opinion a bit based on that.
