Original EQ vs TLP EQ

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Idget, Aug 29, 2020.

  1. Idget Lorekeeper

    I see a lot of posts each expansion as they come out and how impossible it is to get keys etc. The current rant is how hard it is for people to get there VP key's. I am curious what the current player base thinks about changing some of these out dated key or zone access quests.

    The more I think about it I realize even a new fresh TLP is not even close to what classic EQ was. The dev's have done some things to help with how the game has progressed over the years. The biggest one I can think of is adding AOC so even the smaller casual guilds can raid the content and not have to fight over open world spawns. I feel like the game is now ready to continue that and work on some of the out dated key and epic quests. For example the VP key quest worked back in 99 but now not so much. Especially with TLP's now progressing through expansions every 3 months. The open world key drop parts no longer work for the game as is. Same with some epic fights like Broken Golem and Shissar in Fear. You can get Phinny in an instance for epic parts, Sky and other zones. Just my opinion but I feel TLP's are ready for those types of changes moving forward.

    What are your thoughts...
  2. Siah Elder

    The VP key is one of the toughest keys in the game. It hasnt even been 2 weeks since the release of kunark and people complain that they can't do some parts of there keys bc it may be contested. This is the end zone for kunark and was never intended to be easy to get, or to get the key nearly this quickly. Even if you get all the pieces, you still need to get lucky with the amount of Trak teeth you get in your instances. On live this key was done over the course of months, not 1 or 2 weeks. Granted this is not live, they've already changed many things about the key quest which have made it easier to obtain. Also, the labor day bonus will be here soon and you will see increased AJ, RS, PS, etc spawns rather than phs.. which will help a lot of people granted they have there ground spawns/trak teeth.
  3. Bullsnooze Augur

    That intent was for a different game with the same name (if that makes sense). In short what the OP is trying to say is that the key bottlenecks should be revamped for Progression server evolution. Why have some quests up for competition, while others are not?

    Guess a counter argument is that Dark Paw never promised that folks would experience all the content. However, adding Agent of Changes kind of provides a direct counter to that as well.
  4. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    On live servers you absolutely did not have 20-30 guilds of eager raiders all wanting to get their VP key simultaeneously you had maybe 3-5 doing it when the expansion opened and they had a 12 month window to operate in not 3. Guilds who were more casual did it later in the year after the front-runners were done. There are way fewer casual guilds on TLP, TLP by their accelerated unlock schedule nature are not Casual-friendly at all.

    As Bullsnooze said, it might as well have been a completely different game it's that big a differential.

    It's not an even remotely comparable situation. 10 fold increase in players/guilds and a quarter of the time to get it done & the raid zone farmed before the next expansion unlocks. Picks help but don't address the problem well enough, key quest I think should stay but needs to be overhauled a ton, even after the prior round of changes it's still a huge bottleneck & the intent on TLP is not to allow only a few elite players/guilds to raid in era it is to allow most players and guilds the opportunity to see and experience the content in era - if it were not AoC would not have been created to begin with.
    Duder and Bullsnooze like this.
  5. Bullsnooze Augur

    Couldn't agree more and it would be in Dark Paw's greatest interest to overhaul a majority of bottlenecks for progression servers.
    Aneuren and Skuz like this.
  6. Pawtato Augur

    That's because the zone wasn't finished when they released Kunark. It had nothing to do with exclusivity.
    A Wonderer likes this.
  7. A Wonderer Journeyman

    He doesn't know what he's talking about clearly.

    How many guilds made it into VP in era on live. Not many as Skuz alluded to.

    Kunark was more trial and error from Sony at the time.
  8. Aneuren Tempered Steel

    So if the zone not being finished was the big problem, I do not see the issue with it being more accessible now that it is fixed? We don't need artificial blocks for a zone that works, yes?
  9. Pawtato Augur

    I’d prefer no flags as a version for TLPs with a 3 month expansion cycle. Problem is a lot of people built up their self-worth around their flags. Although, if they want to keep flags in the game from a lore perspective, it would just be nice to only need 1 person for a group or raid.
    Aneuren likes this.
  10. Indigo_Quarmite Augur

    False. On live, pre-Velious in era - like 3 guilds did VP.

    Laughable to think 3-5 per server were going for a key quest they didn't even know existed.

    Indigo out.
  11. nagash101 Augur

    Also it took months and months to hit 60 back in the original release, hell levels. It was a grind that took you a long time to hit that magic level. We have people hitting level 60 on aradune in 2 days and now there are hundreds of people 60 and a lot of them trying to get keyed. The VP key quest was never designed to have a huge number of the population do it at once it was designed for the hardcore grinders that spend 80+ a week playing EQ for months and months straight. As Holly Longstride once said "some content just isn't designed for the filthy casual player".
  12. EchoFreya Lorekeeper


    1. The rapidity of content roll-out that doesn't mesh with some classic mechanics (Kunark wasn't 3 months in classic before Velious dropped). Waiting days (not hours) on packed servers to complete content within a 3 month expansion release isn't realistic in a game largely populated by grown adults with responsibilities and subsequently less play-time who want to re-live experiences from their younger years.

    2. Players still queue up in lists on servers because the /pick system isn't smart enough to filter out demand vs. difficulty (e.g. Droga on Kunark release filled only with solo SKs and Necros waiting in line for one soloable mob).

    3. Lack of deterring mechanisms in place where players that undermine cooperating players (e.g. lists as outlined in 2.). Three days after Kunark launched on Rizlona, someone's boxed group swoops in and starts killing PHs and named on a camp they claimed entitlement to because "they could out-dps anyone else waiting in line". There was a very obvious queue of 5 players who had been waiting several hours cooperatively and respectfully in line. Verbatim these were that person's words written in response to a polite request that they stop, respect that there is a lineup, and we would add them to the list. They refused, and kept right on killing. All of this was subsequently sent in a /report but to this day, no follow-up has been made. I expect that this same person is making other people's lives miserable every day because nothing prevents them from this antisocial behaviour.

    Classic EQ worked with long respawn timers because they had mechanisms in place that made all of these things tolerable. There was more time to complete content per expansion, play nice policies that encouraged players to work things out on their own, and strict enforcement of punishment against those who challenged or circumvented cooperative gameplay.

    While /picks and AoCs help with some of these issues that enable accelerated timelines to help meet demand while deterring antisocial gameplay, these things alone aren't perfect. The lack of administrative assistance with issues that arise from problematic personalities is another issue entirely, and not a small one at that.

    There is nothing 'uber' about being the first or the only ones to accomplish something when you have to step on people in order to achieve things. People like that existed in classic, just as they do here. The only difference is that nothing seems to deter people from this behaviour today as it did back then. Instead, we get coded mechanics designed to make it happen less frequently, when in fact I bet it happens a lot more often because nothing prevents it. It's like a snake biting it's own tail...
  13. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    So I was right as far as it being a LOT less, and your comment backs up my assertion, however the only thing laughable is how petty & snide you chose to be while missing the point I made.

    Even IF only 3 guilds "did Vp in era" (note I said "maybe" which is like saying "possibly") I bet many more than that were trying to key up for it, just a lot less than the 20-30 on TLP in recent years.
  14. malliee New Member

    The push for the key in the first month can be a pain but after that its a joke. Yeah takes 24 hours or so to do it on alts but its not as bad as players are making it out to be. On the past 5 or 6 tlps i did it on 5 or 6 toons each server and it wasnt bad. I think the changes they have made since live made the key a hell of alot better then it was. I think swamp was what 10 hour spawn and AJ was every 24 hours was a nightmare to get back then