Charm is too strong

Would anyone even notice on servers like Selo/Mangler? Super high base XP already, launched during a double XP event, and pots.

Was anyone level 50 day 2 of a server in 99? No, they were not, nor is charm required to level that fast on servers like this.

Melee DPS especially rogues suck in classic. If your bar for being OP is better then a rogue in Classic even Cleric DPS is too OP. In Classic the first groups to level 50 are always stacked with 3 or 4 mages, because Mages are actually the god class when it comes to leveling, don't tell the forums though. Enchanters are still strong in Classic and Kunark, then they fall off really hard and become buff bots for 98% of raid content. By the time Luclin hits Bards are just better Enchanters for most groups and raids. Rogues on the other hand become a top tier DPS class once they get access to better weapons and double backstab at 55.

All pets take 50% of the EXP if they're the only source of damage. If a PC damages the mob for 1 point of damage pets don't take any XP.

You asked, I refused.

My posting doesn't prevent anyone else posting, so why are you getting so irate?

I will take a break when I feel like it, not when you do, thanks.

Bards???
Have you been in pof xp groups?

Bards. Hahahahaah

Whatever just going to ignore you. Tired of seeing you flood every thread on the forums. Not even mad, you're just annoying and its borderline harassment.

Fire? Boring, Bad loot, avg exp. Why would i ever wanna group there? Bards are strong in ever zone during PoP and on raids. Enchanters are strong in 3 Zones and buff bots on raids. Bards are a much stronger class in PoP.

It may be boring but it's the absolute best xp in game with a charmed pet. The DPS and tank-ability of charmed pets makes it super easy.

As someone who has played chanter on almost every TLP that's been released, the risk vs reward justification for charm being so OP always makes me laugh. It's riskier for most classes to simply attempt to travel through a dungeon than it is for a chanter to use a charmed pet in one.

It wasn't terribly hard back in the day either. Enchanters weren't nearly as popular so a lot of us had to make due in some fairly "bad" group set ups. You have to play a bit smarter and use more of your tools such as roots, harmony etc - but you could do it easily enough.

Back in the day had a lot more time going for it too and a better community.

You guys defending charm make me laugh.

To the guy that says that you can level just as fast without a charmer in group: You are crazy AND wrong. If you think that way, then you haven't played enough and need to play some more of the current TLPs from Classic thru to POP. Go to Chardok and try and outlevel a group with 2 chanters and a necro in it. They will gain 3x the XP that you will in any amount of equal time, comical.

To the person who is stuck on the death penalty being lower and actually trying to use the idea of bringing back corpse retrieval as a means to dissuade people from adjusting charm: You already just admitted that the risk is lower, how about adjusting the reward side of the equation to match huh?

People arent asking charm to be GUTTED, like it was in OOW. They are merely stating that since the risks have been reduced (lack of corpse retrievals, better mana regen overall, lower resists, etc.) that the reward be adjusted slightly to match. There really is no reason the grouping portion of this game should be the "MONSTER CHARM GAME", where every other class plays support roll to the charming classes for 6 eras. Because that is what it has devolved into: everyone scrambling all over themselves to get the charming classes in their groups, while the dps/tank classes sit around and twiddle their thumbs waiting to fill an extra spot here or there.

Again, if you do not think that this is the way the game is being played. Then you are blind. I will accept ZERO rebuttal to this FACT. If you attempt a rebuttal, you will be showing everyone your lack of intelligence.

Now, if you want to come up with interesting ways that the balance between risk and reward can be maintained, then now we are getting somewhere. You know: BRAINSTORMING. I personally like the idea of a slight mitigation to the attack speed of charmed monsters. There are other ways to balance it as well. Let's look at the risk side of the equation. We can't adjust the magic resists because that would impact crowd control spells, which are currently working decently. So how about adding a debuff component to the charm spells, so charmed monsters take more damage and can die easier (aka more risk). Well, this COULD make it easier for chanters to solo charm (via charm-swapping), but then solo XP sucks horribly anyways, so really who cares. These are but 2 interesting ideas. Anyone got any others?

Counter-point: A majority of the classes are trash early.

Ya i mentioned a scaling slow of attack speed on charm spells. "You take control of X Target and slow their attack speed by Y%". It scales by level to a max of 75% slow at 64 charm spell. Just an idea. Can also revert to a change in the exp to 1/3rd if you have a charm pet. It was a change they implemented in PoP because charming was out of control. I guess later down the line they removed it.

Enchanters hard carry GE gate groups with charm pets and AE stunning in The Deep for the best exp in the game. Charm is king all the way into PoP. Don't be silly man.

If you really think the difference is just a couple hours from 1-50, you have no clue the magnitude of the problem.

charm is relatively bad in a lot of Luclin zones. It's the first expansion they started to try across the board reduce mobs max hit when charmed. In a geared melee group you probably get more out of a bard with overhaste. The deep is obviously it's own thing that as far as I care can be nerfed out of existence

It only needs to be good in 1 luclin zone to be good for luclin.

Well this thread is getting locked.

Charm is definitely too strong. Very little risk for too much reward. Why should a charmed mob out damage nearly every DPS class? Even if it is nerfed enchanters are still a very strong class that most groups will want, I just don't think it's right that having an enchanter in your group is such a huge advantage over others.

Charm pets in all Luclin zone beside SSRA suck massive balls. Charm pets in GE do like 125 DPS. Raid geared Rangers in that era are cranking out 400+ DPS vs blue cons. Mobs in the middle of GE are all above 55 and you can't stun them. Pulls are very long and Bards are much better here and frankly much better in all Luclin content besides SSRA mines.

You charm weak ask mobs that do no DPS then

I'm confident Mage, Mage, Mage, Bard, Cleric, SK would beat Any other DPS class x3, Chanter, Cleric, Tank to 50.

Charm is good in 0 high level Luclin zones, it's only borderline okay on SSRA.