The speed of which the mobs splat you vs human brain, ideas wanted.

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Waitwhat, Mar 11, 2020.

  1. Waitwhat Elder

    I am a bit confused about the reaction times needed to survive being attacked by mobs in the current game. Let's say I am a monk, and pull mobs for the tank to, well, tank.
    It takes a mob or two mobs like 0,1 seconds to kill me flat out, if I am not super duper careful to not get hit at all. I wonder if it's lag or what. I have decent gear and know my abilities.
    I mean, it's SUPER FAST. There is no chance for any kind of thought process if you are being attacked, I just die before I can even assess any incoming damage to myself.

    "Did I get aggro?" I must have, because I am dead. Same goes for Clerics. Best healers, wearing plate, they splat at ungodly speeds. Wizard evac? You better keep your finger on that hot button, and if you manage to press it when something goes wrong, the tank and a dps, and possibly the cleric is dead within 0,3 secs.

    It's possible I exaggerate, but it's how I feel about it. I would very much like to see a change in this behavior. Do the mobs have to start out quadding at 100% melee speed and from max melee range whenever possible?

    If you agree somewhat, what can DPG do about it? After all, for me, I just want to play and not be scared shitless all the time and on every inc, afraid of getting one rounded before my synapses can react :)

    Any ideas, besides learn-to-play proactively condescension from the elite (don't need that)?
    Wulfhere likes this.
  2. Fanra https://everquest.fanra.info

    It is true that a decade or so ago they changed mobs to hit like freight trains. However, usually non tanks can survive a few hits. Not many, but a few.

    I agree they hit too hard on non tanks. However, I have not had my non tanks (I play a druid and monk) die in 0.1 seconds. It's more like 2 or 3 seconds.
  3. Cadira Augur

    Sadly the game is geared to be fairly fast paced now. A mob can tear a non tank down pretty quick but any healer can typically restore you to full health in no time as well. Very spikey by design.

    As a monk in decent gear I'd think you could take a few hits from the front at least and not insta splat to one mob, two maybe. From the back a round from two mobs will hurt anybody in current content though.

    Not to be a condescending elitist, but what do you mean by "decent gear" ? And what kind of aas do you have?
  4. Waitwhat Elder

    Spikey indeed, friend. I don't wanna make it too much about my monk, he's just an example for the discussion (TBL group tier 2 gear with some GMM and around 32k aa, so he should be playable and he is.) It is like you say "From the back a round from two mobs will hurt anybody".

    I got an idea, mobs start at 50% melee speed for the first second or two then speed up. Maybe not possible, just spitballing ideas.
  5. Velisaris_MS Augur

    And THAT...is just a bold faced untruth. I don't know of ANY clerics that get creamed if they take a few hits. Maybe if we're talking raid mobs, you might have a point. But regular, base pop mobs...clerics do not go splat.

    I get beat on regularly in ToV...and I mean by named mobs and mission mobs...and I survive just fine. If you're grouping with clerics that can't take a round of hits, I suggest finding a new cleric.
  6. Dre. Altoholic

    This is the problem and it dates way back to Complete Heal being so popular for so long. Essentially in order to address the efficiency of CH, healing in EverQuest switched from an "efficiency" to a "survival" model.
    Cadira likes this.
  7. Jumbur Improved Familiar

    I remember getting that particular impression, even back in the kunark era. Maybe its because I have always played "squishy" classes...

    If something yellow or red is hitting on you, then the tank(or someone handling cc) better have super reflexes. :p

    And yep, A bad pull can wipe your group in 0.3 secs. Better appreciate that jumpy wizard...;)

    Or maybe Im just remembering the most horrific trains the most...
    Waitwhat likes this.
  8. Drencrom Beimeith's Supervisor

    My finger is on the "Big AA rune" hotkey (Arcane Destruction), because it can be used while stunned. Then, I'll be spamming exodus for when the stun wears ;)
    Waitwhat likes this.
  9. Waitwhat Elder

    Don't take my examples too literally. It's fun with risk vs reward. I don't want to be WoW (run in, pull and tank all the mobs you can see and dps them down yourself)
    But, some reaction time tolerance from the game would be nice most days, no?
  10. Windance Augur

    The only answer is getting better. Like most things in EQ the more you need something the harder it is to get, and once you get it you don't really need it.

    Level and AA go a long way to making things easier. Each expansion has things hitting super hard / fast. Once (IF) you get to max level/AA there is a noticeable difference in how hard you get hit. That's why I would normally stay in the older zones level up before going into the new zones to do progress.

    Other than that make sure you are using your defensive / pulling abilities to get singles. You may need others in your group to help with crowd control. Mez or root mobs on incoming so you only have to deal with one.
  11. Dre. Altoholic

    Not "only" because we could always control the inflation of direct healing.

    Won't happen because it doesn't fit the "add 15% to everything" expansion model so it will only continue to get worse.

    Other games have learned that mudflation of direct healing leads down this road.
    Petalonyx and Waitwhat like this.
  12. Petalonyx Augur

    The problem is the OP and saturated healing. Most healing is spamming near instant full heals. To maintain challenge in this environment, monsters have to kill you in two rounds.

    IMO it is horrible. There are far fewer decisions to be made when healing than there were in the early days of EQ.

    As far as what to do about this in game now, you need to focus on prep. Max runes, max temp hp buffs, activate trophies, use empowered campfire, put in ur stat food, have HoTs running before u pull, and hover over fade/FD and 'oh crap' mitigation and avoidance AA, spells, and abilities.

    Have a Plan B. Expect to die to new mechanics, new mob pulling area, etc, until you learn where the key damage spikes will occur.
  13. Cicelee Augur

    Don't monks have Earthforce or some defensive AA that refreshes often?

    Hit that right before the mob reaches camp. That should help survivability...
  14. Gugagan Lorekeeper


    This design in the latest expansions is part of why I left the game again when I came back a few years and why I exclusively reside on TLP's. There are maybe some people who enjoy hitting 10 buttons just to survive a regular XP mob, most likely the people who say yes to this probably automated their tune in some way. The rest of us have enough stress in RL and we aren't coming in to this game to get more of it here. Go early design of EQ! ;-)
    Risiko likes this.
  15. svann Augur

    Depends on what you are pulling. 1 or 2 maybe you have time to take a few hits. But if the group wants multiples then I suggest you FD when the mobs are not quite to the group yet and let the tank tag them.
  16. Waitwhat Elder

    Did not want monk ideas but game design ideas, but hey :)
  17. Whulfgar Augur

    Hi new guy. Welcome to Everquest...
    If you having issues that your toons are getting blasted in literally hundreths of a second .. (the whole grp)

    This is as clear an indication that you lack the power to be in the content that your in.

    Go back an expansion.. farm up every single defensive aa you can on all the toon's you play .. every single one..

    Then return back to current content. It will a 100% completely different game then.
  18. Reisil Journeyman

    I would agree that maybe the content you are attempting isn't quite your level yet. I know Rangers, Monks, and Berserkers who can tank current content as it is. They struggle a bit with Rare mobs, but other then that they have no problems.
  19. Abbydog Journeyman

    Sigh, none of these guys get what you are saying at all. Guys he knows how to play the game. Its not that he cant handle the content. He is lamenting the fact that the higher the level you get the less time you have to react before you die. This leads him to throw out some ideas and seek some support in an effort to make casual exping......well more casual.
    Waitwhat and Kaenneth like this.
  20. Angahran Augur

    This is why level increase expansions suck.
    Players get, if they are lucky, maybe a 0.5% boost to stats, abilities, etc.
    A few thousand extra HME, updated abilities that are, hopefully, a little better than the previous version, that's about it.

    NPCs get at least a 100% boost to HME, new abilities specifically designed to neutralize anything new the players may have gained so that the players are basically worse off than they were previously.

    I know, people say the NPCs need more HME, etc because they are dumb.
    But when players have maybe 400k HP and NPCs have 40 million ?
    Players hitting for 20-30k if lucky and NPCs quadding for 100k+

    I'm not saying fights should be easy, that would be boring, but when too many fights are only survived through dumb luck it get's old real fast.
    Risiko likes this.