Player riposte nerfs and why?

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Hamshire, Oct 1, 2019.

  1. SomeRandomGuy Journeyman

    You do not understand computers. A calculation at the level of eq's code will take far more than one CPU instruction.
    Beimeith likes this.
  2. Hamshire Augur

    Whats changed between 1999 and now that is making it so bad on the 2019 hardware? Ive been a hardcore player since this game launched and been on most of the tlps and this riposte change completely kills my desire to wanna do anything in this game outside of raids and with all these crazy changes that come every patch it feels like if I quit then ill be done for good cuz when i do get the itch to wanna come back ten more huge changes like this will of been patched into the game while I was gone making it no point for me and pretty much anyone else to return.
    Venalin and WTBPvpTLP like this.
  3. Yawutokay Lorekeeper

    what changed is that dbg owns eq and not sony, and dbg has been laying people off and trying to make profit on the bare minimum team and current equipment. this is why they have a non existent GM staff, why play nice policy and camps dont exist on TLPs. they cant afford to police their own servers.
  4. Accipiter Old Timer


    Looks like you've been riposted by DBG.
  5. Derd Augur

    Why : because people abused its power. Thats really all you need to know.
  6. Beimeith Lord of the Game

    Simply put, the game has gotten more complicated.

    There are over 500 spell effects now, and most of them need to be checked when you cast a spell or have a round of melee combat.

    Think how stupidly complicated EQ's combat system is:

    1) NPC Swing weapon
    2) Check Riposte
    2.1) Get Riposte Skill & calculate % chance to running total.
    2.2) Check every spell slot of every AA for Riposte SPA & add chance to running total.
    2.3) Check every spell slot of every buff/song currently on you for Riposte SPA, & add chance to running total.
    2.4) Roll Riposte
    2.4.1) Successful Riposte
    2.4.1.1) Check if Rampage
    2.4.1.2) Check if AE Rampage
    2.4.2) Check Strikethrough
    2.5) Check Hit/Miss
    2.5.1) Weapon skill
    2.5.2) Avoidence AC vs Accuracy
    2.5.3) Successful hit
    2.5.3.1) Check if stun
    2.5.3.2) Roll D20 for damage
    2.5.3.2.1) Do a bunch of math?
    2.5.3.2.2) Check every AA for like 20+ damage mods
    2.5.3.2.2) Check every buff/song for like 20+ damage mods

    if not riposte, check block/parry/dodge
    Check Defensive procs (and check like 500 other things because it's a spell)

    Check every AA/buff for like 5 different kinds of Runes
    Check if Mezzed (cause gotta break mez if so)
    Check weapon proc and if so (check like 500 other damn things)
    Check critical hits (and like 20 other things that proc off critical hits)

    Check DA after all of this. (This really should be checked first cause all the above is pointless if you're DA).

    on and on and on and on.

    Now I'm sure some of the above is wrong, and I've definitely left out like a thousand other things EQ checks. My point though is EQ combat is ridiculous. There is a reason NO ONE (player or dev) fully understands how it works.

    And that is one (1) hit of one round.

    Now repeat all that for double, triple attack, check like 10 procs per player, etc.

    It's no wonder EQ runs like on live servers when there are 54 people all fighting at the same time.

    There are probably a ton of optimizations they could make in the combat system by shortcutting things that don't need to be checked, or pre-calculating things. The chance of breaking something if they mess with it is probably pretty high though.
    Goburs and SunDrake like this.
  7. Warpeace Augur



    IDK what your talking about I just stood there and looked at them.
  8. Spayce Augur


    Aggressively stupid people are the worst. You know, the ones who are ignorant yet confidently spout their opinions as if they are fact.

    The game server is not run on your PC, genius.
  9. HoodenShuklak Augur

    If you ever hit ctrl alt delete there are so many weird names and processes that none of us know what they are. How can you be so sure none of our computers were hijacked and running eq?
  10. Lisfin Journeyman

    Did you check the link under that one? Just because google only has 2 definitions, does not mean Merriam-Webster dictionary definition is wrong. In fact I even listed those definitions, so not sure why you listed them again.

    Definition of riposte
    1 : a fencer's quick return thrust following a parry
    2 : a retaliatory verbal sally : retort
    3 : a retaliatory maneuver or measure

    You said "(how would you riposte a wildly errant miss?)"
    Definition 3 : a retaliatory maneuver or measure, would be HOW.


    What does a riposte on miss have anything to do with shakerpaging than?
  11. Lisfin Journeyman

    I do understand that, but my point is, changing 4 computations per attack is not going to make any difference.

    Does the staff/dev teams have any benchmarks to show this has a significant impact? If so It would be nice to hear that, otherwise I highly doubt changing 4 math checks per attack will help much with server performance as a whole.
  12. Lisfin Journeyman

    So what this is showing is to reduce server load, they just make PCs hit their target less often AKA not riposte on miss. That way it stops all the offense/defense checks the riposte would of created. Ya great way to do it, instead of using our money to upgrade to better servers.
  13. Machen New Member


    So is your theory that they are lying about it?

    I'm sure DBG knows how many riposte checks are made on each server every second. Probably thousands. Maybe significantly more if someone is riposte pulling. If they are at the point of needing to make small, incremental changes to the combat code to increase server performance, I don't know why anyone would argue against that. Obviously the servers don't perform well all the time. I would bet DBG staff know more about why than we do, and if they say a change will improve things, I don't see any reason to doubt them.
  14. Lisfin Journeyman

    I would not say they are lying about it, but maybe misguided. Maybe they do have benchmarks showing it makes a difference but I highly doubt it.It would be nice for them to come out and say on large pulls it can reduce processor time by this amount of %.

    The dodge/parry/rip/block should be 4 extremely fast comparison checks to variables that are cached AKA little time saved when removing only these 4.

    The only way this would help is because you are not doing a extra attack. When you riposte and attack a mob it creates a entirely new attack check. They are basically saying to reduce server load, we reduced your chances to attack which I am not ok with.

    We pay for this game and we should not be forced to compromise game play that has minimal effect on the servers for the sole reason of server stability.

    One. Because its a big change for combat vs lower lvl monsters.
    Two. what if they soon say we want to reduce attack speed, to many attacks are causing the server to lag. Attack speed for everyone reduced 10-50%
    Three. There are so many more important things that they could do to fix server stability and changing the attack code to skip 4 extremely fast comparisons is not a good fix.

    Have you been playing the last couple years? Have you seen what DBG has done over them years? Why would you have any faith in that company when they have repeated shown they don't know what they are doing.
    There is plenty of reason to doubt them considering their current track record.
    Venalin likes this.
  15. Machen New Member


    I don't disagree with this on many issues. They have consistently made some rather poor decisions lately. However, I don't think that's reason to question everything they say. Even if it is, we are 100% dependent on what they say if we want to have any information at all about certain aspects of the game. None of us is in a position to evaluate what change this might actually have on server stability. Even with a fairly high level of programming knowledge and detailed tracking of everything they have ever posted about this, at the end of the day any end user is just speculating. Given that, demanding that they post their benchmark tests is pretty absurd. If we are at that level of skepticism, then we have no reason to believe they didn't doctor the benchmark results as well. Personally, I think if people are at that point they should just stop giving money to DBG.
  16. Accipiter Old Timer

    I love how random EQ players know all about DBGs software, technology and server infrastructure and can make informed posts based on that information. :rolleyes:
    Belexes, Smokezz and Dythan like this.
  17. Korzu111 Elder

    Does this impact monsters too? If my attack was going to miss, they won’t riptoise either?
  18. Machen New Member


    Apparently yes it does.
  19. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    Oh look live servers ruining TLPs again.

    Can't you'll just delete any server past TSS. Not like anyone plays on them anyways. That would reduce the lag for the rest of us from the sounds of it.

    Thanks in advance.
    WTBPvpTLP likes this.
  20. Korzu111 Elder

    Seems like a fair trade. My tank won’t need as much healing so my Druid can DPS more.