20% is too much cost for fade

So let's talk about ever quest and the mindset of the players.

If you say I need 20% to fade, then my mana pool now goes from 100% usable to 80% usable. Burns are up all the time, yet we "save" them until we need them. My druid will never use fade with the cost being so high. I mean never; because he never has 20% mana. I use it til it's gone, then I med for it to be full and use it again. Anyways, I'll evac not fade; so refund the aa's and just take it away if it's going to cost 20%.

Anyways the point that I was going to make with this is:
The fade should remove all mana/endurance if less than 20% total, but it should work. For instance if I am at 15% mana I shouldn't not be able to use the ability. I should still be able to use it, just have a 0% mana pool when it's done.

Take a look at the shammy mana pool. Half the time a good shammy is spiritual channeling using their hit points for mana. 20 bucks says that the fade will just "not work" and won't take from their hit point pool.

The cost of 20% is too steep. The "need" to have the escape is too great. Reguardless of how silly it is people will stop using mana/endurance at 20% because they need to save it for fade.

Rethink the cost and come up with another solution.

The question noone has answered is is it 20% of total mana/end or 20% of remaining ?

20% remaining would actually make sense, but I doubt that's it.

It's so incredibly unreasonable I don't even want to bother going into saying more than that. The same goes for the ludicrous timers.

Yeah 20%, especially if you are a ranger that is always low on mana, and uses cover tracks to break mobs to pull to camp. Its mind boggling!

That is the worst way to break up mobs.

Actually snare cover tracks, wait for unsnared adds to walk away because snared mob will stay put, is the best way Belexes. Either way, I agree that the nerf to fades is bunk. Lets also if we are being fair and trying to equalize this fade business...lets have feign death have a 10 minute timer on it also. Or have they gone and done that now too?

No, the best way changes depending on mobs. You can snare, then fluster and bluster to park. You can use Harm Arrow to pull singles.

You can vinelash group of mobs, snare them all and punt them in all different directions and then pull the one you want and have the others waiting.

If two are together, snare one and then punt it and bring the other to the group. Cover tracks is not the best way to split mobs.

I could go on and on.

If this is happening cause the TLP servers abuse things, penalize them, people who have been on the (old) Live servers for a long time, leave us alone for christ sakes...

I actually like these changes. It aligns more with original EQ, yet retains the functionality that was mistakenly granted to all classes.

It was never meant to be a pulling tool.

Well not for most classes.

Was Harmonious Arrow meant to be a pulling tool? Because that got nerfed into oblivion and is almost never used, as a result. If you’re a casting ranger (or any toon, really) the fade updates mean you probably aren’t going to use them. I mean, if bards had regular mana Regen it wouldn’t surprise me if DBG was dumb enough to give them an even higher mana cost, too.

Also, if you’re going to use mana percentages, that sets a dangerous precedent for other abilities. Why does mana pool size matter anymore?

Percentage based costs mean that these abilities actually get WORSE as you 'improve' your character with better gear, AAs, etc.

You increase your mana/end pools so they cost you MORE!

But, theoretically you should be able to fade over and over because you'll never reach 0% mana with the abilities. 20% of 20% of 20% of 20%.......etc.

Now, cast one other thing ........ and you're screwed........ but percentage-based mana cost means if you have 1 mana then you should be able to cast this .

But of course, the DBG implementation will have some minimum mana cost of 20,000 mana or something ludicrous.

I have thought about this more and more, I think they want to keep the 20% making it "worse" as you gain more gear so that it has the same effect on you, only use it when its oh crap and not any other time.

% is relative and only a perception of worse when you get better gear. It will be worse on non level increasing, but on level increasing the mana of spells/endo of discs go up so that you are still casting around the same amount so it will still have the same relative effect on you, so in essence not really getting worse at all or relatively small "worse".

I am still in the camp of either do a time limiter on it or a resource, not both. This also effects endurance users more than it does casters (for the most part) as there are more ways to get mana back than endurance, except for rangers.

I mean, imagine bards... they only get the benefit from worn mana regen.... they don't even get benefit from their own mana regen songs. It's kinda ridiculous.

Have they confirmed it is 20% of current mana and not 20% of total mana?

I know a lot have been asking, just not seen a reply.

20% of current mana would make no sense.

Percentage costs make no sense anyway. You basically get worse as you improve your character!

That isn't even the issue.

What is 20% of 400000 mana? A LOT of mana.

What is 20% of 5 mana? NOT a lot of mana.

Theoretically, a percentage-based mana cost makes no sense because as long as you have 1 mana you'll be able to cast fade. I'm sure that's not what the devs are trying to do. 20% of an increasingly smaller number is still not zero.

There are more than one threads where this discussion could be had. I am going to lock this one. But here are the links to the others in case you want to continue the discussion there.

Preview of Upcoming Changes to Combat Escape AA Abilities
Framing the debate - Fade changes.