Understanding the Everquest playerbase

You are mighty arrogant. It is incredibly poor taste to downplay the financial situations of other people. I actually know a couple people that don't play EQ because they legitimately cannot afford $15/mo, let alone an additional $35 for an expansion. Just because you can't grasp it doesn't mean they're clueless. People have medical conditions, debt, child support, etc, etc.

You've made a fool out of yourself plenty in this thread, but beta access required/s you to pre-purchase the expansion. For someone like me who boxes, if I actually wanted to test what the expansion would be like, I'd have to buy it for all my characters. There's no way I'm going to front $175 just to sample an expansion for the chance a developer will listen to my feedback.

From a business perspective, beta testing puts your existing customers in a position to help you better a product so more people will buy it. That's why it's traditionally offered for free or enormously discounted for early access.

Then they are fiscally responcible enough to understand they should not be playing EQ. Good. Thats what I am talking about. Good for them.

All you need is one. There are so many other people in beta testing it you literally only need 1. And you will be able to find grps pretty easily .. I promise you that.

And yes I may have been wrong about TBL beta.. but I am pretty sure one of the last couple of beta's they opened up for EVERYONE to join in .. guess I just cant remember which it was.

The fact that I say people who can't afford to put away less then 4 dollars a month for a year does not make me arrogant.

The fact that I say people who cant budget well enough in a year's time prolly should not be playing EQ does not make me arrogant.

If they truly have that big of issue with money.. the issue no longer is .. This games too expensive.. its literally they ought not be doing things with their money they can not afford..

thats me saying take care of your self first .. How in any way possible is this arrogant ?

Actually you should probably just stop telling people about their situations etc and assume they know it better then you.

Who made you the Boss with the right to tell people how to spend their money why they should spend it and what they think is too expensive.

Really Whulf dont be money shaming anyone. It is silly and doesn't make you look good.

I can easily understand that for some folks buying or not buying an expansion on any given year is a big financial choice. I just think callous responses don't help anyone.

So if you were trying to find out as much as you can about your playerbase to base future expansions on what kind of questions would you ask?

I am assuming they can get things like average age of players and such from their data but if not add stuff like that to the questions.

Stuff like this could be turned into multiple choice questions but it can be hard not to add bias in what and how you ask things.

Do you buy the newest expansion every year? If not why?

What stops you from buying an expansion?

How did you rate the last expansion?

What would you like to see in the next expansion

Was the last expansion too hard too easy or just right?

Did you recently return to Everquest?

If you recently returned what made things easy or hard for you on Live or TLP server?


And when they look at the answers I would also tag the info with information on the account... Long time player short time player intermittent player. Now all players input is desired and needed but answer could be weighed differently knowing the type of player you have.

Instead of being a debbie downer and just shouting about doing beta lets come up with a lot of questions and maybe the devs will make use of them to better tune things to the playerbase. I mean more info should be a good thing right? Beta is useful but polls might be useful too. If DBG was more in the money I would love to see focus groups but I don't think that is in the cards.

Its the point. The point of the fact they used to allow you to join to do beta test free.

And the point they are getting feed back only from those who did pay.

It should not matter if you can or cannot pay - it matters that this is not making an equal input to the game.

No, I don't have the extra cash. To help any company test their product? Nope. Pay to voice my opinion? Nope.

I do however to have cash to buy expansions, crates, subscriptions on more accounts etc.

Yea, go ahead and say "then don't whine if its not what you want" Although its mostly the people who do buy all the expansions and are top raiders that whine.

I am saying they need to look to the little guys here also. Those of us who are not powerful voices in the dev's ear because we spend our money differently.

Money shaming ?

What are you a social justice type ?

I am literally caring about people.. by saying they need to take care of themselves first.

Good try tho..

One of the main reasons I continue to play is the lack of other quality first-player mmorpgs. I have tried most/many of the mmorpgs that have come out since EQ, but with almost all of them having first-person play as an afterthought (at best), I rarely last longer than a month or two.

I think basing future expansions on someone like me is a non-issue. I'll buy them whether or not I "should" based on past history of expansions. For example, if I had any willpower to withhold purchase of an expansion, TBL was the perfect candidate.

I think the more apropos question is . . . what will keep a person playing the game? I would venture to guess that a very high percentage of people who choose to play the game will buy the expansions regardless of whether or not they use them in any meaningful way.

Phony altruism, great. If you truly feel that way, try not to be such a jerk with almost everything you post.

How am I being a jerk ? Because I bring it up ? Did I put anyone down ? Did I insult anyone in any way shape or form ?

Perhaps you can show me where if I did .. any of the above?

This thread has completely gone off the rails.

No way am I paying a company to beta test their product. If, they actually want feedback they’ll stop being cheap. Whatever, it is they put out live and when I make my choice. If it sucks, I don’t play as much and if it’s good I enjoy. Fortunately, Everquest is like taxes you can expect it every year.

EQ is a service, like any other service you pay for it. It’s a steal considering how many hours I get from my sub compared to other things like Netflix, Hulu, or HBO.

I don’t really get this thread. Almost every open beta for a game I’ve played had me pay for “early access”. That’s actually the norm for a lot of games from small established studios these days. Even Minecraft had you pay for Alpha build access.

DBG’s recent monetization hasn’t been bad at all, now DBG’s monetization approach might be better than most, especially compared to Activision, EA, and Bethesda. The only things I’ve bought in game beyond my sub and expansions have been cosmetic, micro transactions are not necessary. I know what I need to pay to experience the game with an even footing and I’m not forced to buy a perk or loot box to advance every other night.

Play Star Trek Online, now it’s just layers upon layers of microtransactions. You’ll come back to EQ and appreciate how great we have it! In brief, I’ve seen the grass on the other side and it’s brown.

We have it good and green here in EQ!

if you're going to pay for it ANYWAYS, then stop using it as an excuse to not do beta. you have the money, you just want to complain without being part of the solution.

people with attitudes like you are worthless in beta testing anyways because you don't want to help solve the problem, you want to complain about it and have someone else figure it out.

Nevermind.

For me RL has pulled me away but I have plans to return but the GMM news might push me towards other activities depending on how they handle things. Reduce the xp is fine but creating a progression and gear roadblock that those who have been able to play currently have not had to experience is unacceptable to me. I am far enough behind. Having some easy mode places is ok just like having more difficult content as we progress is healthy for the game. If there isn't anything casual friendly there is no reason to return or at least no reason to buy new expansions and support the game in that way.

There are as many reasons to do Beta as there are reasons to not do Beta. Considering the marginal benefit for someone who might already be pretty far behind, It might make sense to wait. Again its more of a preview. A dry run for what quests to get for progression or how the raids will be initially. Casual players will find little to no benefit in the beta for them directly. Say all you want to the contrary. It is ultimately up to them if they want to pay the admission to participate.

Look, not every single citizen gets to go to Washington DC to petition the government or introduce legislation etc. We elect representatives to go and facilitate that for us, so we can go about our daily business. We all hope those reps have the constituents best interests at heart as well as a clue as to what is best for the big picture. Whether or not that is entirely true is a matter for debate, but lets assume there are personal agendas in play as well just to be fair.

For EQ and Beta, its the big guilds that are representing the ALL players. Those players have the most knowledge, will know the right questions to ask and the right rocks to kick over to look for problems. They are the Subject Matter experts. Now, they have their own agendas as well, too. Just like those folks we elect and we send to DC. Those top guild representatives could also just not be listened to at all....sorta like....yah.

Still most would benefit more from a RoI member saying "Hey this is jacked up" compared to someone who is really casual who barely has a clue to start with. Yet here we may have Johnny Casual, scared and quaking in his boots since it seemed like Whulfgar could perhaps eat his children if he doesn't do Beta. So here they are in Beta. Clueless.

tl;dr

Whulfgar, if you want out of the hole (again), first you have to put down that shovel (again). You really are just making a doorknob out of yourself.

Please, let’s be nice to each other!

But in all honesty I think I’m swayed on the beta topic. I’m a casual but I never took the beta of Burning Lands seriously. Seeing that I can get boosted to the appropriate level to participate (at least temporarily on the beta server) I see no arguement not to check out and weigh in on the tuning and quests etc.

In response to your DC analogy, if you choose not to vote (or beta), then don’t complain that your voice is being ignored. The Devs won’t hear you if you don’t participate in the testing, just like how a politician won’t care about the 45% of the population that doesn’t care to vote or write their office.

Are they going to make a softball version of raiding, probably not, best case we get difficulty scaling. But if we as casuals buy the expacs more and participate in beta more, then maybe we’ll start to see some more and better solo/group content.

Again, let’s all calm down, sip a few Brasse's bitter brews and agree that it’s awesome we’re still getting new expansions after 20 years!

You seem like a nice person, Kermit, but I am not going to agree with you. Not even close. The whole "You didn't vote so you lost your right to complain" rhetoric just rubs me, and probably others the wrong way. I didn't VOTE or DO BETA. Perfectly fine with it, too. Your position expressed in your post pretty much says if you have umbrage with anything in game, however you didn't do beta or test, than you just have to suck it up. Well, calling BS on that.

I am fine with TBL so my dog is NOT in that fight. Still, others are not Ok with how TBL was handled. So the only way they have/had a voice is/was to do Beta? Really?

The current/proposed nerfs? Categorically "No" towards all that.That stuff is just bad PR..

Plus if all the candidates are crap, don't force me to pick one. Just to say I voted. I work for a living, and election day has never been a day off. Give me someone worthy of remembering to send in my absentee ballot and I am all over it like a fat kid on a cupcake. Someone running decides to show me some real leadership and I might even use a sick day to go vote in person, even thought it would be obvious to my boss. Anyway, matter of debate for another place and time....

Everytime I read a post by you, I lose brain cells.