Sk idea

Discussion in 'Tanks' started by Sithsonn, Jul 14, 2019.

  1. sojero One hit wonder

    I was simply saying you have a tool that fills in better than our terrors do for the same jobs. If i could get SK refute line to have the same initial agro as Pal I could stop using terrors or at least drop to 1 and open a spell slot.

    Your sk do it different than ours, we allow the dps classes to get their kill shots for more dps on raids, I don't rely on mc procs to do my job on a raid because I have healers healing me and if i need an epic click, I know when to use it.

    i meant that our tylix skin and touch of hemofax take 2 where your preservation takes 1.

    Tanking, we are the same, we can both tank in group and raid content, what more do you want? Easy mode? we have different ways to do the same thing, if you find (as sk did a couple xpac ago) that you cannot tank well, then address that, someone will always be better than the other in some things, but can you still do your job?

    self healing, ours is mostly random procs and timing of lifetaps and hoping it double crits, yours is just as good because you can control it and has a better base in case it doesn't crit, this is a perception issue for you I believe.

    DPS -- yeah we have been told in the past we are supposed to be the DPS tank, not gonna defend something that is working as intended.

    Agro -- really! your pallies have agro issues? you need to recheck your agro generation, you can produce as much as sk, sk just have a couple abilities to front load while pallies have better over time. I haven't seen a pally yet not be able to tank in group or raid mobs without any issues

    Mana -- yeah we have it good there, not gonna defend that

    Group healing -- yeah sk are selfish, dont want group healing

    Raid healing -- see above

    As i have said I believe you should have gotten upgrades. Each is flavored to your class. The devs haven't changed this in years because it is where they want them (effects, not the whole not upgrading crap) and if you can do a good argument to them to get them changes, good luck.

    You are downplaying the combination of abilities and how much that can effect group/raid healing and self healing. Yeah as I said, sk are king of over healing, yet you are holding that against us.
  2. Liljit Augur


    /sigh

    I never said we cannot aggro or tank. I said we are inferior to the SK. Yes, I can absolutely hold aggro vs the raid...minus an SK if he wants it.
    Your AA AE aggro abilities alone are on a 45 s refresh and you have 3 vs the 2 that paladins get on a 1.5 min timer.
    You have AE spells to load and you can load multiple to generate AE aggro.
    And if you want to rely on outside healing for AE aggro you can use harmonious.

    Yes I can absolutely tank fine. It takes more work than an SK. I underlined the easy mode comment because that is an amazing descriptor of what an SK is, the easy mode tank.

    But as a comparison, the two toons I have been parsing from are the paladin: a nearly fully raid mubhis or BiS, fully evolved chase items x4, max tear of alaris, max gnoll fortitude, artisan prize wearing, raid eyes of life of decay, raid nathsar diamond, max AA'd toon.
    VS.
    the sk: a mixed bag of raid scaleborn and group gmm, last years raid weapon/shield/2h weapon, no artisan prize, not a maxed tear, 4 pieces of chase, but not close to max, rank 1 of gnoll aa, no eyes of life and decay and a group diamond, max AA'd toon...the difference is almost 100k hp and nearly 2k shown AC in EQ in favor of the paladin.

    The SK tanks better/easier by far.
  3. sojero One hit wonder

    AE agro is out thing, stated by the devs, I wont defend design. Pally have asked for years and years and been told no. Good luck with that

    Yes sk are easier to tank because of the way our passives are designed, but it also means we cannot heal others and have no other real utility, it has almost always been that way. Again, if you can do it, then you are not broken. Are you super struggling at something? The pally that i see are not struggling at tanking or agro.


    OK, don't know what you want me to say to that, if it is, it still boils down to, can you still do it? Is it only passisve procs that are making it tank better? if so, gl getting pally passives, it will come at a hit somewhere else most likely.

    When I look at sk and pally, I see 2 classes that need the same basic healing. SK get smaller and larger spikes and pally get a good in between, when you average them all out you get around the same (not exactly, but i hope you get the idea) and I think** that is where the devs are trying to keep us. pally middle ground with control and sk spiky with less control, but overall the same in the end.

    pally being able to heal others where sk cant, so sk get the dps added from ours. I could be way off, but until the aa and spell dev come on and say something, we are under speculation.

    And yeah when sk go full melee burn + epic + defensives were almost unkillable in raid for that 1.5 to 2 mins, but so are pally when they stack all their stuff and defensives, the problem is we all have the same end result just different ways of getting there. Pallies just usually don't stack as much because theirs can benefit the group and so its better for them to space stuff out. at least from the ones I play with, but maybe the ones in my guild are crap, and ill accept that :eek:
  4. Liljit Augur

    1. Pallies don't stack as much because our disc time is not near 100% like SKs. So we are required to spread it around.

    2. SKs are spiky? Do you even play an SK or a paladin for that matter, of the two, paladin's spike far more than an SK.

    3. There is a large obvious gap between the two classes. Yes they can both get the job done, but the divide is massive in work put in.

    I challenge all of you who say that SKs are fine....go make a paladin.
  5. sojero One hit wonder


    Other than reavers bargin that has a 20 min refresh on it, sk and pal have the same uptime for discs.

    I meant spikes of incoming healing on a graph from self healing only.
    When you look at damage spikes, we are around the same, have looked at many times before.

    Really about the amount of work? I am constantly clicking and casting spells, I would say I put in just as much work as anyone else. There is not a time i am not doing something, planning for spikes and everything else. I don't think any class isn't doing that, at least if they are good.

    I have a paladin, though it is way behind on its aa. I recently leveled my wives pally up to 110 and have been working aa. Just for funs for when she has time to play. pally and sk make a good duo :) Pally bring an epic f ton to that combo.
  6. Sithsonn Elder

    This is too much for my tiny brain to handle, thanks Allayna again, its always fun to hear you complain about the Sk class! Makes me enjoy logging in just that much more to come raid for you!
    Liljit likes this.
  7. yepmetoo Abazzagorath

    SKs are OP. Enjoy it.

    Paladin AE aggro stinks, its a feature, deal with it.

    Paladin single target aggro needs an overhaul. If you play with good dps, its a crapshoot keeping aggro (good luck on some of these magic resistant TBL mobs, couple resists and you're behind unless you get a lucky taunt). Its going to get worse going to level 115 if we just get cut and paste % increases. Then paladins in worse guilds will start to see the same thing.

    Paladin dps needs a boost. But our base dps isn't where we need it. We need something to be synergistic better. Something that gives us a bigger increase with stuff going on a burn. A real burn disc on a separate timer from pureforge (put it on the same timer as deflection, make the paladin choose). Rework our alliance spell to make it worth a debuff slot. I don't know, something.

    SKs just need to hope they aren't nerfed. Expect dps classes to come after you hard in beta trying to prevent boosts or get nerfs in, because SKs are nearly as good as a real dps class (at times) right now, its seriously OP.

    No hate from me, ride that gravy train as long as they let you.
    Petalonyx likes this.
  8. Sithsonn Elder

    You guys care too much, just go have fun, play the game and shoot it, make an sk. Sorry pallies are not sks, and sks are not pallies. Apples to oranges, different sides of the spectrum of tanking and healing.
  9. yepmetoo Abazzagorath

    One thing that stinks for paladins right now is our healing is superfluous, whereas it used to be a raiding strength.

    Need warrior self healing and healer alliances nerfed for that to ever be useful again beyond as a fill in.
  10. Sithsonn Elder

  11. yepmetoo Abazzagorath

    Warrior dps? Who cares.

    And I never said warrior dps wasn't OP either. But you should be doing 50-80% more than a warrior in the same situation. At least.

    I don't care how much more you do than paladins though. I couldn't care less. I only care about out aggroing melee dps without hoping for luck to fall my way. I only want more dps, because, well, my dps has stagnated over the past 3 years, and I feel like with mob hp increases, we should do more.

    But if you don't think the parsers of other dps classes aren't aware of what SKs can and are doing, you're in for a rude awakening this beta.
  12. Sithsonn Elder

    To reply to that, guessing you don't know any warriors, but warriors with just a bard can and have done over 400k sustained dps on ten minute fights? If you nerf shadowknights, warriors need a dps nerf lmao. Warrior fly under the radar way to much cause sks can self-heal, Sks Burst burn is best, sustained overtime dps warrior could win, sk alliances are also another reason why sks dps well. Pallies need a better alliance for sure but dont talk about sks dps without bringing the warriors in
    Sancus likes this.
  13. Sithsonn Elder

    Lmao I know they see my parses :p
  14. Sancus Augur

    Nah.
    Sithsonn likes this.
  15. Sithsonn Elder

    But in a Dps group you expect parses to be ? How dare you!
  16. Sithsonn Elder

    And the mortal coil proc on raids is hilarious happens like 1/20 raids unless we are talking about mearatas! BANESS=$$=Mortal coil!
    Xeladom likes this.
  17. Sithsonn Elder

    Crazy pally banes from all there stuns tho, how many stuns in a lineup can you have? what about group heals?
  18. Sithsonn Elder

  19. sojero One hit wonder


    Yeah sk are king of burst, warriors are king of sustained right now. Paladin alliance is exactly half ours in added to spell damage and fulmination, they should bring it up to 3/4.

    From what you said earlier you guys have 4 unicorn lovers and 2 amazknights. in my guild we have 2 unicorn lovers and 4 amazknights and one more sh*tknight that can help alliance and proc sometimes :) so we have alliance running a good bit of the time, helps the dps.
    Sithsonn likes this.
  20. Zurril Elder

    Look at all of these wonderful SK Ideas!

    5 pages worth. So much room for activities...
    Xeladom likes this.