Dbg, would this fix all the charm exploits?

The entire premise of this thread, that there is something wrong with how charm works on some mobs, seems to be shakey at best. The devs create these mechanics, and the devs can and do turn them on and off as they wish. They are fully aware of how they work and this is their chosen design.

The devs could let you have private /picks any time they want to, which would eliminate all of your competition and "griefing" issues. The logical conclusion is that devs want to cultivate a certain amount of grief in the community. Maybe it keeps you playing longer?

Newsflash, it isn't charm that is broken. It is the pathing issue that NOW allows pets to warp to their masters. This WASN'T part of the original game, so you can take that argument off of your things you think are correct to argue. I am really getting tired of these players that have NO experience with how the game was in 1999 and how and WHY it was adjusted over the years. Stop making your feeble arguments! You make yourselves look idiotic.

The reason we are suggesting to flag named/rare monsters "immune to charm" is because they simply will not / cannot fix the pathing issue for a multitide of reasons. So, something must be done to accomodate and this is where the charm flag suggestion comes from. You may argue that something doesn't need to be done. Well, this is where you show your bias towards unfair gameplay practices. DPS racing is FINE. I encourage it. It is fair. Charm gating just isn't. It is that simple. If you cannot understand this, then you need to have a hard look at your moral and ethical values.

Also, to the argument by chanters popping up on the forums that they will NEVER get another named mob again, I will say this: Why can't you just charm another high level mob and attack said named to DPS race the other player? If you are charm gating then you must be quite familiar with gameplay mechanics, and should be perfectly capable of partaking in a fair DPS race. Also, if you know this, and you still argue that you should be able to charm/gate/warp rares, then you must just be a schmuck. If that is the case, then your opinions mean NOTHING to the rest of us, so don't bother. Now, let the adults talk about how to fix gameplay issues.

Honestly how often is this happening to you that its such a problem? 1 or 2...maybe 3 times in the history of EQ?
Is it that big of a issue that you miss out on a named mob?
There are so many other issues that are way more of a problem and need attention compared to "someone took my named mob using charm".
If this is such a problem for you you, why not dispell the charm before they gate...
Pumice = 3 sec cast time...
Gate = 5 sec cast time...
There are already ways to deal with this "issue" that are in game already.

Re-read my last couple sentences in my previous post. If you are advocating this type of behavior by suggesting that is isn't a problem, then you most likely are one of the people abusing these pathing mechanics so your opinions, once again, are worlthless to the rest of us. Requiring people to carry around dispell clickies on the off chance that some horrible player will come along and specifically abuse a pathing mechanic in order to cheaply win that which you worked you butt off trying to achieve is, well, what it sounds like, stupid. So stop making stupid suggestions. You are making yourself look like an idiot.

I have to ask you this: Do you have a problem with a fair DPS race? What is your issue with it? Also, to your point about how many times it is happening, it is happening quite alot. Try spawning and killing Quillmane with a bard in zone. Try getting the AC when there are chanters on the island. Try killing Warlord Skargus after you spawn him by finding the angry goblin up. These are just SOME of the instances where this happens. You don't seem to understand how much this is being abused or you wouldn't come on the forums and spout some nonsense.

Your acting like this happens to every person on the server on a daily basis. I have played this game since release and have never had a person use charm to "steal" a named mob. Just because it happened to you once, does not mean its a problem for the server or community.

Yes its a cheap tactic, but there are many ways to prevent it from happening. Git Gud...

As a cleric, how is DPS racing fair for me? You don't see me on here complaining about people "stealing" my named mobs when its part of the game.

As a cleric why am I required to carry around a wiz box just to win named mobs? It seems you are ok with this part of the game, but other parts of the game you call exploits.

You don't seem to understand how little this issue happens, and how many ways there are to prevent from happening to you.

Fine, you want the 1999 experience? Remove melee augs, take out every single spell revamp they have done,rework classes and the UI back to the barebones. You see, you only want to use the argument of "its not the classic experience" when it comes to something you don't like. There are PLENTY of things about this game that has been changed since 1999. Every class has a way to dispell, from potions, to items, to spells. If you get charm gated on it is 100% from your failure as a player. If you are hunting something rare, come prepared. Dont whine about it on the forums. If you REALLY want to whine about something, whine about COTH and charm. A well timed COTH with a charm has NO counter. Heres to hoping you learn and become a better player.

Charm is not an exploit.

Just because something has been around for 20 years doesn't mean it can't be an exploit. It just mean nothing has ever been done about it, but I don't think the devs have ever said it was acceptable behavior.. People have been training others for 20 years too - does that make it OK to do?

What named need to be charmable for the benefit of everyone's gameplay?

What named loot pre-PoP needs to be tradable for the benefit of everyone's gameplay?

^I think that is a short list...

Take the worst drama named, nodrop their loot and make them charm immune. Loot rights are harder to sell (especially if they turn down the decay timer from the silly raid one we have on all mobs now) and only the most sought after stuff would be perma-DPS race.

Example: all named in Lower Guk follow this new rule. Doesn't stop a leveling enchanter charming a pet and XPing, or killing the named. Also doesn't stop other shenanigans for moving mobs, but at least it puts a fork in this one kind of thread we keep getting year after year.

I remain convinced that people that don't want the named loot made nodrop just want to farm it for themselves to resell rather than seeing the bigger picture of the current toxicity in the pre-PoP zones on progression (where it is the most off-putting and causes the most forum drama).

Making named mobs uncharmable is a good step, but likely that would have to expand to placeholders too. It doesn’t happen often, but I’ve seen those who purposely charm ph’ers to grief you. What people won’t do...

Dear devs,
Please change provoke and all forms of taunt as they are being used to steal named mobs away from groups. I say make it so named mobs cannot be taunted, or their ph's, as people can use this to grief you. Its about time you fixed this exploit.

Hyperbole intended.

They already flagged the named in HS to be uncharmeable because necros were abusing their power. There is precidence.

You cannot dispell a bard that charms Quillmane/AC and runs him away. There isn't enough time to get your dispell off before it runs out of range and then warps to the bard. You cannot dspell a rare that gets charmed and then CoH warped away. There isn't time enough for your pumice stones BS. Stop assuming that there are answers to this mechanic in-game. It has been shown that there aren't. If you had enough experience with Warlord Skargus then you would know.

How does changing charm flags on a mob affect clerics at all? Stop bringing up stuff that is irrelevant. Your debate skills are feeble. Clerics cant DPS race even with rare mobs being charmable. Understand?

You aren't in areas where this happens. You can't seem to understand because your perpective is miniscule. Broaden your vision. The rest of us can see what is going on, why can't you?

Never did I say I wanted the '99 experience. Stop making incorrect assumptions. I was stating WHY the pathing mechanic came about because people had incorrect information. I was also stating what the intent of the fix to allow warping originally was. I was stating FACTS not opinion. The fact is: "charm gating" IS MANIPULATION OF GAME MECHANICS OTHER THAT INTENDED.

You people keep dancing around this point. It is simple.

Taunt in NO WAY abuses any mechanics because the mobs don't WARP to you when you get far enough away. Your feeble attempt at making a point or shining a negative light on my argument is ineffective. This just makes you look like an imbecile. It really is embarassing.

The coding manipulation required to flag all desired loot at no drop would take far too much time that the devs dont have and would have a negative effect on the game's economy. Simply flagging a certain set of named mobs as uncharmable would take a day or two at the most and it would solve this exploitation. Fixing the server's toxicity, requires policing (which we all know isn't going to happen), or it requires a bit if civility. Unlike what we see here on the forums, where a bunch of raving lunatics come and attempt to SHOUT DOWN fixes that will keep them from being total shmucks in game.

Those of you arguing that named should be allowed to be charmed simply want to abuse this mechanic to the detriment of others. You don't main clerics, that's for sure. Stop thinking that we don't see that you just want to be an arsehole to people and get away with it.

There are answers. Well, one answer. Mage can summon a staff with an instant click dispell. You can beat any method to get the mob away if you are quick enough to click.

most named mobs are already flagged as rare, you consider them, it says they are rare. Why not just flag all rare tagged mobs as charm immune?

Really? Mage summoned staves? Please.

Really? You think this feature of the game should be changed just because you personally can't deal with it? Please.

Why don't you or one of your friends roll an enchanter like everybody else?

Way to build straw-man arguments...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Straw_man

1st...First you were complaining about charm and gate, now you are complaining about bards who don't even have gate.

2nd... A bards charm takes 3 seconds to cast and has a range of 200, how is he 600+ range away at the same time the charm lands to make the mob warp to him and still be in range of the spell?... Its not possible, stop making up things.

3rd... Why are you not engaged on the mob when he comes running up to charm, you should see him near the mob and be ready to cast dispel. You can read what spells other people are casting now days, you should already have the dispel being cast as soon as you see him start casting his charm spell. Like I said before, you just need to git gud, and quit complaining about people playing the game using the tools they were given.

4th... What do you expect from a server like Mangler where you have thousands of people in maybe 5 end game zones. Its going to be contested. This is what you signed up for. You are not entitled to named mobs just because you seen them first. Yet another TLP starting in classic with 3 month unlocks was a terrible idea. Its always a troll fest, and charm has very little to do with it.


You asked me a question, and I answered it.

Stop trying to create another straw-man argument. Your question and my answer had nothing to do with charm, stop moving the goal posts...

You asked me if I thought DPS racing was fair, and as a cleric main, I said its not fair to clerics, yet you don't see me asking them to change it.

Yes I main a cleric, i am not sure why that is so hard to believe. Maybe I am just use to people stealing my named mobs because I cant DPS them down enough in time. Is it unfair to me? Should I make them change the DPS race rules because I cant win named mobs? Honestly, its part of the game, you get some you lose some. You don't see me on here crying about people out DPSing my cleric and taking my named.

You seem to be very entitled and expect everything to just be given to you with little or no effort. Maybe WOW might be more fun for you.