A long time ago I knew if I was in the sweet spot and in the back of the mob by how many backstabs would land. Nowadays the numbers roll by too fast for me to tell. Since I know that other classes also try and dps from the backside. I am posting this here instead of in the mellee discussion. So my question is how does one tell what side of the mob they are on? I am looking for a target ring that has distinct differences between the front of the mob and the back of the mob. I am also looking for suggestions from others on the best way how to tell what side of the mob your on. Right now my best indicator is to look at health of target's target and get on the other side away from that guy. Is there a better way? Thanks!
I don't know if target rings work that way (they may not rotate with mobs?). But what you describe sounds like it would be useful. Maybe a GINA trigger for the fail message would help? I use triggers to tell me when one of my toons is out of melee range, doesn't have a target, etc. Of course that's a little "after the fact", but it's better than nothing. I don't know of anything else, other than the visual cues you already mentioned. The Target's Target window is my favorite EQ window of all time.
have the leader of your group or raid /mark the tank, putting a persistent "target ring" on him. Line up your actual target ring between your character & the tank : voilà. If the tank you group or raid with is prone to losing agro, well, get new friends.
While staring at the tank tanking is the best indicator, it's not always possible to pick him out of the group without him being marked. Personally, I scan my hit messages for Strikethrough. I *USED* to have the strikethrough messages filtered into a window in a specific color, so just seeing that color scrolling in that window told me to move. Since they took that out, I have to actually read/scan the messages at the end of my hits. However, I generally strikethrough in sufficient quantities that that's not actually hard to do. A ring that made it evident would be champ.
Two pieces of unsolicited advice, in case they are relevant: Always play in 3rd-person or, even better, "git gud" at constantly switching views. I think switching views and moving the camera should be as natural as turning left or right. Playing only in 1st-person might be good for role playing and immersion, but it lets your friends down in a raid. Everybody in the raid should be on the back side of the mob, except the tank(s). Everybody does more DPS when standing behind the mob, not just rogues. Generally speaking, the tank should be easy to pick out. I mention these, not so much because YOU might be playing in 1st-person or not standing behind the mob, but because it sounds like some people in your raid force might be. Educating them might help your problems AND increase your raid's DPS.
Question- if you attack a mob from the side, is it the same as attacking from behind? Or like the front and you get riposte? Or a third scenario?
Should be and are are two very different things. I've encouraged folks to shift, but I can't force them. I even pointed out that a rogue in the group adds 5% to melee damage every 5 mins for everyone on the back of the mob. *shrug* I used to play in first person on my druid. I've used third person with constant micro-shifts since I switched to the rogue. I can't see how anyone can play first person anymore, tbh.
I *think* it works like this: Your angle relative to the mob is measured by a 360 degree circle. 180 of the degrees are considered frontal arc, and the other 180 are considered rear arc. It is not technically possible to attack from a point that doesn't fall into one of those two arcs. If degrees 1-180 are the front arc, the 180th degree would be the technical "side" of the mob, but it registers as a frontal attack. The 360th degree would be the other "side" and register as a back attack.
Depends. I wish I could draw a picture. If you're too far forward of center line, you may as well be in front, for all intents and purposes. You get riposted, you take frontal AE's, etc. If you're too far behind the center line of the mob, it's like being behind it; rear AE's and backstabs. Directly on the centerline... I'm not real sure. I don't think I've ever actually found it. Except for those stupid snails in Reparm. I don't get strikethru messages like I do in the front, I don't get backstabs like I do in the back, and I don't take damage from EITHER of the AE's. So it doesn't suck, but it's not rogue heaven, either. I'm not sure, but I don't think the damage boost from Shadow's Flanking applies.
I've too lazy to look up those particular effects, but for directional AE's in general: In ZAM's raw spell data are sections for cone_start_angle and cone_end_angle. These are 360 degree measurements in a circle around the mob. Most frontal AE's have cone_start_angle at 300 and cone_end_angle at 60. So basically 1/3 of the arc (in the front) is covered by the AE, and 2/3 (in the rear) is not covered. An easy example to see the full cone arcs, Ashenback has 4 directional AE's. Frontal AE covers 120 degrees, rear covers 120 degrees, both sides cover 90 degrees each. Right AE - start 225, end 315 Left AE - start 45, end 135 Front AE - start 300, end 60 Rear AE - start 120, end 240
This seemed like such a simple question at first: 180 degrees in front and back. But it is interesting that you could find a spot where where you get neither backstab nor strikethrough messages. How does it work out on something easily testable, like the combat dummies? I would not have thought that there would be any way to be directly on the centerline; I assumed the game always determines that you are in front or behind. But maybe the "front" and "rear" arcs are not a full 180 degrees? Or maybe the arcs are different for different mobs (or maybe the snails are just nuts, lol)? Or maybe Backstab has a special "rear" arc that is less than 180 degrees?
You're not wrong - tho I think some have wider cones than others. These seem to be very wide cones indeed. Altho we also get 2 of them at once, and stacking them isn't an exact science. Finding that sweet spot can be stupid hard.
The true rear arc for backstab doesn't SEEM to be the full 180. To be fair, I haven't parsed it, so it could very well be a case of confirmation bias. I *think* I remember reading (years ago) that it was something like 160 degree arc.
Also, if you attack from the rear you take no ripostes. So means you take less damage and need less healing and less resses.
But there are no cows on Norrath! [Fanra wonders where the milk comes from, decides he doesn't want to know.]
