@Dev - The Classic Era Experience

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Coirnav, May 9, 2019.

  1. Coirnav Augur

    Hi Dev Team,

    Over the last years of TLPs every new server I have seen content be removed from the classic experience. At some points I think we can all agree that these things are warranted because they brought some abilities and items to the classic game that really did not belong. But I feel like the rate at which content has been taken from us in the classic era is starting to make classic feel a bit.. empty, and hollow.

    I know this isn't a full list, but here are some examples of changes that were made to classic content over the years, for better or worse:

    Plane of Hate Tier 2 mob loot removed - Ragefire
    The armor needed to go away, but the non armor items like healers earring and Hate Crystal were perfectly fine due to their rarity and gave players a good reason to farm the hardest mobs in hate.

    Dark Elvs in Kithicor removed - Phinny/Mangler Server Changes
    Not all their loot was out of era for level 50 content

    Focused Effects being removed from items until Luclin - Mangler
    This change essential eliminates dozens and dozens of previously sought after quests and areas of grouping/farming as viable for players, and thus causes the world to shrink in on itself because people now have no reason to visit certain areas of the game.

    Veeshan's Peak group named loot all removed from the game entirely - Lockjaw
    Because of these changes...Veeshan's Peak is basically pointless even as a raid zone. A guild can farm it... or not and still be at the same power level going into Velious. There is almost no incentive to go to VP anymore due to this change and the removal of the focus effects on PD items which is supposed to be the best zone in the entire Kunark expansion. I won't even be pushing my guild to key for VP and will just focus on Farming Trakanon/VS/Dragons all expansion because VP is now so irrelevant. If we get in there great, if not, it will change nothing come Velious. Maybe add the group loot back in?

    -

    I'm sure other people can chime in with changes I missed, and the trolls can flood the forums with hate and opposing P99 style opinions... But content keeps getting taken away from us, and eventually playing classic on a TLP will feel empty and pointless to more and more people if this trend of taking content away continues. Some content is locked to future expansions after the prime time that these zones are utilized by players, and thus some of the loot even if added in later is just irrelevant at that point. It feels..bad. I feel like the world is closing in on itself and every server there is less and less reason to venture into certain areas of the game. Classic, and even Kunark in some ways are starting to feel very empty and hollow as a result.

    Is this something the Dev team has considered with the amount of content that has been striped from these expansions?

    I mean, I get it that in general we like to lock things to expansions that they were released in, but I think there is a design difference between how things used to be.. and sticking to that at all costs even if it is horrible for the players and how they experience the content, and how things would have been intended to be if you could have done it over again.

    I feel passionately that there is a much better game-play experience for the Classic-Velious ERA TLPs just sitting below the surface of this TLP framework we have now, and with a little Design discussion it could be so much better for everyone.

    I just think in the end that re-evaluating some of the decisions that were made to remove content from the game could result in a better game than what these Classic TLP experiences have become. I have remorse because I lobbied for some of these changes myself on these forums over the last 12 years...and I was wrong, I'll admit it 100%. Reflecting on the long list of changes has made me realize that some of these early expansions are just so much more fun when a slightly looser approach to what content is allowed in each era.
  2. Selo_slinky New Member

    spill anyone's real life info lately?
  3. Accipiter Old Timer


    Has Mabbu been a bad boy?

    Edit: OK, ridiculous question. Let me try again: What has Mabbu done this time? ;)
  4. Justaguy New Member

    Can we stay on topic rather than just troll the poster? He is actually making a good point.
  5. HoodenShuklak Augur

    The changes listed are all very classic.

    Dark elf loot needed to go.

    Vp would be worth raiding if the key wasn't so toxic. So, fix the key like they fixed seb key.
  6. Arrk Augur

    Anything that combats the KR botter farmers needs to happen.

    HG plat needs to be nerfed.

    Loot needs to require the person to be in the group when it died to loot the item (no opening the corpse).

    Basically, remove all incentives for botters... that needs to happen.
  7. BlueberryWerewolf Augur

    Changing loot rules probably can't be server-specific and wouldn't actually stop or even slow down bot farmers.

    Make everything No Drop? Just sell LR
    Make grouping required? Just sell group spots

    There are not many mechanical changes that will actually impede botting that don't also cripple legitimate play. If you want to stop botting, go after the botters.
  8. Selo_slinky New Member


    drama during the selos race. he outted real life personal info of someone to "make a point" and thinks it is a totally normal and okay to do. this isn't the first time he's done it either. he's mentally ill.

    doesn't matter how much of a good point he makes if the guy is single handedly responsible for risking people's lives.
  9. Coirnav Augur


    This...is...GOLD
  10. Justaguy New Member

    Saw the post you are talking about, my opinion? Don't be a racist pig and you won't have to worry about someone sharing your posts.
  11. Shenaniganz New Member

    Very valid points it’s a shame the people in here that have so much hate they feel the need to bash the post regardless of its intended purpose.

    And risking someone’s life? Lol just lol I hope you felt stupid typing that @selo
  12. Proh New Member

    The Focus Effects on mangler being removed was because they wanted a "Hardcore" server with what was terrible exp and death penalties. Now that they fixed Mangler, If anything was changed. Bringing Focus Effects back would be a nice revert.
  13. jeskola pheerie

  14. Guzzle Augur

    I feel like the only reason people are concerned with not being able to farm focus effect enabled items, which caused their value to soar, is because now they can't just farm those items to generate krono.

    Removing focus effects has made gearing far more interesting, and I'm seeing a lot more items that wouldn't normally be used because they're so underpowered with focus effects.

    As far as VP goes, I completely agree with that. We arent really super interested in VP because the key is a hassle to get without much of a carrot on the stick to chase. Adding focus effects to make a few items worth it certainly isn't the answer. However, there is still value in clearing it at some point with some regularity - similar to Sky, there is a lot of good stuff that lasts quite a while from there.
    Tymeless likes this.
  15. Tymeless Augur


    The keying of VP is something that has us considering not going after it either even though it is completely in our ability to do but the loot in there isn't game changing and the key is such a cluster that we wonder if our time and effort wouldn't be better spent elsewhere?
  16. Aegir Augur

    What made VP and most Kunark raid stuff obsolete was the Epic Quests. We were all drooling on Zam about the VP loot before Epic Quests were starting to get completed around October/November leading up to the release of Velious in start december 2000 - some even got completed after Velious? But that's due to poor design especially for Wizard Epic (Cazic Skin, bring back nightmares here).

    So devs could lock Epic Quests until 60-70 days into a 90 days Unlock Server for Kunark for Immersion.

    99% of the players on mangler would probably be against this though!
  17. BlueberryWerewolf Augur

    Don't worry, the bot armies will ensure almost no one on Mangler gets to finish their Epics in-era anyway.
  18. Phinwarz New Member

    OP talks about preserving the classic era then every single point is about preserving things that aren't classic in the slightest. This thread should be deleted by OP for the shame it brings. If you're mad they cut your ability to farm Krono, just say so, don't hide behind The Classic Experience (TM).
  19. taliefer Augur

    and yet we are getting extended target windows, which are totally classic

    if we wanted a pure classic experience, we'd all be playing on P99 which is much closer to that than TLPs.

    i'd much prefer they take the approach of "does this make sense to be in classic" rather than "not classic X it." i think itd make for a better game.

    using the dark elves in kithicor example, nothing they dropped was out of line power wise for classic era, and in fact it all turns to garbage once kunark is in. restricting them to kunark "cause not classic" doesnt make sense to me.

    sidenote about focus effects..its had 0 impact on pure krono farmers. see all the posts about automated campers on these forums or go zone in to rathe mountains. the krono farm just shifted to pure plat camps
  20. taliefer Augur



    he never talks about wanting to preserve classic, quite the opposite. he is talking about how the need to "classic" has made the TLPs overall worse and that there should be a balance on changing things. yes, some things were drastically overpowered for classic and should have been removed. but at some point you are taking some things out of the game for no good reason other than "not classic" even if they fit into the classic world perfectly fine