Prayer shawl

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by plobb, Apr 25, 2019.

  1. Jhenna_BB Proudly Prestigious Pointed Purveyor of Pincusions

    I don't know if that all true, Sancus. Rng is rng and all but it's hard to argue with those long afk parses like that. Where do you get the mod doesn't crit? I'm not an EQ codemonkey. It's not obvious to me from reading the effect lines on sites that show you that information.
  2. Brohg Augur

    The SPA employed, SPA418, is the same as bst Bestial (+158, always on), mnk Earthforce (164) & Eye of the Storm (374) abilities with hecka high uptime, war Offensive, couple other things, notably Troubador's Synergy with a *45000* mod. Besides others' experience of Brell's Shawl not matching your results, if that mod were functioning as you describe then every use of Sathir's Insult would be equivalent to focusing a Stellaser on the enemy with orbital mirrors. Continents would crack. Automatic max melee hit (that's 9M now?) from the entire group every 5s.
    Sancus likes this.
  3. Sancus Augur

    Monk 2HB melee hit frequency on a combat dummy; max non-lucky critical hit is 32278:

    [IMG]

    Add in Earthforce Disc Rk. III (164 point SPA 418 mod, as Brohg mentioned), max non-lucky critical hit is 32442

    [IMG]

    32442 - 32278 = 164
  4. I_Love_My_Bandwidth Mercslayer

    No, you're not. But it's entirely possible you're the only one that never checks your evolving items. Laziness is a killer.
  5. svann Augur

    RE: shawl
    I dont believe its 8k dps no matter what your anonymous ranger friend told you. But that number is irrelevant anyway. The only good way to know whether it is still "worth it" is parse it yourself then trade it out for your best banked aug to compare the difference. What I am seeing is that it is still slightly better than the conflagrant gem of security.
  6. Jondalar Augur

    Hmmmm last i checked they don't have type 3 slots. Did I miss something?
  7. Thrillho Augur

    I had a feeling you were a monk all along!
    Sancus likes this.
  8. RPoo Augur

    I used the tanky one forever. In the last month I've switched to the castery mana return. Speaks volumes of our former glory.
  9. Boze TLP complaint factory

    Can someone explain proc rates on the caster/priest shawls to me? I just finished 7th and weighing switching from melee. For example, on the priest version from eq resource

    Cast on Spell Use: Brell's Blessed Soothing Wave (Base 8% Chance) Variable chance to proc: Spell Cast Time 2s=2% 3s=2.672% 4s=4% 5s=5.344%

    Base 8% so cast time, and how does cast time modify that 8%? Additively?
  10. Sancus Augur

    EQResource and Raidloot divide the Base1 value by 10; I have no idea why. If you multiply those probabilities by 10, they're accurate (e.g. a 3s cast time spell has a 26.72% chance to proc it). The formula depends on (unhastened) cast time:

    Cast Time <2.5s: 0.25 * Base1 / 100
    Cast Time is between 2.5 and 7s: (Cast Time - 1) * 0.167 * Base1 / 100
    Cast Time is >7s: (Cast Time / 7) * Base1 / 100

    The Base1 value for the shawl proc is 80, not 8.
    kizant and Boze like this.
  11. Boze TLP complaint factory

    Ahh awesome, thanks! So most BST nukes/DoTs would be at 20%.
  12. Beimeith Lord of the Game

    The reason Raidloot (and EQResource which was originally based on Raidloot) divide Base1 by 10 is that it is a shorthand of sorts. The values shown for procs are not meant to be the *actual proc rate*, nor does multiplying that value by 10 give you the correct proc rate. The numbers given are an intermediate number that you still need to plug into the overall formula.

    The formula was (not sure if it still is)

    .06 * Base1 / 10 * Normalizer (It was also affected by ProcRate set on items, but I'm not entirely sure how).

    Normalizer was as follows:

    < 2.5 = .25
    between 2.5 & 7 = (Cast Time - 1) * .167
    > 7 = Cast Time / 7

    So what the Parser is doing is calculating Base1 / 10 for you, and giving you examples of the Normalizer value for set cast times. Those numbers still need to be calculated together along with the .06 and the proc rate mod from the item itself to give you the actual proc rate of the spell.

    Note that like I said I'm not sure if this formula is still the same or not. I got this a LONG time ago and it was before the big proc revamp that happened afterwards, so it may be different now.
  13. Beimeith Lord of the Game

    I'll further note that when I was testing all of this (again many years ago and before the revamp) I could never get the actual proc rate in game to match the values I calculated for them. I never figured out if it was due to some bug, or if it was because the person who gave me the proc formula (I don't even remember at this point, and I don't think they work there anymore either) didn't give me the full formula. They never mentioned the item proc mod for one, I figured that out myself when I was doing testing. Most likely it was never intended to work for spell procs but it did because Everquest.

    So, really what I'm trying to say is that the only way to really know the proc rate is to actually test it yourself, in game.
  14. Sancus Augur

    Could you clarify this a bit? The closest I have to a more complete formula is from your post here. The difference between what I posted and that post are 1) you have a Base of 0.06 you multiply by because reasons and 2) you have an item proc rate modifier included.

    This formula was later discussed in another thread for kizant's DPS app here. In that thread, the given formula didn't align with our parses. The parses we do have, and the proc rates predicted by the formulas I included, are as follows:

    [IMG]

    You participated in that thread, and your last post ended with "With that in mind, I went back and tweaked the formula slightly and I believe I may have found values that are correct" although you didn't mention how you tweaked the formula. Kizant and I continued to use what I posted above, as they fit with the data we had. It seemed based on the data that the "Base" value was either not a thing or 0.10 (which is the same as dividing Base1 by 100).

    Item Proc Mods are a thing, but there are no modern weapons/augs I'm aware of that have a value other than 100 for that. The Shawl definitely doesn't. For a complete formula those should definitely be added in, although I can't confirm how they factor in as I don't have any way to test them.

    If there are other factors I'm unaware of I'd love to learn about them. That said, based on the data I do have it really does seem like you can multiply the numbers listed in the spell parser by 10 and, in the absence of an item proc modifier, reach the correct proc rate.

    Edit: You edited your post after I started writing. That formula is what was discussed in the linked thread, and it was pretty far off. Perhaps there's something more complicated going on.
    kizant likes this.
  15. Beimeith Lord of the Game


    Ah yeah, I forgot about that thread. Well, in any case, what I posted was the answer to the reason of why raidloot/eqresource calculates it the way it does, It was based on that old formula. I guess they haven't been updated since then.
  16. TenkenTurtle Elder

    For a tank it is still one of the best augs for the Range slot. There are only 2 others from the 16th anniversary raid that could be better.