Can we un-nerf solo exp now?

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Montag, Apr 10, 2019.

  1. took2summit11 Augur

    I get triggered every time I see an uninformed post like this. I don’t have any skin in the game because I box multiples anyways. But if you say quad kiting, charm kiting, fear kiting, root rotting, etc was not the fastest exp during vanilla through at least POP than you never played during this era. I played a shaman and by FAR the fastest leveling method for me was to solo. I would get about twice the AA/hr in pop HOH soloing than I would in a good group. I am excluding things like AE groups which have always been broken compared to other methods of gaining experience.

    Beyond that, A shaman/monk duo was probably the next preferred way to xp and was significantly better than being in a full group. An ench/cleric duo would get significantly more xp per hour than a full group with an ench/cleric. This is not the case the way experience works today. Duoing as a shm/monk on these TLP servers is down right painful now, when it used to be one of the fastest ways to get experience.

    You can call it a nerf to solo xp or a buff to group xp, doesn’t matter the terminology you use. The reason for this is because the experience pool used to be the same for a kill regardless of the number of people in a group, with the exception of a small bonus for a full group. If a person killed a mob solo, they got X experience. If a duo killed the same mob, they both got X/2 and so on until a full group gave I believe X+10%/6. The way experience works now is the pool of experience is something more along the lines of a solo kills gives X, a duo gives X+Y/2, a trio gives X+Z/3 etc.

    Make no mistake, soloing for the right class used to be the best way to get experience, and a strong duo like monk/shm was close behind. For better or worse, you are significantly more incentivized to group on TLPs to the point it isn’t even worth it to solo or duo I’d rather go watch a Netflix movie if you can’t find a group. I do think solo/duo xp should be buffed (NOT group xp nerfed) to where someone can still feel somewhat productive but still incentivized to add more people to their group. There has to be a better solution than be in a full group, or go watch Netflix. People that charm need not reply to this.
    Faydark likes this.
  2. Montag Augur

    [IMG]
  3. Madae Elder

    And to think, some of these people actually played launch EQ.
  4. Montag Augur

    Solo exp was nerfed by capping the % of experience that a player can gain from a single mob.
  5. took2summit11 Augur

    Just for some actual data. If I kill a mob duo in POF I get about 4-5% AA/kill. If I kill a mob in a full group in POF, I get about 4-5% AA/kill. It most certainly was not like this in live, and it still isn’t like this on live. Is this a good or bad thing? I am not sure. I am not asking for a duo to get 12% if a full group gets 4% off the same mob, which would be the equivalent. But maybe somewhere around 8% for a duo kill when a full group gets 4% would be a decent middle ground? It just makes no sense to me for a duo to get the same xp/kill that a full group gets.
  6. Machentoo Augur


    They wanted to encourage people to group. Sounds like it is working as intended.
    Skuz likes this.
  7. took2summit11 Augur

    I’ve said that since my very first post in this thread. I am just saying it’s brutally punishing for anyone that can’t find a full group that duo gives same xp per kill that a full group gives. There’s gotta be a better middle ground that still gives incentive to group.
  8. Machentoo Augur


    You aren't being punished. You get faster xp solo than you did back in the day, by a lot. You just don't get as much of a boost as groups.
  9. took2summit11 Augur

    Sorry but it doesn't make any sense to compare solo experience to some arbitrary rate in your mind from 1999. The only thing that matters is the opportunity costs of playing today. Solo, duo, full group should all be compared to rates available today.

    I am happy groups get a bonus and I always invite anyone lfg to join me and try to make a full group. I just think it's a little silly that duo xp gets the same per kill as a full group and there must be a better middle ground to not punish someone that cant find a full group. Please dont compare someone soloing today to someone soloing in 1999 and saying they arent being punished. Lol

    For instance, on live a kill in a full group gives 1AA and in a duo it gives 2AA. This makes more sense to me. Still incentivized to full group.
    Montag likes this.
  10. Montag Augur

    Yeah the problem is the scale of the difference. Everyone wants a full group to be better, we just dont want solo/duo exp to be utter trash in comparison.
  11. Pharone Elder

    I would be more bothered if you got less experience when soloing that how it is now. The fact (based on what is said in this thread at least) that you can solo and get just as good experience per kill as if you was in a group seems fine to me. If I was getting less experience soloing, then I would have an issue, but that's just me.

    As for increasing the experience per kill for someone soloing, that I personally am completely against. Anytime that you make solo experience per kill better than group experience per kill, you encourage people to not group.

    I much prefer having a community that wants to group over one that avoids grouping "because they can get faster experience by soloing".

    Just my 2 coppers.
  12. took2summit11 Augur

    I think you’re confusing experience per hour with experience per kill? If a duo gets the same experience per kill, per player, as a full group, their experience per hour will be SIGNFICANTLY less than a full group. You could make a duo get double the experience per kill that a full group gets, and the duos experience per hour would still be much less than the full group. I am a huge proponent of full group being the best experience per hour, but I am also an advocate of increasing the experience per hour for solo or duo from where it is today. There’s a very wide gap in hourly experience rates to where you could significantly boost solo/duo experience and still leave plenty of room to incentivize full group experience, leaving it the best hourly experience available.
  13. Arclyte Augur

    no one is being punished

    this game is not difficult, nor is it grindy
  14. kfour New Member

    I agree I remember playing on my Druid and solo exp was very good. In late game grouping exp was better with the tight make up, but I miss being able to solo for 100 percent of the exp. Now If you solo or you group it’s the same exp per kill its silly there is literally no point in soloing.
  15. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Isn't this all completely academic?

    By Torment of Velious mob kill XP is largely worthless, solo, grouped, doesn't matter it's completely trash by then anyway.

    The devs are not going to change the XP model anytime soon.
  16. Machen New Member


    Of course it's not completely academic. This is the TLP forum, where mob kill XP matters. Even for the few TLP players who are playing in the most recent 3-4 expansions where it no longer makes much difference and most of your XP comes from quests/tasks/etc, you still had to play through the ~20 expansions where most of your xp came from killing mobs to get there.
  17. Pikollo Augur

  18. Tweakfour17 Augur

    Isn't the 5aa per kill cap an actual programming limitation vs an arbitrarily chosen cap that could be changed on a whim? And the debs work around was just to have each expansion have ~30k AA to purchase.
  19. Pikollo Augur

    Ngreth referenced another bug post about FV may be having a higher cap. I can't find the post. I know the cap would be a hard thing to change. But also think it was another Selo oversight. Everyone talks about Selo 2.0. Hoping things like this can be looked at for it.
  20. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    I think I read somewhere on this forum that the AAXP in EoK & later expansions was capped at 5 to fix a bug with some specific mobs rewarding an AAXP value that went over some number buffer or limit that then meant the kill awarded so little xp it was like getting none.

    That may be related to why the ToV XP model was *required* as in the game cannot handle values over a certain amount without it creating bugs, so the legacy of the xp code is running up against limitations that have not been solved yet or are too costly in time/resource/coder time to fix the root problems so the devs had to create these kinds of workarounds to make the game systems continue to function at all.

    Just my take on it until I get corrected by someone more knowledgeable at least.