Group DPS Opinions For First 2-3 Xpacs

Discussion in 'Time Locked Progression Servers' started by Boxxie, Mar 2, 2019.

  1. Boxxie New Member

    Mainly looking for GROUP dps sustained during chain pulls/etc for Classic, Kunark, And Velious. Scale of 1-10 would be a good guide and also include having buffs from bard & enchanter, which I think would matter for mages/wizzies a lot?

    1. Chanter w/ Charm
    2. Mage
    3. Mage w/ Epic
    4. Monk
    5. Monk w/ Epic
    6. Necro
    7. Necro w/ Charm
    8. Shadowknight
    9. Warrior
    10. Wizard
  2. ShivanAngel Augur

    monk with epic is second only to anything that can charm... anything that can charm is tied for 1
    1. Anything with a charmed pet
    2. Monk with epic
    3. monk
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    4. Shaman actually
    5. probs mage/necro
    Koshk and Crayon123 like this.
  3. Crayon123 Augur

    Monks, Mages and Charmed Pets.. oh my!
    Brunlin likes this.
  4. vylo Augur

    An enc pet will do more damage than many full groups alone. Nothing out DPSes an enc pet until at least luclin, but it requires a lot of work.
  5. Boxxie New Member

    I get all that, but im weighing effort vs reward. Wondering how close in numbers the other ones are.
  6. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    For leveling up at the start
    1 Mage
    2 Necro
    3 Wizard
    4 Chanter
    5 Monk

    honorable mention
    Druids in places they can charm

    For level 50 in classic
    1 Necro with charm pet(probable 3rd best w/o)
    2 Mage
    3 Chanter w/ charm
    4 Wizard
    5 Monk

    At 60 in Kunark
    1 Necro with charm pet
    2 Rogue with epic
    3 Monk with epic(monks have the best burns but rogues smoke them in sustained dps)
    4 Chanter w/ charm
    5Ranger with Wurmy+Swiftwind

    Honorable Mention
    Druids w charm pet in Chardok

    At 60 in SoV
    1. Chanter with OP charm pets A Velium Hunter, Captain Bvellos(no sword) ect
    2. Rogue
    3. Monk
    4. Ranger
    5. Necro(very limited charm pets in good SoV zone for them)

    Honorable Mention
    Druid with Wolf in Kael
  7. Koshk Augur

    In a typical chain-pulling scenario, I would rank necromancers as having lower relative dps. The shorter the fight? The better the group? The faster the pulls? The less time for a necromancer to stack DoTs. In those situations, I'll usually change my necro playbook, and switch to crowd-control and support (root, snare, mez, debuff, feed mana)

    Situational, though. If fighting undead, necromancer relative DPS goes up because of the cheap undead nukes and charm.

    I agree with monks being very close to charm classes.

    I'd replace Shadowknight with a melee DPS class, like ranger or rogue. SK's cannot dual wield, and their spell DPS isn't anything noteworthy in Classic through Velious.
  8. vylo Augur

    They aren't. Reread what I said. the pets can and will out DPS full groups of noncharmers. from lvl 20 and on, enc are the highest DPS through velious for grouping, by an absolutely monstrous amount by time they hit 46. To give an idea, the velium hunter from velks quads for 205 with a delay of 20, and backstabs every 6 rounds for 650ish. In chardok, the dragoons quad for 218 on 20 delay. In the hole, the golems quad for 160, note that is a pet quadding for 160 in classic era. There is no other class that can even come close to that. A single enc is worth more than every other non healer in a group combined much of the time. Their pets tank better and DPS better than the other classes can, and enc can CC.

    There is no better class for a DPS role than enchanter up until luclin, where things start to even out.

    If you want good damage that never falls off all the way to live, you can play monk. Enc will stomp them early on, but since they are a puller and can break mez easily, they will usually have no problems getting a group.

    tl;dr enc blows everything away for first 3 expacs. after that monk starts to dominate consistently.
  9. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    In classic and Kunark Necros often charm the same mobs as chanters and have better pet hastes for them. They also have the best mana regen. Their best quick DoT before PoP is shared with Shaman and because of that was revamped. So long as E Bolt lands on the mobs they're just OP
  10. Almir Elder


    I think he understands that spell casters who are using a charmed pet are in a different dimension with respect to DPS stats. He seems to be asking, outside of charmed pets, how do all the classes pan out?
    Koshk likes this.
  11. Bewts Augur

    Monks are highest DPS potential and also best sustained as well. Even charmers will run OOM at some point despite the amazing DPS potential from
    Charm pets.

    I personally ran SK, CLR, 4x necro to good effect. Spent most of my time waiting for mobs even when I was dropping 8x lifetaps per mob (2 each). Having nukes that worked on basically anything group related made life easy. Gear limitations were minimal here and Lich was extremely helpful to sustain DPS until a camp was cleared. The ability to pump a cleric or SK meant basically 0 downtime. Ever.

    I also ran War CLR BRD 3x Ranger (epic + Wurmy). That group never had a mana problem but then again it was melee centric on DPS. While I left DPS potential on the table by not using Monks - having 3x Rangers in Luclin and PoP using EQ/AM3 extended the longevity of the setup into mid GoD and was basically point and fire setup that didn’t need to worry about positioning melee I was boxing. The best part for the Rangers was their epics covered haste from Kunark - GoD and simply adding 3 bows (had AoW bows going into Luclin) meant plentiful DPS.
  12. vylo Augur

    Ah, in that case, Monk, mage, and necro are all solid early on, though necro needs some levels (lich isa massive spike in power). Monk maintains a high standing throughout the game.
  13. vylo Augur


    What? I never run OOM charming, and that is while also CCing and maintaining buffs on my group. Specialize alteration. Charmed pets require no mana besides being hasted to beat out everyone in the group, often whole groups combined.
  14. Kaysa New Member

    Exactly. In what world will an enchanter ever run out of mana charming? It's not like you are spamming your nukes and dots.
    Enchanters are on another level even in PoP. Charming in Fire is such a blast. You haven't lived if you haven't cleared most of the zone with 2-3 charmed pets. Necro charm is good but it is so limited that you can't compare it to enchanter's version.
    Also enchanter+cleric can kill Brother Qwinn to twink your monk. No other class will ever say the same.
  15. HoodenShuklak Augur

    The enc will likely go oom a handful of times leveling up due to those rare rng charm breaks. It happens albeit rare. Most of the tune leveling on agnarr my enc was near fm.

    As others said if you want dps you want charm. 3 enc i found was the sweet spot. More than that and you simply dont have the mobs to warrant more dps.

    As a bonus a enc in fire will be godlike dps for your 65 grind. You basically plvl your group.
  16. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    And yet every server the first to 50 grp has only 1 enchanter and is chalked full of mages
    Why would a Chanter charming a Dragoon in Chardok do more damage then a Necro that has literally the same charm pet but with better haste and can tap/dot on top of that? why would you ever want a second chanter is beyond me outside of the rare zone like Velks or Tipt is beyond me.

    live forums oof
  17. Iyvy Augur

    Because two enchanters will have better uptime on charm pets, you both load your aoe stuns, when the other enchanters pet breaks you cast aoe stun for him, this allows him to charm much easier and safer. If both pets break both enchanters can aoe stun for one another. It greatly improves uptime because you don't have to mez, or waste time getting smashed on.

    Additionally enchanters get theft of thought, so they are better charmers in general, they have more mana and don't run into mana problems, a necro charming will not have mana for dots unless hes using a lower level charm. Also enchanters can tash for one another

    3 enchanters > 1 enchanter + 2 necros, because if all 3 charms break (and they can) any one enchanter can aoe stun all 3 at once with ease, or emergency aoe mez. It's a lot more controlled and less dangerous.


    Also in chardok a druid >>> a necro, because 15 minute snare on a charm pet is easy mode. Just stand out of range and recharm before it even gets near you.
  18. Umul Augur

    Casuals don't theory craft DPS setups, and no one anywhere theory crafts DPS setups for group xp'ing in everquest.

    Grow some plumbs and play what ya want. These servers get gutted every spring anyway so enjoy the ride while it lasts.

  19. WaitingforMoreEQ WaitingforTBC

    Oh, because the chanters you play with are god awful at the game and need a second chanter to hold their hand. Cool that clear things up.

    Color stun 1> tash> color stun 2> boltrans
    or Tash >color stun >boltrans
    Mezzing isn't needed

    I could chain pull with on an enchanter at LD with A Velium Hunter+Tola robe while clicking Robe of Smothering and slowing the higher level mobs with tepid on and having 3-4 mobs mezzed waiting to be killed while 2 boxing. Chanters shouldn't need help with CC in a charm group in fact they should be able to help others recharm. Necro and druids should have plenty of mana to DPS with while charming.

    ToT on CD+C2 and GoB=31 mana per tick
    AL is 35 and the Ancient version is like 44
    Thrall cost less mana then Boltran's and last twice as long
    How exactly does a chanter have more mana at 60?
  20. Iyvy Augur


    You're a noob. Just saying.

    They have more mana after 50 because of Theft of thought. Theft of thought = infinite mana for an enchanter.

    The safer/better/higher mana your charmers the better pet they can have. I'm usually running a 2 levels red pet, you can run multiple 2 levels red pets with multiple enchanters.

    Enchanters have way more mana than druids or necros.

    The more your enchanters watch each others back the faster they regain charm control and the more charm uptime they get and the better pets they can use.

    I take it you aren't running a red pet with max haste, tol robe, and proper weapons, but suffice to say you have no clue what youre talking about.

    Yes if you are using a dark blue, like a scrub, lol, you don't need help.

    Let me know when you can handle a red golem in hole at 50.

    As for druid/necro. A druid will add snare to the equation, druid is probably the best third charmer after double enchanter. Snare makes life super easy.

    Necros sorta suck, they have no magic debuff and their charm is slightly less reliable, especially on higher level mobs. Additionally their dots are high mana and mediocre damage, and why would you be using dots anyway? If you have THREE CHARMERS that are using proper pets. Not blue pets because you have no clue what you're doing, then mobs should die faster than cast + 1 tick.

    Get outta here.

    "I dont need help charming in velk's"

    Awww, that's cute.