I always viewed AC as the go to stat when I play an enchanter. Makes sense that agi is good too. There are a lot of EQ urban legends that are still believed (mostly by the P99 types) that just aren't true.
I am all for being proven wrong, but no one has done it. People have quoted math on how it is "supposed to work" but no one has actually posted parses. There are parses ad nauseum showing agility is next to worthless after 75, but there have not been any parses done showing that the old data is incorrect. This is probably due to the fact that when the changes were made people were running around with 800agi. I know that stats were changed but my personal parses from tanking on ragefire/fippy still showed agi to be only minorly effective after 75. You can quote numbers all you want but without data to back it up you wont prove the old parses wrong until you put up new ones. This is how the scientific method works, until you post data proving without a shadow of a doubt the old data is wrong, the old data will trump whatever you say, even if you are correct. There is one particular parse that showed the difference between 700agi and 950 agi... The avoidance actually was lower in the higher agi parse. I am not saying that more agi lowers your avoidance, as the number was well within standard deviation, but 250 agi made zero differenct there.
Koshk gets it. That's why I tested it while bored at Magus one day. I got to like level 4 on Coirnav before noping out and have been waiting on Agnarr ever since. I'm so stoked
If you read how the avoidance stat works from the linked post, going over cap has no effect on agi, and there's a huge section of heroic agility which overshadows regular agi, neither of which effect the TLP. Additionally you can literally see the equation (which I laid out earlier) of agility to defense skill. Agility = Defense skill in terms of effecting avoidance. 8 agility = 1 Defense skill. 5 defense skill is how much the defense cap increases with each level. Thus every 40 agility behaves as though you were a level higher. It's in the devs post on how modern armour and avoidance works since the rework. So unless your view is that DEFENSE skill doesn't effect anything, you are simply wrong. Having the equivalent of a level 54 enchanter's defense skill at level 50 is way way better than having an extra 500 hp or an extra 700 mana. Period. Go parse it if you don't believe me, but the Dev post agrees with me not you. You are WRONG. Period.
I’m not sure how you can say that definitively. If an attack rolls a hit, and an enchanter gets quaded by his pet for 2k, and has 2500 hp, obviously the stamina was a better choice in that case. Sure there may be situations where the agi provided a miss on an otherwise hit that would have killed the ench, but the frequency of each of these events is not certain. So to assert that some % of avoidance (assuming you are correct) is better than 500hp is fallacious, regardless of whether or not agility even functions as you claim it does.
if you play a melee, http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=166 is roughly 2 plat in every starting city. best bang for your buck that ive found for day 1 early weapons
In my experience two sets of pet quads is not enough to kill you as an enchanter. Pets in classic should be quading for 200x4 max. Two rounds of quading shouldn't kill you, any more than that will be healed through. Also it was very very rare to be quaded on my enchanter. In general I didn't actually take much of a beating from my pets... because I stacked the F out of agility. When the odds of a single hit hitting you go from saaaay 75% to 65% Your odds of not being missed go from (0.75)(0.75)(0.75)(0.75) = 31.6% to (0.65)(0.65)(0.65)(0.65) = 17.85% Half the likelyhood of a full quad. Since you need two rounds of full quads at least to hit you, the odds go really really really low. As the pet rounds start coming you're basically guaranteed to be hit at least once less, not to mention the mitigation the agi gives, overall a single pet break will result in more hp left from agi than from having extra hp. Also it's worth nothing that stacking agi to its max is more targetable than stamina. You get a lot of stamina for free on gear, point for point stamina is given more often on pieces you want anyway. The "max vs 75" argument is hyperbolic. What we're really looking at is 30 agi vs 30 stamina. In this case this is roughly 2-3% missed chance vs 90 hp. 90 hp is less than half a pet swing. Being missed once in any quad will cover this, and a 3% missed chance is a 12% chance per quad of an extra miss. Add in mitigation and the benefit of not being bashed and the choice is very clear. This is not even taking account the dps boost by getting your pet recharmed faster, assuming you have a competant healer you really shouldn't be at risk of dying ever, your gigapet should not be able to out dps your healer and your healer should not go oom before you have control. I have had times when I has seriously bad luck recharming and had to spam heals to keep up. I imagine that if I didn't have agi, this effect would be worse and you actually open up the possibility of being smashed/stunned so much that your healer can't keep up. When being spam healed during a bad pet break having agi is obviously the vastly superior option, and that's the far more important situation. In situations when soloing you won't have a pet that can kill you that hard and the actual dodge will reduce total hits taken which will improve your longevity and keep your hp up. Agility is objectively superior to stamina. More mangler tips: West Karana bandits provide a great source of money at a low level, they drop plenty of bronze and their sashes can be turned in for even more loot. Make sure you're relatively amicable to the karana faction paladins in south qeynos (there are other quests you can do, or just make sure your religion isn't too.... evil) Wanna meet up with boxes or other raced friends? The tunnel is likely your best bet, there is a parcel vendor there as well as a soulbinder and vendor, and lots of mobs for all levels outside. Additionally unrest near by is a great exp spot with bone chips, a good place to meet up and get going. Halflings should focus on bumblebees and save their honeycomb so that they can sell them to enchanters. Honeycomb will go for 1-3 plat each soon enough. Save your highquality bear pelts and thick grizzly skins , maybe even focus them, they make 10 slot 10% wr bags if you wont have a broker bag Along the streets of freeport are some heavy containers that you can use as free bank storage. The gnoll fang quest no longer gives good exp, but it does give excellent money... if you hand in i Halas! The halas warrior guild will give you 5 gold and a piece of 1 goldish loot, much better than qeynos There is a soulbinder in south ro near the innothule swamp entrance. If you are making the perilious run at level one, bind here first since there will be many more giants than you remembered wandering around. South ro crocs are a go to spot to this day if you just want a group and exp and not to move or worry about loot. Many of the classic armour quests are worth doing but are somewhat expensive, check the p99 wiki to see if any pieces are worth your time and plat. Many classes have seriously powerful and/or important quests in the temple of solusek ro off of lavastorm. Some integeral spells and near bis loot can be found from these quests, so look that up too. If you are planning to swap starting locations to find friends look up some delivery quests, there are a number of bard delivery quests that will give you a few gold, and if you're heading that way anyway... Kithicor is now fixed so travel during the day, hugging the wall is 99% safe... not 100% Many ZEM zones have been heavily nerfed, consider mixing up your progression path this time around, especially in the earlier levels when you want more exp. A packed crushbone with nerfed exp is probably worse than a corner of BB or steamfont you carve out for yourself. Parcel vendors can be a god send for easy trade. "tunnel quest" isn't as big a deal if you don't want it to be, remember you can join other channels like auction, general2, class channels or continent channels. "ranger gating" can be an effective way to move faster, especially pre level 5. consider smacking a guard if you need to get somewhere quickly. Download Brewall maps. Don't play a rogue! Keep your origin point in mind when choosing a race. A bad origin on a melee character can lead to some tedious runs later. And most important: Have fun ....by not playing a rogue
Stats can be important. However...you're going to be staring at your character's backside for countless hours. Now is a good time to experiment with character creation, and spend a few levels messing around. You may discover you cannot visually handle being a big-butt Ogre. Or a tiny gnome. Maybe you think certain running/standing/fighting animations are ridiculous. No racial ability is worth being unhappy with how your character feels to you. Skills are auto-granted on level-up, and most raise pretty quickly by using them (1HS, 2HS, Dodge, etc). So take your 5 skill points per level, and spend them on Trade Skills. Once all your trade skills are 20 or above, spend additional points on Bind Wound and Swimming. Those normally take a while to cap through usage alone. Melee eventually need a Magic weapon. Here's someone else's post on obtaining them. https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq/index.php?threads/how-to-obtain-first-magical-weapon.240730/ Make friends with a Mage. Magicians can summon magical daggers, starting at Level 1.
I enjoyed reading this post, wish I had words of wisdom for everyone. Glad they changed the original plans for Mangler, I might even make a Rogue now...
Not to say you’re wrong but you haven’t posted any parces or data either. All I can say is when I created a lowly lvl 1 dark elf chanter with max agi I seemed to stay alive a lot more easier
I leveled 2 enchanters to 50 on test, maxed their defensive skills and then parsed for 2 hours against 5 level 45 test dummies (equivalent to a 10 hour parse against 1). Identical gear, with the only difference that Agiparsea had a +60 agi buff. Here are the results: /GU Tanking summary for: Agiparsea(150 agi) | Total Melee | Damage: 1474747 | Avg hit: 73 | Attempts: 29946 | Dodged: 1411/29946 [4.71%] | Missed: 8418/28535 [29.5%] | Hits: 20117/28535 [70.5%] /GU Tanking summary for: Agiparseb(90 agi) | Total Melee | Damage: 1499146 | Avg hit: 73 | Attempts: 29756 | Dodged: 1478/29756 [4.97%] | Missed: 7871/28278 [27.83%] | Hits: 20407/28278 [72.17%]
Don't dumbies have obscenely high attack ratings that make them bad for parsing? 72% hitrate is really high for a level 45 mob on a level 50. Ugh do I have to dig up an enchanter on Ragefire...
So dumping 25 points into agi will reduce your chance to be hit by ~0.7%. Woopdeedoo. Thanks for actually parsing.
Against modern trainee dumbies that aren't tuned right, I guess. Also 1% miss chance vs 75 hp? I'll take 1% miss chance.
god are you a flat earther? Get shown parsed evidence proving you are wrong and you will come up with any excuse to refute it. TArget dummies must have rly high accuracy. Until you come up with a parse that says otherwise, nothing you say about agi being "king stat" is credible anymore
