Please increase other tanks abilities to match SK

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Raylen, Aug 24, 2018.

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  1. Eaedyilye More stonehive bixies.

    A warrior can tank 20+ ST mobs, can do 600K DPS (according to someone on this thread) and the warrior needs help? This game is so broken it's not funny.

    Does anyone remember many years ago where an add could mean death to the group? When a named spawned or even when something like the greater corrupted pusling spawned people freaked out. Let the casters med up. Make sure any potential add is killed before we pull it. Now its a mass pull, a named is up? Who cares, bring it all along with the dozen or more. It will die, and it does.

    The solution? Nerf malo. Yes, that was OP to the max.
  2. Brohg Augur

    All that and a warrior painted the word "credulity" on the ceiling above your computer desk! Damned warriors!
    Quatr likes this.
  3. Eaedyilye More stonehive bixies.

    I've seen warriors tank an awful lot of mobs in ST, named included. As for the 600K DPS. I've never seen a warrior get anywhere near that, but someone in this thread reported it. If they lied that's on them. Not me.

    Warriors at this point of time in EQ are at a very good place. That is a fact.
  4. Brohg Augur

    No disagreement there, but so are magicians :)

    And as far as nerfed buttons go, I don't think you can compete with the deliberate polyotomy done to Warlord's Grasp
  5. Maedhros High King

    I'm sorry that you have not witnessed the same kinds of things. That you have failed to witness or produce similar results does not mean that those results do not exist.
  6. Eaedyilye More stonehive bixies.

    Magicians are not in a bad place, we do pretty good in this day and age. When the malo nerf came out I was very irritated. Nobody wants their class nerfed. Now after playing with this a few days it's not as bad as I initially thought. Sometimes my DPS goes up slightly, sometimes down. It evens out some.

    But I don't like nerfs to any class. It kills the enjoyment. But anyway. I'll stop with the mage talk, that's for another thread.

    As for warrior, more power to them. They have a different role than me in group play. I love having warriors in my group.
  7. It's Not A Rabbit! New Member

    As a mage I'm not liking the malo nerf either. Not the end of the world though.

    I like grouping with both Warriors and SKs. I think both are really good choices. SK obviously are better for soloing. Boxing I think it depends on if you want to tank and pull too.

    I usually avoid Paladins. I just think they are a second class tank. I'm not meaning to offend the players. I don't think its them. Its the class.

    All I know is I get more XP and a lot less deaths with War and SKs tanking. Unless they give a real big boost to Paladin aggro I don't see this changing. Keeping others from being hit is way way better than having a heal for when they are.
  8. Tubbycat Journeyman

    Warriors are absolutely doing 600k+ dps on FF and ST1 raids when placed in DPS groups. I'm surprised we've gone this long without a nerf thread. Warrior dps is absurd at the moment, esp. compared to their knight counterparts.

    I encourage all guilds beating ST1 and FF raid events under 300-350 seconds or so to try putting their best DPS warriors in DPS groups during these events. If your warriors are competent, you'll probably be surprised at the results. For extra saltiness, have those warriors link their parses in group. At 600k+ dps, they're far ahead of most melee dps, and it isn't particularly close.
  9. p2aa Augur

    Anyone can tank 20 + mobs, providing you have enough healing to keep you alive.

    Group with better paladins. Paladins have np to keep single target aggro over any DPS class.
    Yet these paladins you play with are bad, but they are not only bad but really awful too if they loose aggro to a mage DPSing
  10. p2aa Augur

    Also, people stop targetting warriors and calling for nerf to warrior DPS.
    First of all, knights in melee ADPS groups produce high numbers too. Omg, I have seen paladins beat DPS classes in ST3 and other undead mob raid. Uber ! Call for nerf !
    Once again, I repeat it. The problem is ADPS stacking, not warrior own DPS. Warrior DPS in tank groups, which is where warriors are in 99 % of raids, is fine.
    Make a campaign if you want so that ADPS don't stack with tanks abilities. But I repeat it warrior personal DPS is fine.
  11. Warpeace Augur



    Great argument when its one or two mobs, but who wants to do that when a SK and Warrior can control multiple mobs way better and survive.?
  12. Reynen Journeyman

    I'd say group with better dps. Some classes can overaggro paladins. I guess you wouldn't know because your guild probably has mediocre dps or they wouldn't have taken you.
    Allayna and gotwar like this.
  13. Seldom Augur

    LOL. Nothing to see here, ANYONE can tank 20+ mobs! Quick, look at Paladins instead!!! Maybe that will distract from the topic at hand!

    OMG, Paladins are beating DPS classes on Undead! Look their way instead of ours! Link these parses of Paladins beating DPS classes on undead during raids Lol. Hint: They don’t exist
    Allayna likes this.
  14. gotwar Gotcharms

    I feel like I'm posting in a troll thread, but it's not entirely wrong.

    It's less about "SK's ARE OP!" and more about "tanks scale ridiculously well and have power-creeped into an insane spot."

    Part of the reason why this has occurred is the insane skill curve present in EQ. Players who take advantage of all their classes abilities, and group with others who do the same, can do some pretty insane things in the group game with a beast-mode tank. Most of the regular posters here have seen the difference between a new/casual tank that barely survives 2 mobs in tier 2 RoS and an elite-tier tank that casually waltzes through piles of mobs in these zones like an invincible deity.

    Is it a problem? I'm not really sure, to be honest. I think the DPS can be an issue, as tanks scale really hard with ADPS and are shockingly competitive DPS-wise while still being able to tank. Both SKs and Warriors put up some huge numbers just by adding a Bard to the group. But content looks very different when viewed from a more casual angle. In some ways, the scaling these tanks see as a result of the skill gap in Everquest is a necessity.

    It's a difficult problem that gets marginalized and simplified in threads like this. I don't think there's any one right answer, and after having the fun hammered out of my class over the last ~year, I'm hesitant to say sweeping nerfbats is the right solution.

    And that, friends, is about 260 more words than this thread deserved.
  15. Tubbycat Journeyman

    Correct.

    The problem isn't necessarily that Warrior DPS is too high in and of itself; it's the way Warrior DPS stacks with ADPS. The majority of Warrior DPS is 'white damage' I.E. auto attack etc. Almost everything stacks to mod that 'white damage.' When you put a Warrior in a DPS group with proper ADPS support, the Warrior should far outpace Rogues, Beastlords, and, conditionally, even Berserkers depending on the event.

    The only reason this hasn't really been noticed is that only a handful of guilds are capable of beating these events in the required time frame with their Warriors in DPS groups. That's why I suggested that guilds try putting their best DPS warriors in their best melee DPS groups. You'll be surprised at the results.

    We went through this last year during EoK when Warriors were pushing 350-400K+ DPS during the Queen event. Unfortunately, DBG never learns. At this point, I doubt anything will be changed prior to the next X-pac beta, so feel free to post your 500k+ parses.
  16. Gnomeland Augur

    Raid tanks have always been the strongest classes in the game. This isn't new. Right now, they're too busy making the game more irritating to play by nerfing the hell out of quality of life abilities, to notice the ridiculous nature of tank DPS. Developers being out of touch is a tradition, after all. We wouldn't want it to go away.
  17. Discordinant New Member

    Mitigation difference is way too much between different classes.

    Between scaling of ac/hp's, innate mitigation, defensives and everything else there is way too big of disparity between tanks, and everyone else.
    xcitng likes this.
  18. lancelove Augur

    Warriors were always meant to be main tanks. Therefore they should be better at tanking right?
    Sk's and Pally's, both plate classes, were meant to be offtanks in raids or group tanks. They were not meant to be right there with Warriors. Any other class has no business even being in this conversation.
    xcitng likes this.
  19. Ghubuk Augur

    Knights are tanks just like warriors. The reason they tend to MT on raids is because they also have a substantial hp advantage over knights which makes them easier to heal on hard hitters. As well, since the nerf to knight disc up time, warriors are able to stay under mitigation benefits for a much longer period than knights.
    Chuckle, and yes Lance, I agree, other classes do not belong in this conversation.....:)
  20. p8aa Elder

    Put paladins in full melee ADPS groups supports and tell us the result on ST3 (and ST1).
    Hint : They destroy most pure DPS classes.
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