What happened to greed rolling?

So after fighting for need before greed model that I was familiar with on ragefire and phinny (skipped agnarr) - I am fully converted to all need on everything, its simple, its fair, and it works.

Hey old timer.... Need is the new greed. Times have changed...

Nbg scam in The Hole is as old as TLPs grandaddy.

I was initially annoyed by the all need rolls on the server. But honestly, the NBG would almost bottle neck certain classes into certain camps. You would never have a healer in a hamlord group or frenzy group.

Plus even in a nbg setup, you'd have people swapping gear they have out for crappy underpowered gear as a disguise so they could need on something that they really didn't need.

In a perfect world, NBG would be the best setup; and playing with friends that you trust, sure. But in the realistic EQ world, Need all is about the only fair way to do things.

NBG is ridicules. The idea that 5 strangers default you some loot (worth like $30) because you need it... where does that something like that exist in the world in general?

There is no evidence its "more fair" or "better if everyone did it"....no, no its not. What's fair is everyone has a random chance to get items worth PP....eventually you will get enough pp to buy what you want. This is more or less (law of large numbers) equal to your effort over time. That's how it works if you are working alone and not with buddies telling each other that shaman is really greedy for rolling our friend's sash.

You can always go there with friends...but the thing about friends is they are around later to return the favor aren't they? A lot of these people aren't even going to be here in a month. You might not ever see these people again and the roll system needs to reflect that.

Even even in a guild you get DKP that you spend for items...

Yeah you can be a greedy jerk, or you can be fair. My cleric won a book in GE on Agnarr and she already had something better than it. Two people rolled against, a melee and a necro. I sent a tell to the necro asking what secondary he had. He linked me something way worse than the book I looted and I handed it over to him, no questions asked.

I like people to get upgrades they can use and equip right away. This was a group of randoms and not friends.

You gave away an item that literally vendors for 1 copper. Rolled need in the first place when you didn't even need it as an upgrade, then call every single player on the server a "greedy jerk".

Grats, you fail at everquest.

This is the best example of why you always roll need on everything.

Pretty plain and simple...

See, there's this thing called The Bazaar and you can sell items to other players! Can you imagine?

The guy still need rolled on an item he didn’t need then called other people greedy jerks for need rolling on an item they didn’t need.

The reason it's all need all is because if people used greeed, others could ninja items by need'ing on them.

When I'm in a pick up group though I usually say "if I win something you need, particularly spells, /tell me."

But we do all need money. Tanks in particular, but not limited to. Tradeskilling is also a huge money sponge. Then there is of course twinking alts. It's not all about krono farming.

Well here is the problem as I see it. When advanced looting came out, most everyone was using it as they should, needing on upgrades and greed on $ items. Which is how it "should" be. Thus I started setting everything over the next year. Their were very few violators of this at first and it wasn't much of an issue. If someone came into group needing on everything we would just boot them if they didn't switch their settings.

However, it didn't take long for all the greedy turds to multiply, and it slowly has become the norm. In one way I understand it because I too was missing out on many rolls due to people Needing on everything. Also, it was becoming VERY old VERY fast having to constantly change my ADV loot settings to whatever that group was doing that day. In short, the greedy turds ruined the apple cart for everyone, as usual.

Advanced looting was suppose to make things faster and easier but because of this, it's become quite the nightmare. So now I'm done with having to change my settings on the same freaking items a hundred times. It's easier to just Need on everything and never miss out on stuff you shouldn't. I shouldn't have to investigate every person that comes into a group to see what they have their settings on and everyone else in the group for that matter. Not to mention, ADVLoot doesn't show what each person's setting are on until the roll is done. Which by that time it's to late.

If everyone needs on everything they want = problem solved (for the most part). The master looter can assign any real upgrades before it goes to roll. Just make sure you set a master looter you can trust and it's really not an issue. This way you only have to set each new item 1-2 times ever and that's it. None of this constantly back and forth crap. Set it and forget it, as it should have been from the start. The master looter can check with everyone before setting an item to roll or whatever.

They could make some changes to the advanced loot system to solve many of these issues but I'm not going to get into all that now. Plus I wouldn't bank on changes that may or may not ever happen.

Actually there is a way for the master looter to see what everyone’s settings are before the item is actually rolled, and they can remove people from the running f they want. You ask, then roll. The box is a purple “?” And then you can click on it and see everyone’s options. You should try playing around with the system before you say it is bad and won’t do what you want.

Also, there is no “way it should be used”. I don’t recall seeing any guidelines coming out with the system. My friends and I go with a “Mains need, alts greed” system, especially for things like trash armor on raids. It is actually fairly common. It has been used on several of the TLPs by different guilds. For everything else there is no reason why everyone should greed vendor loot instead of needing it, everyone needs it, because everyone has expenses. Wanting money to buy spells/gear/food/reagents/do tradeskills isn’t a “greed” thing it’s a “need” thing.

I think you are just letting your OCD get caught up in the labels they gave things. Instead of “need”, “greed”, and “pass” think of it as “yes”, “if no one else wants it” and “No”. With those last set of labels what would you use on a high value vendor trash drop? That is what you should use in groups.

Pure need works great. So what if I just sell all those bone chips to the merchant because I can't be bothered selling better. And so what if the monk doesn't get his armor and i store it for my alt that I'll never play.

It works great.

Just be master looter and take what you want.

That works even more great.

Even if their is a way to see what everyone has their setting on, no one checks it. Do you check it every single time on every single item?? Yea I didn't think so...

Everything you said, is an opinion. As what I said. Problem is, the system doesn't account for that. It should be - Yes or No. By adding in all the other options, they just left the door wide open for people to take advantage of others. Say whatever you want but it is FACT that countless items are basically being stolen everyday. The system shouldn't even roll unless all are on need or greed. The system shouldn't roll unless all have chose an option. Their are a ton of issues with it, The system sucks unless your solo.

Simpler is almost always better and this yet another case. They tried to make it to fancy and ended up pretty much running it. Now their is this never ending feud about what should be need / greed. Take that option away and suddenly it becomes a great system.

so you played the role of arbitrator...

Loot council groups havent been debated yet but its worthy of throwing in the nbg debate!

I think round robin is better.

Welcome to the group mate. We run a loot council so please understand that when considering you for a possible upgrade we will need to see your current gear and then weigh that against others' gear. We ask that you don't bag your Yaks and Loam Bracers in advance.

Best option would be round robin for everyone, and you all /random to see what order it is in.