Lets be real, enchanters ruin early TLP play

I realize the game isn't supposed to be balanced but enchanters are borderline game breaking for the first few expansions. Having a class that is top dps, top CC, top buffer, top soloer, all while naked is absurd and completely devalidates every other class to the point of not even bothering.

The game feels unplayable when you don't have a chanter in group, like driving a car with no hands. Sure you can do it but should you? If you disagree for reasons other than the fact you play a chanter, please make a case for how any other class brings as much to the group as a chanter. In most cases you can choose any 2 classes and they still won't contribute as much as a single enchanter.

Please stop. All this will do is nerf enchanters which they start doing during GoD. They usually don't let enchanters charm after Tipt/vxed. Same thing with OoW can't charm past WoS. They have done a huge nerf to enc in classic by adding MoTM so they can't use charm pets on raid fights.

With that great power, also comes the inability to really AFK, having to always be hyper vigilant in a group setting. It's high risk high reward gameplay. Outside of grouping, enchanters are not very engaging in raids for -most- content.

So, while I agree that they are powerful, potentially overpowered, the class isn't for everyone and it balances out in other ways.

1. Most TLP's will never make it to gates, fewer still will stick around for that highly unpopular era
2. That is only a nerf to raids, which charm should have never worked to begin with. Enchanters are the biggest problem outside of raids, where they are a GM mode version of virtually every other class.

Having to pay attention is not justification for being two classes in one.

They are the flavor of the month of the first few expansion, but not unstoppable.
A lot of classes have dispel.

Lol what? Gates is actually fighting up there with Luclin for top 2 actual quality TLP expansions so far IMO.

While Omens' raid and group content is high quality, there's just not enough of it at the end of the day for it to compete with Gates, when i'm getting sick of it only a month into the 3 month expansion.

Other people have already made the various cases against Velious, Kunark, and PoP effectively enough.

as an enchanter, im finding it difficult to top healing meters. This is unacceptable.

What does your personal preference have to do with anything? Please take a poll of the best TLP expansions and come back with a new argument when Luclin and Gates are at the bottom.

I would wager after people experienced the content on Phinny, you would be surprised where Luclin and Gates ranked.

I'm sorry? They're one class in one. Just because they can fill multiple roles - like many other classes - does not make them two classes.

I mean there's a parallel thread on that right now, where most of the phinny players rank them quite highly. Sadly, polls aren't allowed on the DBG forums

I'd say that Agnarr players don't really have the necessary information yet to say which expansion they like best yet, seeing as how they only have one to compare so far (and it seems like they already hate it). Memories from 16 years ago can be quite deceiving, I can assure you.

On the original topic, let the enchanters have their fun. Lots of classes are the flavor of the month at one time or another.

I'm going to go ahead and agree with the OP.

When I was leveling up I'd always take an ENC over anything if I already had a healer. Best dps on raids (so far) and groups by a long shot.

You're right many classes can fill many roles.

The fact that chanters are the absolute best at multiple roles is what makes them two classes in one. It wouldn't be acceptable for a paladin to outdps a rogue nor a ranger to outheal a cleric. And it's not acceptable for a chanter to be top dps, top CC, top buffer, top soloer while nude.

If you feel that strongly, don't invite them to your group and don't play them. Easy solution! The rest of the folks will thank you for not having to share enchanters as much!

In all reality, again, they're only "top" all of those things in a very limited scope - grouping for EXP. One could argue they also aren't the "top buffer", but I guess it depends the era and what scope of buffing you're talking about.

Let's not pretend charmed pet dps is not amazing on raids...

Haste and mana regen make the most difference compared to other buffs.

They are lolbroken in groups and solo but they are still irreplaceable in raids too. So at best your argument is that chanters are clearly two classes in one outside of raids, and top tier inside of raids......

On Live, Luclin was terrible for me as I got to see no raid content as I was in a #3 Raid guild, and the other #1+#2 Batphone guilds kept everything clear. Sad life to live with no raid content =(
Actually getting to experience the content has blown my mind at how amazing the expansion was.

I am sad I have not gotten to experience RSS King/Queen fight yet, but i digress...
Sorry, Didn't mean to Jack thread...

I have heard that there are expansions down the line where Shaman out heal Clerics, and I have first hand seen some Shaman pull some seemingly un-ending manapools right now with Spiritual Channeling.

Many classes have their Flavor of the month, this doesn't mean they need to be nerfed to never have a flavor of the month. With different era's, content was re-balanced.

Shaman is far and away the best buffer for melee. Haste that is "good enough" and a bucket of other buffs that significantly increase their DPS and survivability. They also have buffs that can help every class, and not just melee.

An enchanter's buffs can be replaced nearly 100% for 90 DBC for 4 hours, or even through in-game crafted potions. An enchanter can be supplanted by a bard playing mana song as well. Is the enchanters buff in that sense better? Absolutely, but it isn't like an enchanter is anywhere near being required for every group to get by.

Having two buffs that are "best in category", that are not efficiently usable by every class, does NOT make them a TOP buffer.