Necro Slow, Good or No?

Discussion in 'Casters' started by Reincarnated, Apr 26, 2017.

  1. Reincarnated Lorekeeper

    So, as most of you who have played a necro for some time know well, we can slow mobs, but for a limited amount. This includes mobs that are not undead.

    My question is simple. Is our slow even working?

    The only reason I ask is because if you right click the spell when cast on a mob, it shows a message saying something to the effect of "Slowing mob for 0 to 0 percent for 6 min"

    I asked this on the server chat and a couple of folks said they thought it has always said this, but I would be very interested to know if it's working at all. At least in relation to 100-105 mobs.

    Even 10% is better than nothing when soloing tougher mobs, and I don't have the time or patience to parse this to death to get the answer. Anyone know for sure?

    Thanks!
  2. Chaosflux Augur

    Parse it and find out?
  3. Brohg Augur

    41689
    Death's Malaise IV
    254
    3s
    0s
    6.5m+
    Magic
    Undead
    2: Decrease Melee Haste by 45%
    3: Increase Disease Counter by 24
    4: Decrease STR by 220
    5: Decrease AC by 27
    6: Decrease DEX by 220
    7: Decrease AGI by 220
    8: Decrease Chance to Dual Wield by 14%

    Is quite good, at the not-insignificant cost of having to Scent->Bones the mob before clicking it, before then starting up real damage.
  4. Siddar Augur

    Necro slow isn't good it however is a sub par slow that may enable you do content you wouldn't without it.
  5. Wyvern Lorekeeper

    Shackle of Spirit: (4s cast time, 2.6s hasted for me, 5s reuse)
    Slot 2: Decrease Melee Haste by 70%

    This is the highest slow we get. I used to use the level 38 spell, but it is faster to just use AA slow and save a spell slot. Might be worth using spell vs named or harder trash.

    Death's Malaise IV
    2: Decrease Melee Haste by 45%
    3: Increase Disease Counter by 24
    4: Decrease Strength by 220
    5: Decrease Armor Class by 26
    6: Decrease Dexterity by 220
    7: Decrease Agility by 220
    8: Decrease Chance to Dual Wield by 14%


    Slow Hotkey: first key I hit once mob is in camp
    /pause 8, /alt act 547 (Eradicate Magic, .5s, 6s reuse) -- optional but it is fast to use.
    /pause 8, /alt act 751 (Scent of Terris, .5s, 4s reuse) -- important to get slow to land
    /pause 19, /cast 6 (Combust Bones, 3s (1.6s cast time for me), 18s reuse)
    /alt act 15073 (Banestrike, instant, 1m reuse)
    /timer 180, alt act 350 (Death's Malaise, 3s cast time) or /cast xx (Spirit Shackle)

    Note: you need a /pause 15 in front of Banestrike if you cast the spell version of slow to deal with spellbar lockout timer. Spell version is a bit faster but time is wasted waiting for spellbar to refresh.

    I have never parsed the slow, but I can tell when it is on or not when my pet is tanking.
  6. Brohg Augur

    Death's Malaise is much more powerful than Shackle of Spirit in any content past Planes of Power.

    Regarding that macro, Eradicate Magic is certainly nice to keep handy, but I wouldn't slow down a macro by including it. Also I wouldn't include Banestrike, which as a DD can break roots.

    If you're alternating spells & AA, you shouldn't need that much more delay than each one's cast time. Try it out with /pause 6 for the Scent line, /pause 17 instead of 19 on the Combust line? That would get you casting slow at 2.3s from pushing the button, instead of at 3.5s
  7. Wyvern Lorekeeper

    I am not sure if you have ever played a necro, but you have to nuke (Combust Bones) to change the non-undead mobs into undead to allow slow to land. This is the perfect spot to use Banestrike as you have to nuke anyhow. Root is not a factor when slowing as pet or tank would be on mob before slowing. I prefer stripping 4 buffs off mob at the start to remove damage shields etc so my pets live longer.

    I find adding 3 to pauses to deal with lag the best, other people might be able to make the pause tighter depending on speed of internet etc.
    Skewert likes this.
  8. Brohg Augur

    To each their own, I suppose. Each DD has a chance to break roots, my preference is to minimize those chances.
  9. Reincarnated Lorekeeper

    You guys using "The Lady's Entreaty" clicky tash too? I don't see Scent making much of a difference in slow landing but I see a huge difference when using the Tash. What? You don't have that item? Get ready for a fun camp.

    I continue to use the aa based slow with the bones line as most necros do. I just wondered why the spell identifier said 0%. I actually thought maybe it was capped at a certain level.

    Glad to hear your still seeing it working. I have tried it on most of the EoK mobs and just wasn't seeing much difference. Reason I was worried.
  10. Brohg Augur

    Scent of Terris (AA debuff) is

    1: Increase Poison Counter by 45
    2: Decrease Fire Resist by 145
    3: Decrease Poison Resist by 145
    4: Decrease Disease Resist by 145
    5: Decrease Corruption Resist by 108
    6: Decrease Magic Resist by 145

    Echo of Tashan (Lady click) is

    1: Increase Spell Damage Taken by 1% to 3% (Before Crit)
    2: Decrease Magic Resist by 60
    4: Increase Poison Counter by 1
    5: Limit Max Level: 75 (lose 5% per level)
    6: Limit Effect: Current HP
    7: Limit Resist: Lowest
    8: Limit Type: Detrimental
    9: Limit Type: Exclude Combat Skills
    10: Limit Min Mana Cost: 10

    They stack, which is real nice, but for sure your own AA is doing over twice as much to help Death's Malaise land
  11. Siddar Augur

    Terris is the only magic debuff I use and I don't recall a mob resisting slow with it on. Terris also has debuff fire and that make undead debuff land consistently as well. Pet swarm, Terris, Undead debuff, and Undead slow is the chain I use for slowing. Works 97-98ish of the time.
  12. Evurkvest Augur

    Not really, pet tanking:

    AA slow, A chokidai elder in 602s: NPC DPS 10079
    Spell slow, A chokidai elder in 606s: NPC DPS 9266
    Felicite likes this.
  13. Brohg Augur

    huh, I guess that's a pet AC thing. Last I checked the crippling version is definitely more powerful for player tanks.
  14. Sancus Augur

    It may also be related to prism skin being based on the number of incoming hits rather than the size of those hits. Slower hits means a greater % absorbed.

    I haven't parsed it, so just an educated guess.
    Brohg likes this.
  15. menown Augur

    Buff block prism skin and then test. My guess is that the spell slow is still better.
  16. Kunon Augur

    If you are using a pet tank the spell slow is going to be better. Slow % matters much more since none of the other debuffs from the AA are big enough to have a real impact given pet defensive/offensive values compared to mobs. At least for Necro pets who are often out in the world without pet gear or buffs outside of Sigil/Runes/Merc stuff.

    Edit: The AA used to be much better since initially it was a 75% slow and was supposed to replace Shackle of Spirit. Then a couple expansion later Aristo decided Necros needed a few more fluff spells for whatever reason and he gave us a new 40% slow spell and 28 point Attack Debuff spell (if anyone used these that makes me sad). When people pointed out the spell was less than our AA, the AA slow percentage was nerfed to be more aligned with the new slow spell...
    Felicite and menown like this.
  17. mackal Augur


    That looks to be a bug in the dbstr for Death's Malaise line. Taking the first one rank we have
    "32378^6^Reduces an undead target's melee speed by #1 to $1% for up to %z.^0^"

    So "#" is replaced by "base" and "$" is replaced by "base2" (lucy terms) The 1 means first slot, the slow data is in the 2nd slot, so the correct dbstr would be

    "32378^6^Reduces an undead target's melee speed by #2 to $2% for up to %z.^0^"
  18. ~Mills~ Augur

    Was explained above but just to reiterate.

    1. We asked and got the AA to replace our level 38 spell slow.
    2. Like a year later it was upgraded and ended up being higher slow % than the spell.
    3. Sometime after that Aristo got the bright idea to give us another undead spell slow but that failed in every way imaginable as it was inferior to our level 38 version.
    4. Nerfs/revamps/changes to slow effects came out and somehow this AA line got reduced based on that new awful spell despite it never being wanted or even existing when the AA line was created. The nerf ignored the level 38 spell it was actually based off of and used the waste of time spell as its basis. It should have been lowered from 75% to 70% slow or 65% if it was to be lower than the spell for convenience. Not 40% or whatever they did to be lower than a spell that didnt even exist until after the fact.
    5. We asked for the additional mods to be added.
    What should happen is the slow should be restored to 70% or at least 65% but good luck with that at this point. Can chalk up the sk version which came out after being untouched and now better since a dev plays that class. Just like necros losing 100% fade and being capped at lvl 108 verse's 110. While the shadow knight fade was left alone and kept at the highest effective level.
  19. menown Augur

    Don't forget the fact that every melee class who has raided within the past 3 years now has a better slow than necros. No hoops to jump through either.

    Well, if you don't count the level 38 spell.
  20. Spellfire Augur

    I'm still hoping this will get changed one day and necro fade will get bumped up to sk level .....