Indeed. How often do you find yourself tanking 4+ in Arx or Combine Dredge without a mezz of some kind? It won't make a big enough difference unless you go back in content. I'm just pointing out that it's not some amazing spell. Honestly we're getting off topic here, paladins aren't in such dire straits that they need to point out our healing which still can't touch theirs. They do need some boost in aggro though because even with VoT I find myself watching certain classes and having to fight back.
I'm not flagged for those zones yet, I'm mainly helping guildees level still and playing with an alt war. I wouldn't mind seeing pallies get some help in the single target agro, but to be honest, when playing a pally, I have 0 issues keeping agro over everyone else in the group on singles. On multies, I do have issues because I have to switch to get agro, and then I drop down on the mob they are burning down. If they were to get some more single target, they could switch easier to get a fod cast or a stun and back without having any agro issues. I also have no issues keeping marr's on the one or 2 top agro producers in the group and that makes life much much easier.
I highly doubt many if any paladins care to point out shadowknight healing. If a shadowknight is claiming that their self healing can't touch a paladins in today's EQ, then yeah, a couple of paladins that are aware of SK's level of self healing should raise a serious eye brow
It seemed to be the topic of discussion for awhile, and I have plenty of parses and time spent on beta across both classes (Ugh Deluge) to know that you're probably better off keeping your brows where they are, there's a reason why paladins were stagnated and shadowknights had a boost and we still can't do some things as well as you, and you can't do some things as well as us. The lack of paladins having AE aggro is a legit concern though.
I'm not seeing problems any more. The first week or so of TDS, I was struggling to not take agro with my rogue from tanks (both real and mercs). I'm no longer needing to spam every agro reducer I have. Not sure if the tanks just changed what they're doing, got some critical AA, or if a change was patched in. Something definitely improved at some point. I've also started leveling up my warrior and am not having any issues holding agro.
I think it is people realized there was changes and changed their play style. for me, I have added VoT, never did that prior to TDS, and that made all the difference. With the pally, I started using Marrs, again made all the difference. I have 0 issues keeping agro over any DPS classes now, if they burn I turn up the limited time agro abilities, if they are doing normal dps, I do normal agro. I believe communication and knowing your parties play styles is a large factor.
Misinformation? You're probably not the best person to cast that accusation. Many of us didn't forget about this absolute gem of a thread you started right after the sk bumps went in: https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/...-in-zones-with-limited-no-summon-mobs.213136/ That would be textbook misinformation, thanks. You've repeatedly posted that sk self healing is better than pal in many situations, and short of the new buggy bond that we've had for a few weeks now or zombie/epic on a 12 minute reuse, it's not. It's not terrible, but it's not to a point where an sk would get mocked for using a healer merc like pal frequently are. Are there scenarios like swarm that it's better? Sure. But overall, it's not as potent. One can point to specific disc or perfect scenarios with bards all day, but that's not the norm nor is it on demand with 5-30s reuse. Your opinion that sks got you nerfed (see here: https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/index.php?threads/paladin-nerfs.212908/. Where you specifically state this) comes across in every post and it's not constructive. Back on topic: Tank aggro should be sufficient multiple mob scenarios for all 3 classes, and if pal aggro isn't right now (as Raven at least can discuss constructively, is saying), then hopefully the devs can fix that. Pretty much every sk on these boards said the beacon changes were too heavy handed and poorly done, and that pal should have some form of reliable ae hate. So a lot of us are in agreement there. That being said, Raven requesting the exact same things we *just* got is what I take issue with. There's very little reason to choose sk over pal at this point in most group/raid situations, so what little uniqueness we have will hopefully be preserved.
Am curious if others are noting the same thing - perhaps there was some kind of problem at launch that took them awhile to fix? Either way it's good to hear. Pal I've grouped with since TDS went live haven't had any problems recently.
Well I think I may have said SK'S got paladins nerfed too lol. But back on topic it is. My main issue is the recast on marr's combined with the duration. If that was fixed or made group 99% of the day to day issues would be gone.
Perhaps . But you also post constructively 99% of the time. Marr's should be group if it's expected to have a similar impact as Voice does. I just think they went way overboard with Voice so not sure Marr's is the best solution for anyone. As a tank the idea is to make the mobs hate you, not to make mobs hate your comrades less.
I agree if the duration was 20ish mins extended that would be fine. The cast time is the same as our VoT, so doubt that is going to change, but i would not have any issues with it being cut to 1 second because you usually have to keep it on 2 to 4 people depending on the group. The recast on marrs has never bothered me because I cast it as the puller brings more in, so its usually spaced out anyhow. I wouldn't mind it being a group cast, but then you would have to click it off yourself and anyone else that didn't want it on them, not that i can think of a reason.
I have thought about this more and more, and tested against marrs as i have both in the group much of the time, and I find that they are about == on making the tank get agro. The ranger I usually play with if I don't have VoT on can out agro me if im not going all out, when I throw VoT on, he only does it on the pull when he gets some lucky kicks etc, but I have it back before the next round. I use terror on the pull so that only happens in a blue moon. He stays around 70% if hes trying hard. With mars, I use FoD or a stun on the pull followed by the other, and he in is in the same situation, on some double kicks or something pulls the agro, but I have it right back the next round and he starts falling from there. staying around 70% if trying hard. If I cast mars on him and VoT on SK or pal, then he doesn't get above 50% and he tries to. I have done the math and since SK terrors and other abilities start out lower than the pal, our terror bring us to above them. With the reduction with Marrs that makes anyone its cast on do 20% less, and their stuff does way more agro than the pal agro stuff, then it gets more of a per point agro reduction. Put VoT on a pally and see what happens to others agro, I can go full dps with the pal with VoT on and no one else is getting close to her agro, go full agro with pal and its sick. I am very curious how others that may be in a similar situation that can test all the variables have found it.
Sheex- my care factor is zero pertaining to you or any other shadowknight that constantly posts info that shows lack of knowledge of their own class and others. Yes, I do feel you and other Shadowknights constantly posting misinfo on abilities definitely played a roll in unnecessary nerfs. Devs have stated they want Paladins to have limited AE aggro. From hearing devs talk in actual person, it has been stated Paladins are ''suppose'' to be 1st in single target aggro, so I find it puzzling we're 3rd on that front. Denyu, if you really played a paladin in beta, I don't know what to tell you. I've been playing my Shadow more than my Pal/War recently due to playing catch up on her. This gigantic self healing edge does not exist in the Paladins favor. Shadowknights 100% have many scenarios where they have an edge, especially when needing to control after on multiples.
In making them hate my comrades less, they hate me more. + I am a halfling so Racial innate hate bonus.
Old model female halflings 4 lyfe. That 2hand slashing swing is epic, around the head and everything! +++ No shrinking, and Hide/sneak when i forget to buy invis pots = Money. Having to jump up steps in some zones is a pain, but whatever.
