Changes with the February Update: Developer Updates

No, not 4k AAs. That is just a number being thrown around by the masses. In actuality some classes stand to gain close to (or slightly more than) 7,000. Everything from Luclin through Underfoot. So yes there will be work to do still to max out and get all the "good" stuff...but not quite "another 11k". I think in most classes' situations, this boost is at least 50% of all AA points which is a solid headstart. My only concern with the auto granting situation is...will this project actually breathe new life into the game in the form of actual new players? Will it even bring enough to offset the losses of veteran players that quit as a result of any of these changes?

I sure hope so..

Why nerf the 'Shining' line?

With the SK nerfs incoming you cant swarm with or without the 'Shining' buff anyways.

I think the concern with that type of spell was that the effect is magnified by the number of mobs triggering it. A limit on the number of triggers possible per tick, rather than over the entire duration would eliminate the problem without compromising their intended effect, I would think. It would eliminate the possibility of them dropping when they are most needed, but also they would no longer provide an unlimited benefit.

Taken pretty out of context for what and how the quote applies to me personally, but I see where you're going and I really must say it's honestly not as big of an issue as it's being made out to be (at least not to a magnitude where a quote like this actually applies).

I'm not saying you (Shadva) beyond this point in particular, but this thread is just more proof that they (Sony) are damned if they do and damned if they don't (which is how it always is). To talk about just AA gain, they proposed a solution to a "problem," they asked for feedback, got "feedback" (most of it just pure whining), changed the solution based on the feedback and folks are still complaining about -- essentially -- getting what they asked for (e.g., an opt-out button).

If you don't want free AA, then opt out; don't take them. If you want free AA, take what's being given to you and run with it. Once you've made your decision, you're then going to either grind out more AA or you're going to grind out even more AA. Feel free to pick whichever one sounds less confusing to you at the time, but either way you look at it there's still going to be plenty of people that are absolutely terrible at the class of their choosing and there's not a single thing that's going to fix that.

Continuing to add to the already countless amount of pages over something that is now a mere "Yes" or "No" option every single time a level is gained is basically just saying that the player is still going to be a hypocrite by accepting free stuff, but would still rather complain about how much free stuff there is. It doesn't work like that. Select the "Yes" option, cap out for 15 levels and be the quote-referenced champion for those levels, or select the "No" option, cap out for as many as you desire on your own and be the quote-referenced champion for those levels (or, like I said above, don't be the quote-referenced champion, because some folks will still be terrible regardless of which option they choose). It seems pretty simple and unworthy of an 80(+) page clusterfffff, but ... c'est la vie, I suppose!

Hopefully it works out to the majority's liking!

And yet here I am now 3 months without a single AA to buy. They have made AAs so easy to gain already, I was maxed a week after CotF was released. And now they are going to give away all these AAs to new players, yet not give your loyal long time players more AA to earn to advance their characters. Not good business to constantly give and give and give to new customers while continuing to neglect the needs of your loyal, repeat customers (and worse yet, now nerf them). These are band-aid fixes for a temporary boost to sales, but they don't address the root problem. I don't care if you want to grant all these AAs to new players, as long as you give veteran players something too. This is just another case in a string of instances of giving to one and not the other.

I concur with Saeadyan. Having 4,000 AA at this stage doesn't get you anywhere close to the upper echelon of people currently in this game. One other thing, it isn't a flat grant of 4,000 AA, if you are level 55 you get maybe 200 or so, but as you level you get auto-granted, at each level from there on out, any AA that apply per level. It makes it so that you can just level to 85 without spending hundreds of hours also investing in AA. From the moment you hit 85 on you still have to separately invest time in AA and leveling, and it is still going to be a huge investment.

Don't worry, level 85 people with 4k AA still won't be cool compared to a level 100 with 12k AA, and the difference between the 2 is still enormous. They will, however, be able to function in the game at a higher level more quickly, increasing the fun factor and relevancy for them.

On a side note, they will still have plenty of time to learn there character before hitting 100. Also there are people with 10 k AA that still have plenty to learn about their characters, Having AA is no guarantee of understanding one's class, it just makes you a little more relevant than someone with no AA that doesn't know crap.

I started my Ranger a while back ... but didnt really play him till just before Chirstmas 2013, he was level 65 with 100'ish AA's. He is now level 93 with 2700 AA's ... it is so easy now to level and get AA's. The Dailys almost trivialize grouping and grinding.
He was not the only character that i played during that time. I also leveled my Rogue from 71 to 83 and she only had 90 aa's. She now has 1800 in that same time period plus i was playing my main who also got around 1500 AA's. I only play 3-4 hours a day 4-5 days a week. The ranger and the rogue were solo, not boxing. Which was the point of playing them.

Auto granting all these AA's is not going to encourage end game people to group with people trying to catch up ... much the other way. Now you are going to have a bunch of people running around that dont know how to play their class ... but have a lot of AA's to figure out.

Easy games dont last.

Well I'm sure that the guy who spent the last 2 months locked in his 80s, trying to get those thousands of AAs before going all the way to 100 because he actually cares about what his char can do, will NOT feel cool.

And stop with the "having AAs does not mean you know your class" bull fellas. While AAs don't grant knowledge, a person who spent hundred of hours getting them WILL know more than one who has not. Stop acting as if everyone has been powerleveled... some have been, sure, but many have not; and that's like the only argument those in favor of the AA gift have been coming up with since this thread was started.

I'm a bit perplexed at the fixation on large AA counts to help people catch up. Most of the power you gain from AAs is at the lower end. As you go higher, the AAs cost more & do less. The low AA bonus moves you relatively quickly through the area where you see large returns on your AA investment.

You know what's really discouraging to grind out? Levels. It just seems backward to me that everyone is harping on AAs and ignoring levels. Groups don't happen at higher AA counts, they happen at higher levels. There's an especially difficult gap between when mercs start losing power in the 50s, and when groups start happening in the upper levels. You want to encourage players to stick around? Focus on this gap. This is where I see most new players get bored & quit.

I like the idea someone had of giving Lesson of the Devoted to all toons (or at least all gold toons). This works best on leveling xp & would help people get to where the groups are faster. You can have a gazillion AAs, but if your level is too low, you're not going to get groups, and you're going to get bored & leave.

I much prefer working on AAs to leveling. Leveling is godawfully slow compared to AAs. When I'm working AAs, I kill some mobs and/or do a quest, I pull up the AA window, spend some points, & I've just improved my character. I feel like I've accomplished something. In the same amount of time, working on leveling, I pull up my inventory window, & my xp bar has moved a few millimeters. I don't feel like I've accomplished much.

I'm really discouraged that now with the continual autogrants, my AAing is going to become pointless. I was so happy when I finally got a toon to max level & I could just worry about AAs & not levels. On my alts, leveling is for when I have a large chunk of time and/or a solid group. Otherwise, I much prefer working AAs. Now I'm basically being railroaded into only leveling on my alts, and there won't be much point to XPing on my main. This removes much of the game's enjoyment for me.

Ok after much deliberation and some slight self-loathing, I've come to an accord for the AA grant. Ok yes you can spend 4000 aa that you can choose to go where EXCEPT, the aa's that you can choose from will be chosen and set forth by the developers.

So in other words, There will be a 4000 aa grant to be distributed by player into aa's that she/he chooses from a pre-determined choice of aa's relative to class player is. So to encourage more gaming out of player I would also recommend certain class specific ones, like something that is a significant difference to players game-play but only able to retain one rank of it outside of pre set list. This way you encourage without being discouraged by sheer number count. I think something along these lines will satisfy several groups of adventurers.

Your "not-so" friendly neighborhood Rogue.

Nire The'Hated of Zek

"Makes my day to know that I ruined yours"(nire99)

Weighing in as felt compelled.

As a 16year veteran with over 40toons all 90ish and considerable AA invested I feel appauled that SoE has, yet again, kicked its LOYAL player base in the . If I knew all this would be handed out for a simple 9.99 I would have stopped wasting my time. And not bothered with the game.

As it is knowing it has been made this simple for other... in addition to the general DUMBING DOWN of the game we have experienced in all the years (Since Underfoot which was the only meaningful expac for some time)... the give away has caused me to question what I have been doing all those years.... and do I really want to waste my time going forward.

Sure give you "Must have everything for nothing, WoW brigade" everything for nothing. We have seen how that approach lasted with WoW.
Reason you HAD players still after 16years or more, is that sense of achievement and working for something. Those veterans that have that feeling have just been dealt a swift kick to the knackers.

Nothing to do with classes needed to be addressed, except the Beam kiting. Possibly a type specific target (like the humanoid criteria required by other similar).
I am MOST concerned for SKs... I see that class becoming unplayable/pointless.

Almost to the point Cleric/Warrior mercs have made Cleric/War mercs pointless (outside raid).

In my army I have at least one of EVERY class affected, and I assure you I have NEVER abused the abilities of the toons. I don't even enjoy hs/swarm and aside from assisting low level guildies rarely bother with any (and was never more than 12 mobs). It is only Beam that impacted, so it is only beam that should be addressed, in the same way as Wiz/Bard beam/kiting by limiting the numbers.

Instead.... you are killing the mechanics of the class for a good number, whether that was your intention at onset of that ability or not. It was a mechanic, and it has become how those people play. Or can opt to play.... or is just a feather to the bow... its there if u have need.

I hate the NERF Bat being swung so recklessly and I am one of those (call me selfish) that is even more disillusioned with the FREE giveaway of what amounts to the last 16years of my life.

Up the AA bonus/limit by all means.... but the free giveaway demeans us all.
That's without considering.... what the hell are you going to give those of us with 16years invested.

It seems the answer to that might be... our real live's back =/

I like the compromise on the SK, thanks for listening on this one.

I like Wizard recourse on instant spells. It's a feature of my class and my character. Sure, I can burn this mob to the ground, I mean, it's almost going to kill me in the process, but I'll be damned if I'm going to let one more Orc live while I have an ounce of mana left.

Bwahaha. Mwahahahahaah.

etc.

Ultimate power, the kind of power only wizards can wield, comes at a price. And sometimes that price is 3rd degree burns. And you can quote me on that.

I would like the title "Hardcore" if you didn't use free aa's. Or something similar.[/quote]

This is built into the game already....
if you have them link let say 2000 and 2250 aa achievement these you will see time/date stamps...
if these 2 ranges are a few seconds apart, you know.

I have played eq before I could drive in 99 always coming back. I stopped playing around uf and came back this last December. I might get to play an hour or two a few nights a week. Since I came back I have been amazed at how easy it is to get aa. I had a little over 1k aa and now have close to 3k, in alittle over a month while leveling as well. Ffs you can get nearly 100 aa a day doing dailies. If anything aa bonus should be extended and you should be able to store more aa sooner. Granting aa doesn't help anyone but people who want the game given to them. You say new players. I say what new players. Seems like most of this "new" player base are usually real life friends of people who already play, which it seems you are pissing off.

im still scratching my head on the cleric changes. Are so many Clerics swarming that they really need to mess with Shining Rampart?

I, for one, am ready for these free AAs and will shamelessly partake of them as I'm not a stay at home NEET that has hours to waste shooting lizards or bee ladies in the head.

If you actually think that putting in time, effort and commitment into a game is something to be proud of, then there may be other issues needing your attention that are beyond the scope of these boards.

You've spent years and years playing EQ. Got it. You've got umpteen thousand AA, more than 95% of the game population, and know your class inside and out. You believe you are a better player than most/all other players on your server. Got it.

Assuming the AA autogrant goes through, instead of 10k more AAs than most players, you'll have 5k, but still clearly standing out. You are still going to know your class just as well, and others will understand theirs just as poorly. And after all, as such an 'elite' player, it's not like someone being given level 85 and a batch of (largely fluff) AAs is going to catch up with you, right? Right?

Are players who benefit from this going to have to trudge uphill both ways in the snow like you did to get to your exalted position? No. Then again when you were making that oh so arduous journey, you were the same level as virtually all of the rest of the server population, much of it in a time when LFG actually could get you a group, and overall had a much more pleasant, or at least satisfying, experience on that journey than someone starting out today. A new player starting now is not going to have that same experience that you or I did starting out over a decade ago.

But hey - keep being proud of your EQ accomplishments and screaming against efforts like this. Must make for interesting conversations at holiday family gatherings.

* * * *
Regarding all of the many good suggestions many have for granting only specific (critical and useful) AA lines, or giving players blocks of AA to spend, increasing quest AA rewards, etc. - they sound great. I wish SOE would choose one of those, and I bet that the developers would prefer if they could implement something like that as well.

Let's be realistic, though - does EQ really have the development resources for that? How much effort would it take to determine separate AA lists for each class (especially given the limited understanding of many classes by the devs) and programming all that it? Or designing and programming a number of 'uber AA reward quests' or the like? (Hint: look at the second installment of COTF to get an idea of how much they were able to do in three months, and take a guess how long it would take them to do a good job.) A lot of really good ideas for easing the climb up the AA mountain are likely just not feasible from an available developer touch-time standpoint.

I'd wager that auto-granting all level-appropriate AAs is a lot easier, and that's why that is the approach they are taking. Maximum utility subject to budgetary constraint.

For the shadowknights, why not consider limiting their lifetap procs to only dark blue conned mobs and higher?

It seems to my inexperience that their swarming tactics are currently focused on light blue and lower mobs.