Non-Raiding Necromancers

The person I quoted was talking about any situation, period, so yeah raids qualify for that.

For anyone who hasn't actually gotten a chance to try this yet, my necro is group geared on Test and I've been tinkering since we got the xpac early. It's an absolutely godawful time to be a Necro. Really glad it isn't my main or I'd have already quit. Our mana regen is abysmal now.

To be fair he was directing his reply to some necro about raiding. We know that raiding necro will hardly be touched by this change. Group and Solo necros will in fact be hurting.

Nerfing Death Bloom isn't going to make us not do that 15 million more damage then you on raids.

The Nerf to Wizard Ethereals will however make you do even less damage.

Not sure why you feem need to rage at raid necromancers in a thread about group and solo game though.

There have been a few suggestions on how they could make a change, make mana a resource, and not cripple the leveling, grouping or soloing Necromancer. The best suggestion was here:

I personally haven't been posting because its done at this point, nothing you can do about it but wait. There is no bringing up facts or logic to refute it. Everyone will have to wait 6 months to a year for the change to be undone, for a new group only ability to appear that does pretty much what DB did before or for group spell mana costs to be drastically changed. But eventually one of those will happen to correct this dumb as groupers and solo'ers are going to be hit pretty hard with this change. I expected to be here until the lights were turned off but all of this has me hanging it up for now. There is no more discussion, logic or feedback to help with the changes and direction the class or game is taking. Its their world and you just pay to play in it.

Necros get to look forward to epic change 10 years after the fact (only reason it hasn't happened yet is coding for what they want to do isn't ready, meaning it wont be a simple fix and again will most likely be under or overpowered initially so at least another year of waiting for changes to work it all out. Rather than just leaving well enough alone) and months to a half years time for fixes to focus and overfocus effects to get them working for dots again. We are losing slot 3 damage( which big picture wise amounts to a hill of beans power wise but has impacted the tuning of base damage of dots for the past few expansions, as we continually get less and less base power increases for dots compared to nukes) now but 4 years later and we still don't have + spell damage working for dots. So again looking at the big picture: less dev time, less devs, less dev resources, necros gaining a slightly bigger boost from slot 3 augs, necros completely losing out on any bonus from + spell damage(despite 2 or maybe it was 3 attempts at trying to get + spell damage to work for dots as it should). The best solution would have been to simple leave slot 3 augs alone, until the time came about that the team also was able to fix + spell damage for dots.

Please continue breaking things when there is less time, devs, and money being thrown at the game then ever. When your boat is sinking because of giant holes in the hull you don't spend your time and efforts leveling all the seats out, making sure each passenger has equal padding under their for a comfy sink into the sea.

Because sometimes nerfs improve the game balance overall. It's not like we do them for fun. I definitely agree that people trolling necros on the subject should cease such behavior however. And I do ask that you use the report functionality when you see people doing it. We certainly feel for Necros, it's never a good feeling when an ability is limited or made less useful.

That being said the arguments here run completely counter to one another. We have people saying that Death bloom was never a big deal, but that reducing it will completely ruin the class. We have people saying that they can't do enough dps, but at the same time saying they can't stay mounted because they're doing so much DPS they can't control their aggro and need to feign it off.

The reality is that this change will impact necros, not in a huge way but there will be a need for adaptation. You'll experiment a bit, maybe cast 1 less dot in your average mob situation (or just wait for a few seconds longer before engaging), and in the end it'll be pretty much the same. It's a small tweak in the overall scheme of things, and once you experience the change for a bit you'll adapt just fine.

Will you miss the short recast Deathbloom? Yes. I know I will on my Necros (my 2nd most played class, I'm currently leveling a second Necro on a new server to play with friends here at work). But the level of hyperbole going on in this thread isn't helpful to the Necro community. Go play on beta or test and experience the change, it's not as bad as people are making it out to be.

Did you try leveling or grouping and not just raiding as, from previous explanations, this change is supposed to be targeted at?

I find this statement rather incredible.

Yes, I don't actually raid much with my Necro. It hurts, but small changes in my behavior were able to address* 98% of the change.

Edit: *Address does not mean completely negate the change, but it does mean that I was able to find a viable playstyle that allowed me to continue to perform solo and to contribute in groups meaningfully.

Such as not casting half the time in a group and when soloing, sitting and medding half the time?

You talk about contradictory statements above, but you claim "It hurts" and "small changes in my behavior were able to address 98% of the change".

This change will have NO effect on the raiding necro. Perhaps since you don't raid with your necro, you don't realize that. Where it will hurt is when people are trying to level up and in groups.

At the same time, you all seem to want to make it easier for people to group and to get to a level where other people are at to be able to group.

This change makes no sense.

It's very simple. If you have used every mana recovery tool at our disposal and have run OOM (without mana draining mob), then we do not have unlimited mana.

Change is never comfortable. This change is not doom for Necros however. Deathbloom is not 70% of our mana regen, therefore the half the time statements are clearly not accurate.

This is the big issue right here. The classes NEVER should have been balanced round each other to begin with.

When I started playing this game each class had an area they are first place in and an area where they are last place in. But now there is no clear winner anymore cause of the balancing.

Caster dps

Wizards should be number 1 in burst dps(short quick fights) and 3rd in long fights.
Necros should be number 1 in long fights and 3rd in quick fights
Mages should fall in the middle somewhere

Tanks
Warriors where at one point the best tank for any thing. They should be made to be agian
pallies and sks should be able to tank anything a war can but have a harder time doing it.(This is how I remember it when I 1st started playing eq)

Healers.
Same with Clerics use to be the best healers in the game having the best heals that druid/shamans didn't have. Again druids/shamans should be able to heal in any zone but have a harder time then clerics do.

The same for the rest of the class types(melee dps, adps classes, etc) with in each area there needs to be a class that is best at one thing but sucks at another.

To clarify, this is actionable and we will be removing posts and suspending if necessary. Don't do this, you're creating problems not helping.

Sorry, that hit my absurdity button. I have not seen a discussion about whom (based on their classes) to invite to groups for 8 yrs or more. I know that as soon as this one guy in our guild logs on ANY of his toons, he gets a group invite because he knows how to play all his classes. His necro does not need any of us so we just sit there, waiting for a 12 second nuke to cast while he and his pet essentially give us the updates.

Pally DPS. Only the raid pallies even deserve to have those two words in the same sentence. You don't hear them complaining. Too funny!

10 pages... Mana regen comparisons are fairly useless, from class to class. Here's a few reasons why this nerf to death bloom is rather unacceptable.

1. Our lich was obviously inadequate to sustain our damage or we would never have gotten this ability in the first place.
2. The timer and math associated was not picked out of thin air, it was calculated. It worked for our mana expenditure(which has only scaled up-since this now three year old ability was introduced).
3. The mana return for death bloom has not increased since this ability was introduced..so it's actually, already less effective than it had been(neglect of an ability that causes it to become less effective over time, is a form of a nerf).
4. Mana regen comparisons to mages and wizards are useless..since we use mana at different, we need different amounts of mana regen. We also specialize in long-term damage, wizards are burst..mages are lame..err do whatever it is they do(summon pets?).
5. No one likes to 'regress'. We're used to performing at a certain level. Filling roles in a certain way. Nerfing a our mana regen is going to make us less effective in COTF than we were in ROF. Why pay 40 bucks to be worse? I couldn't answer that question btw, so I cancelled my pre-order.

Paladins are not a dps class. They tank. A necro pet, can tank group content, reasonably well..when healing is "good". It does not tank anywhere near as well as a player that is sufficiently AA'd and geared(just like the necromancer has to be)...Your comparison is rather "dumb". Please drive-thru.

Yeah, see above 'scenario' where the mythical group leader decides to hire a paladin over a necro. It's ridiculous.