Changes to the Necromancer Epic 2.0 in the August 2020 Update

Discussion in 'News and Announcements' started by Aristo, Aug 11, 2020.

  1. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.

    Pure obfuscation.

    Damage output is damage output.

    That said, good Necromancers are easily managing to do 2x to 3x the next non-necro dps on single-targets.
    Szilent likes this.
  2. I-WANT-IT-NOW Augur

    Damage output verse multiple targets compared to damage output verse single targets is not the same thing whether you don’t realize it or you choose to ignore it because you can not replicate it.

    Single target can also still vary drastically. Do dots tick when a target is invulnerable to others? Do dots tick on a boss while the focus moves to adds or spawns that are the key to winning? Do dots tick on a mob that doesn’t take damage yet while the focus is other targets for a time? All of which are situations in ToV raids where a necromancer parse pads to perform well while they wait for the boss to become active or unlock with dooms on or to maximize dps by dotting up upwards of 8 mobs at once while under burn.

    Straight single target with zero gimmicks or limits still result with necromancers ahead by bounds currently and it has very little to do with the 18% critical rate from their epic and everything to do with poor revamped dot tuning and 5 doom dots.
  3. Cragzop Cranky Wizard

    I gotta know what guild you are in I-WANT-IT-NOW ... cause I want to send the guild leader a sympathy note. You are using some truly terrifying logic and evidently all your play is to purely maximize your dps and who cares whatever is going on in the raid. That's a lot to deal with on a daily basis.

    Do you honestly think necros are the only class who spread their dots? Every dotting class I know uses the same base logic when a dot gem pops but a casted version of said dot is running on a mob...is it worth casting the dot on another mob or wait till a refresh is needed. Good players do this all the time on raids...think about the situation and act accordingly. DD casters do this as well ... can I get this nuke off on mob before dead ... if not, find another mob to hit. Or ... are enough mobs in range where it makes sense to AE now.

    I have no idea what:
    is actually trying to say. I can replicate any damage situation I want in the guild hall with multiple dummies (I do it all the time to test ae/rain nukes). The raids are pretty cookie cutter in this regard as well. I know how many mobs will spawn and which adds need to be killed and which can be ignored (minor exceptions, but basically true). I know how many hps the mobs have roughly from parses over time so I know how much damage the raid force needs to accomplish to win. Sure a double spawn of crystals might happen on Vindi (what? that can't happen!) and you might get a golem ... or two on alt night. But a cycle of ToV with total raid damage done is remarkably similar each run.

    Damage is damage. You don't get to move the goal posts because you think you look better (or worse ... I have a hard time trying to figure out how you want yourself to look here).

    So you do damage ... to mobs ... that's GREAT! I'm glad you are on the team. Are you trying to tell me that you're casting dots on Damon and/or Nosja before 10 percent? Yeah, we know. You and all the melee waiting for mobs to pop. Which btw is really the only true parse pad in ToV. Are telling me that you are dotting Sleeper while the raid is killing sentries? Thumbs up!

    If you throw out Wedding and don't spawn golems in Vindi, there's really not much damage you can do that isn't part of winning (if you are kiting mobs as a strat in AoW and damaging those mobs, you probably won't be in a raid guild long). And necros are doing a significant amount of it on raids. And honestly, we all like it. The raids are long ... more damage, faster raids, winning!

    And don't getting me started on the wildly inaccurate group/solo information that some necros are trying to portray here. Any high volume kill group would LOVE to have a necro (maybe two) in their group. I know our best SK loves them in his evolving ear groups.

    The non-necro EQ community has been very gentle with necros during this revamp process. Those of us who follow the boards know it's been a long time coming and we all knew that the first phase of the revamp was going to make necro damage ridiculous. Which it did and the only real comments from us were when less seasoned necros started mouthing off about mana issues while ignoring the vast dps increases. And those who saw the damage on parses knew that this would probably be the time that the epic went away in some form. Which it now has. And we understand there's going to be a grieving period.

    But when necros start making ridiculous claims about their dps and future playability, the non-necros are going to push back and push back hard. We'll see the parses in a week or so without the epic. My guess ... still have the best critical rate for cast spells and still be topping those parses, including bursts.

    Change is hard. It's okay to be sad for losing something you've had for so long. Stop making silly statements.
    Duder, Funky and Skuz like this.
  4. Kase Augur

    But they are needed in groups.. necros arent
  5. Ibudin Augur

    Lots of necro haters on this thread, its comical. Necro Lives Matter.
  6. Skuz I am become Wrath, the Destroyer of Worlds.



    Your Necromancer Privilege is far more comical though.
  7. Ibudin Augur

    Not seeing any significant complaints from Necros on the fact they are doing with epic, seeing more chest thumping cry babies say …"yea nananana Necro's, u so OP, not no more hahaha".

    No one gives a hoot. In the end you'll still be a sub par player who can't figure out the game, and need sweeping changes to other classes to make you feel good, oh so good. You need more characters in your signature.
    Jein-ko likes this.
  8. Thraine Augur

    why not just let the epic be converted to a type 3 aug and be done with it DBG? alternatively you could have announced this with the DoT revamp as 1 big change .... now it just looks like you guys are picking on necros, at least you devs are consistant.
  9. Mookus Augur

    I wish wizards were picked on like necros.... I’ll take some of the ‘abuse’ please.
  10. Ythera Augur

    As a necro, my biggest concern with this change is that now I have to spend DKP on a main hand item or two handed staff. Is there a way Darkpaw games can give necros an AA ability that increases how much DKP we earn?
    Venau and Ibudin like this.
  11. I-WANT-IT-NOW Augur

    If you can honestly not see that 3-6 dots on 3-7 mobs at once no matter their location is different than what others can do with limited range beams or rains then I don’t know what to tell you.

    Necromancers are broken because of how he has handled revamps so far which is further shown when 6 mobs are dotted at once. Not our epic or our critical rate. And getting us back to “normal” is a lot more complicated by shifting other parts of the formula randomly instead of addressing all the damage he added to each dot.

    He should have only revamped the wounds line.

    Or

    Only revamped pyre of K and iginite lines and then left every other dot line as is but locked out using older dots for all lines.

    Or

    Left things alone.

    Instead we have this cluster duck and random dart throws at our epic that only make it harder to balance out again. I don’t need a week to know that in raids necromancers won’t miss a beat with this change and only solo and group necromancers are taking a big ding.
  12. Mlipus New Member

    Bah, the most nerfed class gets another one.
    epicnecro likes this.
  13. baby-iksar Journeyman

    Glad to see this old item retire. But i wish all classes could still do something with their epics, either allow a click with refresh timer or convert to aug to be used in current expansion weapons.
    epicnecro, Jein-ko and Kase like this.
  14. Funky Augur


    well, you've been saving DKP on your weapon slot since OOW. you should have plenty banked up by now.
    Kaenneth, Duder, Tolzol and 3 others like this.
  15. Ibudin Augur



    You have a click, it pops out a wonderful, red colored skelly that does 1.0 dps.
    Jein-ko and Venau like this.
  16. Mehdisin Mahn Augur

    never in my EQ life have i said "you know what this group needs??? A PALADIN!" yet there are many times where a necro would have come in handy... are they the best for groups? nah... but if your dps is crap, as it usually is in a pickup group, and you're taking 1m+ to kill mobs then a necro can turn things around.

    hell, i be most of those paladins thinking they're bad mofos cuz they can solo like 5 mobs an hour in ToV would welcome a necro to join them =P.
  17. Cicelee Augur

    I think necromancers are still going to be just fine, even after losing the epic focus. You can now wield a 2 hander on raids with a DD proc, add two more DD procs if you wish, and even melee some mobs with a melee DD proc as well. All of that added up is going to compensate for some (not all) of the lost damage from a 18% critical reduction from the times you don't have Auspice and IOG and such.

    You are still going to be able to solo, encounters are going to take a few seconds longer but you can still do it.

    You are still going to be in the upper echelon of parsers, probably still first. The gap between you and second might get smaller, but most likely there is still a gap.

    The class is still going to be considered OP by many players. And I am sure Necro Fighf Club rules will still be effective and enforced.

    And like you say, good necromancers will still be good. Bad necromancers will no longer be good. And that is probably a good thing.
  18. Kase Augur

  19. seber Augur

    just like most Nec post 99.9 from none nec or bot nec lol.
  20. minimind The Village Idiot

    A tank is needed. A healer is needed. DPS is usually needed if you want to kill things with any reasonable speed. That DPS can be burst (zerk, rogue, wizard), slow burn (DoTs) or somewhere in between.

    The classes don't really matter so long as people aren't jerks to each other and there isn't a min-max whiner complaining that only 5 mobs are dying per minute instead of 7.

    A fun person playing a necro in a group is much more preferable over a jerk playing the best zerk.
    Kase and Silu like this.