Nerf Mearates (Now)

Participation trophy mentality meets Everquest.

Well this might not be the appropriate place. But I made Lorekeeper! grats me!

and that looks a lot like elder. rip.

So, we put our first few hours last night on this raid. We spent about 6 hours on BETA in the closing days before launch and we learned a lot. This raid has the potential of being FUN!! This raid is also a great measuring stick for how good your guild really is. It puts individual ability to pay the attention right out on display. Moreover, it puts each individual's ability to move your right out on display. This raid, to me will be a lot like Pre-nerf Drusillia's Vault was - at least for RA. It made us top to bottom a better raiding guild. There was no room for failure and we put it together and immediately upon our first win, the event was cake for us.

To me, there is no shame in not beating this raid before it is properly tuned. There is so much going on in this raid, the insane amount of HP regen being properly tuned IS STILL AN ACCOMPLISHMENT. ROI beating a largely broken raid deserves the massive amount of kudos and they have received it. Ignore the haters, you all deserve a pat on the back. That being said, the ability for your guild to recruit talent won't take nearly as big a hit as so many of us believe not beating this pre-nerf. This player driven, insane, made-up rat race is fun with proper perspective. If you down raids, people will join you - that's all there is to it. Yes, it would be a feather in your cap being the #2 bunch of fools beating your head against a broken raid. Leaving a raid in a broken state goes against everything the Devs of this game believe in for their world. I can't imagine how much it has to drive them batty that the fix is made and they won't implement it because >1% of players in the "top" few guilds want a shot at the title. All you raid lock-out timed guilds have had your shot. Just because the best oiled machine has defeated this raid - twice in a months time - does mean this raid should have been left in this condition for this long. It's shameful. The Devs deserve very little blame in this to my eyes. They did what they thought was right. People shouldn't hold any ill will over this like so many other issues people are passionate about in this game.

Good luck to all, I do hope a guild or two can still beat this before April's patch. It's still truly a great accomplishment.

/airlute

[quote="Jhenna_BB, post: 3763775, member: 6194"It's shameful[/quote]

You had me for a lot of this. No Shame in not beating this but shame in leaving as it is.

A couple days at this event may not put you on equal footing. Regardless, a nerf will be there like most expansions, but I hope you the best to set your teams to their banes and get out of the fire!

It should be nerfed. Why? Not because its impossible. Not because guild 2 through X can't ever beat it. But simply because its not good for the game.

It is disappointing. I mean, back when Underfoot was going on, I can guarantee you that if those guilds and those players were here facing a challenge of this difficulty, it WOULD have been beaten by 4-6 guilds at least by now.

But other than maybe 15 people in RoI now that were around then, almost everyone on the roster now came from those other guilds (Triality, Crimson Tempest, etc).

I am not in MS or SR or ROV so I don't know how close they really are or aren't. So while some or most of those people are hoping it stays, for the health of the game it really should be toned down.

Selfishly, I don't want it nerfed because its the only raid I'm excited to do (though with bad numbers/classes it feels like tilting at windmills), but it does need to get toned down.

Nice post.

Well I am, and we are close. But also so far at the same time. Just 1 person with a lapse in judgement, it's over. 2-3 people unobservant of a bane mob they could have easily taken down, it's over. 1 death during a hallway run at 25% because a tank is too slow to pick up a mephit ad hoc, it's over. 4 raid sequences converge, Jesus takes over. People. Must. Maintain. Close. So Close. Wipe.

Just a fact of roster and remaining talent pool all "top 10" EQ guilds must deal with 20-Years-On. Even ROI have players they want to replace and would happily bench if one of the few remaining superstar players decide to transfer over. Again, it has taken a full team for ROI to get in their two wins. Years ago it is possible 45 well balanced elite players could have completed this raid in current form. No longer.

I stated this event difficulty after a couple weeks working on this event. Nothing personal, not a troll, just a fact of the current state of Live raid teams:

I think this is a little judgmental of the EQ community, but I bet we agree in general terms.

For the last few years the EQ community has faced raids that were largely beatable for serious guilds within a few raid nights of attempts even without gearing up. Then the nearly year long farm status starts and a guild relies on roughly the same people showing up 1-2 times a week to kill a raid boss mob, often for gear few people want. This requires guilds to optimize toward people who would still be there in August that year instead of players who only show up for new content, even if those short-timers are skilled players who can play at 95% of their class for 20 minutes without major screw-ups.

If DBG decides that the UEE raid is the new standard and new expansions are going to culminate in very difficult raids with razor-thin error margins on their failure mechanics (which is easier to balance than having tightly controlled DPS race margins), you're going to see guilds shift away from optimizing toward year-long farm-mode and start to integrate more cut-throat benching / recruiting practices. And that will mean that events like UEE get beaten by more guilds.

I've been put in a position where I had to chose between undependable rockstars and dependable mediocre-players and it's terrible. Watching a dude who is the heart of your guild, helped build it up, keeps the culture of the guild growing then meet an event like UEE and fail over and over on these mechanics and having to tell him he's getting benched because some new hot-shot who probably will move on from EQ in two months is miserable. Watching that guy quit, then a few months later going back to him and asking him if he wants back in because guess what, that hot-shot moved on is also terrible. Even worse is mediocre dudes who want the guild to succeed so much that they bench themselves for the most important event.

I think looking back on this thread now that EQ is facing a tough raid is interesting.

https://forums.daybreakgames.com/eq...-skilled-player-and-an-average-player.251956/

The obvious solution:

Nerf it, but leave the pre-nerf version in as a separate, optional raid sharing the same lockout. Throw an extra couple pieces of the same drop table loot on the pre-nerf chest, and give an extra cool achievement + title to those that beat the pre-nerf version. Everyone wins. Guilds that want to challenge themselves to be on the elite list can attempt the pre-nerf instance, while guilds who just want to finish the expansion and move on with their lives can do the post-nerf one.

My request is simple. Last night it was obvious that the lag issue was not fixed. I had one run where the lag was totally out of whack, the next run another cleric had the same issue (but I mysteriously did not). At the end of the raid comparing notes we were not alone. Yes, I have spent literally hours doing every tweek I can to my system and gameplay to reduce lag. It seems like the time just before 70% is where it really builds.. right as we are in the middle. My complaint is not on mechanics, its on failing an emote as a zone has some weird issues.

Tl;dr: Turn off reports from "Others" in the options tab.

I've had the same issue, and, for me, it was due to writing the log file. Years ago (TBM-era) there was a Windows 10 update that somehow buggered up log-writing for my computer. Despite having a fairly decent computer, it was put to a crawl during raids. The only solution for me was to either turn off my logs entirely, or to just turn off reports from "Others" (damage, tanking, spells, etc.). This is beyond hiding it in another window, as the log will still write it. This is within the Options tab.

Recently (RoS/TBL-era), something changed and I was once again able to parse others during a raid. I don't know what changed, and I don't know when it changed or why I decided to try again.

And then as we were doing the Mearatas raid, my machine started to slow down again. Again, right after a Windows 10 update. Gina triggers were delayed. Parses were delayed. It was weird. It lined up with the 70% mark on the raid. I wouldn't get the hallway emote until after I had run to the hallway, the buff was removed, and I ran back to the middle of the zone. The second emote would go off almost immediately. My theory is that everything that need to be written to the log was delayed, and it wasn't until the second emote that the log had caught up.

I've since turned off reports from "Others" and haven't had an issue since. I've tried plenty of things to try to up my log writing performance (excluding the folder from my virus scanner, turning the write interval to 1, turning off all graphics extras, etc.), but the only thing that works is turning off reports from "Others". I hope that helps.

What you mean like turn off others damage??

Alt O for Options
One of the tabs has filters or display or something. Each one has a colour associated with it, as well as if it should be shown or not. Some have only Show or Hide as options. Others have Show Mine, Show Group, Hide. Etc.

Others hits, like Soandso hits Suchandsuch for X. Or Soandso casts spell Y. Melee hits, misses, spells, songs, crits, npc hitting others, etc. I have all turned off. The only filters I have on are those that impact me. There's a bunch you'd have to do. Go through the whole list and figure out what you can live without.

Unfortunately, the devs sometimes add things in that aren't filterable. But for the most part, this should reduce log lag.

Man turning off raid info is a no go.

Raid info, for sure. Npc casting should remain on. And emotes, and event info, and whatever else. But PC damage / casting / actions from 53 others? I can do without.

could hurt people who like to post parses for the guild tho.

They should leave it as it is forever, seeing only 1 guild beat an expansion before the next releases would be hilarious.

It could, yup. But if you're lagging due to the writing so much data to a log, I think reducing lag would be more beneficial than full raid parse info. Hopefully there's someone who doesn't raid on a potato that can do event parses . As for me, I seem to channel my inner Irish.

Would this make it better or worse than tacvi?

I have a love/hate relationship with mearatas. Frustrating, sure... but I like it.

In any case, the only nerf that I think should happen - is the 20 minute time frame. I think it should be 30. (I say that fully acknowledging my guild has not gotten to the enrage timer yet) . This was the sobering thought that even if everyone does everything perfectly, realizing we'd still run out of time. I figured it would still be a solid victory for even beating it regardless of time. That being said, we are still learning/ practicing, so maybe dps won't be as big of an issue once we get better at the mechanics.

Just my my two cents - cheers

Derresh = Sandbagger: Confirmed
/slap