Account Suspensions

I'm willing to place my bets on the same people who exploited RoS missions were the same people who used the same mechanic exploit on older expansion missions.

So DB opted for the "well if we get the RoS farmers, chances are we got the other farmers as well .. and while we're at it let's suspend some people that may have only been in the vicinity of a farming group, just in case" approach, as opposed to the "let's look into this further so the right people get suspended and we don't have to deal with a PR nightmare" approach.

You're right, I have no idea why I would be shocked at this outcome.

In your post that Gialana quoted above, you mention people dropping a mission when they get a PH and start over.
I wonder, how does that compare to the case at hand?
I were guilty of that too - like about all of the EQ population that ever ran such a mission for hunter.

But there was no completion, no currency, no task reward, no nothing - at most perhaps some collectibles that spawned after some step.
From how i read the announcement, that would still fall into the "not completed" category though.


What you then went on to describe though - that people "ran Droga missions every 5minutes to farm armor and augs" - that would/should fall exactly in this category, yes.
It's the first time i hear this though. If that was exploited in the way you describe, then i think people knew why there were doing it in a hush-hush way and didn't exactly brag about it or make it widely known.
Now, that would make for some unpleasant surprises, if people exploiting back then were suspended/banned for that now.
I'm looking forward to seeing THAT spam then!

To those that want older missions exploiters suspended. I think you got your wish.

Suspensions hurt EQ and everyone; DB, EQ, and the gaming community.

A simple fix would be:

Roll the characters back (this is kinda extreme and I still wouldn't do it, because people may quit and everyone has friends who may follow)
Take the items away from the people who did it (still a bit harsh, but this is the WORST thing I'd recommend)
or better yet, make the items PRESTIGE. Only paying customers could use them, and paying customer are what keeps the game going and continues to make it better for EVERYONE. And, if they're FTP, the item would suddenly be yellow and no benefit.

Look, in the end, all that exploit did was bypass a lockout. Do lockouts serve any kind of real purpose anymore? I understand it keeps an entire raid from farming some new super-item, but I've always looked at lockouts like this is what the game is telling me: "COME AND CONQUER THIS XYZ TASK AND TRY TO GET ABC ITEM: but only after 6:37 AM next tuesday.

Fun = more players = better gaming...

For the record, I didn't do it, but if someone invited me I probably would have went because I didn't see it as a problem. They did the work, just repeatedly.

How was it not something widely known if there are literally hundreds, potentially even thousands, of accounts getting suspensions for it? I'd be willing to bet over half the population of CT alone has gotten suspended. This is going to cripple raid guilds, and server populations as a whole, for weeks. If they were looking for a way to slow down progression, they found it.

What progression guild got hit the hardest?

Almost ALL of them on CT (4 raiding progression guilds/alliances) are down half or more of their raiders.

You're shocked because you feel DB might actually give a damn about PR or its customers. Truth is, sadly they just don't.

ok you got us all scared. We wont do it again. Time to remove those suspension now

I will continue to play but I will no longer support Daybreak. Credit card cancelled for reoccurring payments. Additionally my other accounts will not be purchasing the expansion. WTG Daybreak you lost money, and I'm absolutely sure I'm not the only one feeling this way..Hire new programmers and beta test properly and you wouldn't have to suspend half of the EQ population. Hell, if you had half a brain you would have listened to all the bug reports dating back 4 years MORONS!!! This is going to get very ugly before it gets better..
Additionally i might add..I could see bans or suspensions for those that exploited the raids, thats a serious offense, but to do this to such a large player base? You dummies are out of your mind to think there won't be blowback!! In the end, it was Daybreaks poor coding of missions that lead to this horrible debacle..

I also think it goes without saying, but according to their terms of service NOTHING states that what was done is considered an exploit..in regards to group content. I'll stand corrected IF someone can show me proof this was indeed an exploit and violated terms of service.. show me, make me a believer that this was justified punishment for the so called crime..

FWIW, as I've also been banned without having ever exploited this stuff, I've spent the last hour looking at logs... And I found one occurence where we started task, got 1st update on cactus death, I died after cactus died and someone opened chest, I got rezzed and got task exp/currencies without ever getting 2nd update/lockouts, we looted chest, we ended task.
The next time I have done the task was two days later (about 44 hours later, so way past the 6 hours lockouts)

I expect that'd be why I got banned for seven days: for a stupid bug in their effing code.
I'm sorry but this isn't gonna work for me. I want this ban lifted and expect an appology, even if I know I'll never get it... So meh. If they don't unban me fast it might be time to fix this addiction.

Anyway, if you also got banned incorrectly please check your logs for such a time when you died after cactus and someone else opened chest!

This is also my suspicion. I died on one mission before the cactus did and someone opened the chest before I was rezzed.

The sad part was I had to say in group I still needed a rez. I was able to get loot and my currency, never though to look for a lockout. No clue at this point if I even ran it a second time that day.

I'm actually really shocked they took such an extreme action for such a petty thing. But i digress, EQ has had a dying population for awhile now. This will hurt the game no matter how you try and rationalize it. HOW can this stand to do any good? Maybe DBG is intentionally trying to ruin their sales in the new year.

It's likely number 12 in the EULA, assuming the version at this link is the same as what's displayed when you log in.
Here is the portion of the referenced EULA I'm referring to
12. You will not exploit any bug in EverQuest and you will not communicate the existence of any such exploitable bug (bugs that grant the user unnatural or unintended benefits in game), either directly or through public posting, to any other user of EverQuest. You will promptly report any such bug via the in-game "/bug" command.

And by this exact definition of the rule and the FACT it was bug reported for 3 years or more, the lack of a response or action until today today the player base it WAS NOT a bug/exploit.

In any other real world setting what occurred would be considered the legal norm and the action DBG just took would result in lawsuits.

How would one differentiate from a bug to it being a known feature??? That EULA statement is quite vague.

EQ Forum Warrior Lawyer Powers -- ACTIVATE!

So where is the line drawn here?

Is dropping a task before its full completion a suspension worthy exploit?

This has broad ramifications beyond "got EZ chest loots in OT lol." What about players trying to complete achievements that can't be finished in one go? Lady of Life comes to mind, where dropping the task to re-run the mission for the "All Heroes / No Heroes" achievements is standard practice. There is a reward (XP/AA from the achievement), and an avoided lockout, so is this an exploit as well?

The same goes for any HA in the past 4 years with rare npc's attached to it. Running the task up until the NPC is supposed to spawn, then dropping before the lockout hits and redoing it is also standard practice.

Let's not forget that this "exploit" has been present for a long, long time, gets reported every Beta, and has never been an issue. After that many years, with the "bug" being reported each year, you're more or less forfeiting any indication that this isn't an intended mechanic.

I'd also love to know why this mission specifically was targeted for suspensions. You can run Skyfire and Gorowyn in 5 and 10 minutes, respectively, and do the exact same loot farming. You can literally do it right now, since the patch hasn't hit. Why weren't these NPC's also removed?

This is an extremely poor call on Daybreak's part, and I strongly support a reconsideration of these suspensions. It's an inappropriate response to something that should have been fixed internally and addressed with an announcement if it was considered an exploit. Considering the long-time knowledge of its existence, and the speed with which it was fixed, suddenly putting the collective foot down on this issue makes absolutely no sense.

As a side note, if the group/raid NPC swap exploit was a thing, that should absolutely be punished severely. I also don't have any accounts affected by these suspensions - I just feel that this was a poorly thought-out response that will heavily impact players' desire to continue paying for this game.