(Feedback) EoK - Dungeons, high mob density, few safe camp spots

Firstly kudos on delivering a good expansion. Enjoying many things, especially the outdoor zones and I'd glad I got in early.

Mob density in dungeons needs discussing though.


i) It's difficult, perhaps too difficult, to navigate dungeons due to a random mix of undead and see invis mobs with regular mobs;

ii) Mob density is generally a little high, too many mobs in too small an area;

iii) there are very few safe camp spots, where a group can set up or camp safely and maybe pull to.


i) is okay IMO. It's very reminiscent of Chardok back in 2000 when Kunark first launched and you'd have the Chokidai wandering around the entrance and exit area. It's tough to navigate but not impossible for a seasoned party;

ii) yeah I'm probably going to get blown out on this one being in the Veterans Lounge and all, but for the health of the game considering it for all players a lot of areas mob density is a little high in many areas of the dungeons. Too many wandering mobs, too many see invis wandering mobs in strategic areas.

iii) this is my main bone of contention. Every dungeon, even back in the day when Kunark released, had safe spots where you could pull to, form a party, rez up, heck do the unthinkable and go afk for 30 seconds to take a pee. Dungeons need these spots if they are going to get more than just a small number of players spending any time in them. Spots where you don't get mobs wandering through your camp spot or spawning on top of you. You need somewhere like this for every named mob if it's going to be in any way a challenge with a little space to split mobs and fight named.



What do other folks think ? Am I being too newb ? Try and see it from the point of view of players where the dungeons are a challenge and not from a party of high end players who can roll any area in the game.

For the record, I've been playing since '99 and done everything from being in world first guilds through some of the hardest content in the games history to casual family guilds. My biggest enjoyment has been exploring new content and taking good groups through it. It seems EoK dungeons are great for OP high end partys that like to dungeon crawl but a fail for static camps, which is what is the heart of the game for me.

I agree with you for the most part .. but here is my take .. if you gotta pee kill the mob that wanders and that should give you at least 12min if not 20 to take a leak and heck grab a drink while your at it..

I personally think that Chardok is too sparsely populated. Very easy to move about. Plenty of empty areas and gaps. I haven't even run in to any fun pathing yet. The roaming see-invis follow routes and are easy to account for after you've seen them.

I agree Segap.

I don't agree with the OP but that's just my opinion. If you are 2 or 3 boxing in places like Droga, can it be a pain when pulling if not careful? Maybe. Personally it gives the old feel back a "bit" and every zone can be steamrolled with a group of 4-6 real players. Again, just my opinion but based on my personal experience. I also see people 3 to 6 boxing content as well, I just personally hate boxing anymore than 2 toons, I prefer to group with actual players.

Just for the record about safe spots in zones, I have been able to find a spot to camp and do what I've wanted in every zone. I think the word "safe" will have a different definition for different people.

If dungeons aren't risky/hard in era they become obsolete very fast. Lack of mob density has proven to be a far greater issue over time for the majority of zones in EQ versus too many mobs.

More mobs, faster respawns = smaller camps and less of one person owning a zone as there camp, in my view.

A well tuned dungeon, again in my view, should be a crawl and not a camp anyways --at least if you are pursuing loot.

Killing a dungeon in era should require a good group.

Quote : A well tuned dungeon should be a crawl and not a camp.

i) Being well tuned has nothing to do with whether it's a crawl or a camp

ii) I couldn't disagree more about wanting a crawl. If I wanted to crawl dungeons I'd go play that other MMO.


This (mob density and too many roamers) is definitely more of a problem in Droga than Chardok. Chardok is somewhat workable. In Droga unless you want to be constantly on the move you have 6 people trying to back their backside into the same crack in the wall. It's probably my worst experience ever in playing EQ.

Alot if us "seasoned" players prefer thus type if play. It's the risk/reward. High risk high reward. Xping in say like gates of Kor'Sha or FM heck even laboratory is pretty easy, very little risk and is actually boring. Xping in Droga or Chardok is much more rewarding because it's faster XP and mobs die just as easily, yah theres a couple named who can be a pain but they are dealt with pretty easily. I see nothing wrong with the way it is and it shouldn't be changed in any way.

Try visiting Befallen and then come back here and say mob density is too high. I think the only place where you can make the argument is Droga. Chardok normally doesn't have more than double pulls. And for Droga, it isn't that the mobs are dense, it is because the mobs have a high assist range. Which personally I view as a nice challenge. When you pull a room in Droga, there is a good chance you will get 5 mobs, but being mainly dark blue is something that is recoverable. It should be noted that both Chardok and Droga almost require an enchanter.

Please don't make Everquest any more easier than what it is. Empires of Kunark finally poses some challenge for higher end players in some areas, just don't dumb it down because someone is angry that there are four mobs in an oval room in Droga, or you have to use both invis and ITU in Chardok...

There is some fun pathing with mushrooms in garden (pulled one that was five feet in front of me, it made a beeline to my right and brought five of its friends) and the sokokar area has some fun times too...

by seasoned do you mean in full raid gear , play during peak times and thus have a huge roster of toons to group with ? just curious ..

I'm pretty sure that most of you who are liking the dense population and 5+ pulls are the ones in uber guilds , full raid geared max aa's peeps .. even if your not full raid/max aa your prolly got most slots filled with raid/uber gear.. or play during max peak times where you can find a group almost always ..

Who is the angry person? The OP didn't come across as angry. Someone voicing a different opinion doesn't make the the bad guy. Simply questioning mob density and safe spots does not make them angry either.

I can see both sides of the issue. If I am boxing I like the idea of being able to afk whenever I can especially when doing a camp when there is no one around competing for it. I also see nothing wrong with some areas being more inconvenient to camp then others.

And lets face it the only real difficulty issue is mob density but that doesn't affect all dungeons. The rest is just inconvenience. Having to invis if you have to afk or at the worst having to time mobs that see invis and kill them then afk is not rocket science it is inconvenience. I guess it's a trade off for not having to do progression.

But I can also see that its nice to be able to just find a safe spot and pull mobs and not have to deal with high density mobs. I would expect that Daybreak always tries to find a balance to suit everyone. So far they seem to have done that with EoK that I have seen. Haven't done any missions yet just camped mobs and the only dungeon I actually camped for any significant period was Droga.

Probably more along the lines of experienced and competent.

EoK is neat because not only did it make CC relevant again, even for certain raid geared groups, but it allowed the majority of mobs to be CC'd.

Heading into Droga? NP. Bring an Enchanter or bard for mez.

No mez available? NP. Use ghetto root CC from one of the 50 classes who have that spell.

This works in Chardok, Droga, Gates, and even Kor-Sha Lab. There's also "safe" spots to camp in all the dungeons

There's some decent dungeon fun in EoK, would like to see that continue!

IMO, the hardest spot in EoK is the Drachnid caves in Lcea... 5 min respawn and nothing is CC friendly in any way.

Pop seems fine to me - just remove spinstun. Spinstun was never fun and still is not fun today.

I enjoy all of the dungeons the way they are now. Normally have no problem finding a safe stop around an area I want to camp. Personally I prefer a dungeon that you have to work to get to the place you want to camp - not simply form up and run to the bottom to camp a name. True I am in raid gear but the rest of the group I travel with isn't. If you want easier places to reach and camp stick to the outdoor zones - if you want to enjoy more of a challenge forge a path into the dungeons!

I haven't spent time in the caves outside of progression tasks, but everything was mezable and fadable.

Well, if one requires the convenience, there are plenty of outdoor zones and places for you to go. Every zone should not be designed around people that need to afk at any moment. Pick your spot based on what your current play session allows.

I had no problem with the drachnid caves as crappy 3 boxer. I have been 3 boxing bard/ranger/enchanter lately. I do remember mostly using root for CC there.

Edit: I've been working my way through hunter achievement and I'm nearly done with t1 zones. I am also kind of worried about Droga with the large density even with all the CC I have. With having to use a ranger as tank I would need to survive some of these 4 and 5 pulls long enough for mez to go off and I don't think I will be able to every time with the limited defensive tools rangers get for tanking even with 15k+ AC.