Test Update 07/20/15

No Mills, we definitely don't need MORE nerfs - we need the nerfs to be stopped!

Preventing something from becoming more of a problem isn't a nerf. Or tuning something properly so the desired outcome actually happens, isn't asking for more nerfs its asking for the implied nerf they seem to be implementing to be handled properly.

I can only guess that they wan't to reel in burstained by making nukers use adps for burst and not staggered for sustained. Otherwise there really is no point to any of these changes this late in the game. Melee needed sweeping changes not wizards or mages. Mages would be jsut as bad had they not paired it with a sweeping change to their spells. I still think even with the rain changes the drastic spike changes, paired with other nukes, paired with proc changes will net them being slightly ahead then they were prior. Mages just dont have all the nice tools that wizards do or just have them to a much lessor degree negating how big of a change this is for nukes.

Some adjustments are fine, they just don't have fine tact skills.
Some classes are hit too often and / or hard, while some continue their uberness.
Some (melee lately) are not buffed fast enough, etc. etc.
That is prolly the thing most people around here notice, i don't think most would have a problem with careful adjustments...

Lets look at this another way.

The devs are making these changes for some reason. We don't know what it is yet.

Do you honestly think the reason was to simply add 100K burst to wizards and to a lessor degree mage burst, since they don't get the same burn tools? This ignores the rain changes for now as if the rain nerfs didn't go in mages would be almost as boosted by these changes as wizards. And provide nukers 100% always there sustained help via more passive over crit vs better help most times but that required a druid or enchanter being with you? Outside of the rain changes which we will see how they pan out its win win for nukers right now.

I don't and believe they either don't realize how big an impact these changes will make for now. Or do but realize they have other adjustments in the pipeline soon or in the future campaign. Regardless that would be a 2nd nerf to those classes if handled later on down the road. Instead of getting the first nerf right via changes on test before it hits live.

To me the real issue with caster dps is caster adps chains and nuking mana regen or preservation. Auspice, IoG and BW being used in chains or right after the other to maintain 100% crit rates when paired with other stuff and allowing for basically always having some nuke over crit mod on. Not that fact that nuke over crit didn't stack and was then used in a chain manner, just prevent chaining it to begin with and adjust sustained up as desired via other means. And burst casters simply don't go out of mana for all that bang like they used to so they no longer follow the dps curve that melee do.

Tack on mostly sustained events and we have an issue everyone wants fixed.

Im really i mean REALLY curious to know how they plan to make melee dps as powerful as wizards with next expansion upgrades without nerfing anything for casters.

Since they are making things stack that never stacked before; maybe melee will get critical chance stacking. I don't think we will hit the 100% critical rate of casters but would close the gap by the tiniest of margins.

Maybe these are the types of changes they need, i.e. the extra granularity these changes will provide to casters (wizards in particular) abilities and stacking, to help balance the classes. I have no doubt that more tuning will follow other for other classes.

I wish i could soak up some of your optimism

It's easy, quit playing.............worked for me!

Sadly Sir I am almost there 1 account silver, other accounts(2) expire in sept, we shall see if I renew then.

Not a nuke expert so still not positive exactly how this all works out but my numbers if off are underestimations.

I am being told Chromatic Haze boosts is multiplicative not additive but they weren't clear as to when or how its handled.

So I am not sure if thats 400% passive over crit, which still might be a low guess on its own, x 375% for a 1500% over crit mod for 1 nuke.

Or if its 595%, the total of activated over crit, x 375% for a 2231% over crit mod for 1 nuke.

Or it its 995%, the total of passive and active over crit, x 375% for a 3731% over crit mod for 1 nuke.

1) Haze is not a crit damage mod. Haze is a focus effect.
2) Expect Haze to get reduced. (It was too powerful even before this change).
3) Mana Charge lasts for THREE spells total.
4) Mana Charge has as 3 HOUR recast.
5) Necros already have over 1000% critical damage mod when stacking, and the base of all your DoTs together easily exceeds 33k. The only difference is you have to ramp up and we don't...which is how it is supposed to be for our respective classes.
6) Stop saying overcrit, it sounds stupid. It's just crit damage. No one says "overfocus" or "overmanaregen" or "over" anything else because that would be stupid too.

Wizard passive critical damage on live is 383. Wizard passive critical damage on Test is 407. It's +24 which is not a big change for us. It's a MUCH bigger change for Mages & other nukers who went from 270 on live to 401 on Test which is +131.

That means Wizards got a defacto nerf compared to every other nuker class because they all gained over 100 passive crit damage that we did NOT.

When testing last night I was able to hit ~370k for ~60 seconds, after which it dropped off sharply as Twincast wore off.

400/22 weapons. They aren't going to lower delay any further, so may as well jack base damage through the roof.

Unrelated to this, they know about the issues with melee.

Oh no, you gained passive crit chance, but not as much as everyone else so you got nerfed....

So, you had it better then EVERYONE else for years, and now its considered a nerf. More like bringing people up to par, considering ur crit DMG mod is still head and shoulders above mages who got 'boosted'.

The logic is real boys.

Here's the current crit damage mod buffs (and projected change from Test):

Keep in mind there are short duration things included. This doesn't include passive crit mods (Destructive Fury). Also I don't anticipate MAG using Vapor Core, but I may be wrong.

I wasn't able to parse anything because I can't get my logs to turn on the Test server for some reason.

1) I see. Does this effect stack with the activated critable focus AA effect wizards received?
2) Will see but then again other classes are being hit because of what you can do with it if thats the case.
3) MC is a 50% boost dropping you to 945% over crit, ignoring the missed data I had that bump this 945% up even higher. So while I mentioned it I also showed without it because of its long reuse and 36s use or charge limits. I also see the post above me shows I missed some other activated over crit for wizards that change my numbers upwards. As well as me missing 7% from passive.
4) 7th vet is still a 4 hour use for most people and yet its almost always included in someones big parse linked as evidence of why they are overpowered.
5) Wrong necros can not hit 1000% over crit. They can't even reach the 945% wizards can after these changes if you exclude mana charge entirely. It also takes casting 9-10 dots to reach what was done with 1 and thats only if a mob can be turned into a plant. More otherwise. I have no issue with that as you said thats our trade off ramp up time for higher base sustained once we finally get there. But your nuke over crit mod should not exceed dot over crit mods with your base spells damage being as high as they are especially when you now have superior mana regen and prolonged sustained as of the past 3 or so years with how out of whack your regen and preservation has become compared to your nukes cost.
6) Most of my community refer to it as over crit. Potato Potato. When most people put 2 coats of stuff on their walls to cover up an old color they essentially use 2 paints, most people call the first primer to distinguish it and those that don't still understand it and don't call it stupid to refer to it differently. Necros tend to call the first 100% mod as crit and any added passive or activated above that over crit. As it goes over and above the standard 100% crit. Just as they refer to worn focus effects as focus and then any bonus like bard and such that was added later over focus. Again tomato tomato.

383% passive with your familiar? So its 407% on test now without your familiar which gives you added options to use in place of it if it does in fact not stack with passive boost from AA line. Most other nukers don't have the tools you do to get to 100% crit rate as often, have critable focus effects or have 28-33K base nukes to chain all day as long as they have mana. From what I see no one else can hit 1084% over crit mod for nukes, excluding MC and the fact that you are the only class with critable focus mods for nukes.

Wizards are getting a defecto boost because of all the tools they have for nukes that others don't have or that they have to a much lessor degree. Its like adding 200AC to all characters and saying they all got the same benefit when in fact because of how some classes handle it its actually a much bigger advantage to them and its why AA lines that add AC had to be archetype adjusted, in this case it would need to be class by class, to actually make it even.

I have already seen 400K parses wizards linked repeatedly from Test changes round 1, not 1 random parse meaning all that much. I expect this type of dps to go up with round 2.

Mana Charge is only duration limited, you only get 3 spells out in ~36sec?

Mana charge was changed it now lasts 36 seconds or 3 counters whichever is used up first. It's in the spell notes somewhere.

Actually, the best analogy for Chromatic Haze is that it is a focus for nukes that works exactly the same way as foci for DoTs work. So if you want to start saying our crit damage mod is Crit_Damage*Crit_Focus, you'll have to do the same for DoTs. And it's only for one spell.