Plane of War (maybe or Maybe not)

Discussion in 'The Veterans' Lounge' started by Nyni, Feb 28, 2014.

  1. Axxius Augur

    Your definition of negativity seems to differ from mine. Groups of 6 individuals won't monopolize a spawn for long. But put a sellable raid quality item on that spawn and you'll see it perma-camped by boxers.
    1 in 3 isn't bad. ;) Don't make raid quality items tradable. There is a server for that, FV.
    Sinestra likes this.
  2. Rainbowdash Augur

    The screenshot you posted kinda already answers it, but the background was a bit hard to judge, the files for the zone patched in on Beta (most packed in .s3d) seem to answer this as well. But i'll ask it anyway!

    This zone... is rendered in Luclin/PoP era graphics right? The original zone design/geometry (mostly..you said you finished the geometry). so zoning in for the first time, it will look and feel like we're zoning into a PoP zone at level 65 right? :p I really hope so <3 lol
  3. Loratex The Ridiculous Necro

    this is very disappointing
    Kelefane likes this.
  4. Mithrandyr Augur

    Like you said earlier, anything you do to a box group affects a group of six. If you try to cripple a 6 box with rules and regulations, you will cripple a 6 group. There are 6 boxers out there that are better than a 6 group. So again, cripple the 6 box, cripple the 6 group. If you disallow mercs, you won't just be hurting the 3 box +3, you'll be hurting the 4 group +2, and the 5 group +1. There realistically isn't anything that will discourage boxing that wont affect groups. The best you can do is tune content so that only 6 really good players can handle it, in which case groups of raiders will be there to fill the gap.

    Can we stop micromanaging EQ already and just let everyone play and have fun? Sometimes I feel like this is the politically correct rally that is so neurotic about being PC that nothing ever gets done for fear of offending anyone. There is this tiny area in the middle of appeasing both extremes, that people strive for, that is completely unachievable except at the cost of ruining the whole thing.
    Xianzu_Monk_Tunare likes this.
  5. Orbital101 Augur

    That get me all excited! hopefully it will keep us busy longer then CotF T1a/b!

    Finally some real challenge!
  6. Slasher Augur



    2 group named are a bad idea. You're essentially creating content only raid geared toons can beat. It's hard enough to get ONE group without a merc imagine getting 2 without mercs ? I say without mercs because mercs cannot be in a raid and coordinating multiple groups not in a raid is lol let alone the fact that whatever group does the most dps will get the loot/xp. You really expect 12 people to camp a named for hours on end ? Its hard enough to get 6 real people to do it.

    There has to be a way for this content to be challenging but keep it doable by 1 group of group geared players. Raid geared players will always trivialize content do not punish groupers because of this.

    I gotta say if you keep creating 2 group content it shows how out of touch the devs are in terms of the group content in this game. This game is not new it does not have 5m people playing we cannot just get 12 people together to camp named hours on end. Maybe we can do it when the zone is new people are excited to go there, but what about 6 months from now when everyone is bored of the zone ? You just created content no groupers can honestly beat with 1 group.
    Leerah, Xianzu_Monk_Tunare and Axxius like this.
  7. Ravengloome Augur

    I am guessing it will be challenging but doable for 1 group of group geared toons. Considering the afforementioned Chelsith mobs were doable by 1 group or less while they were current (of group geared people). < But i am guessing all 4, 5, or 6 of those people will have to be on their crap/skilled

    ^ Theres no way I can think of that they can create content that is doable by 2 groups, but not in some way doable by 1 group. It might be a real motherf****er but Someone is going to find a way to do these so called 2 group mobs with 1 or less.

    Its not punishing groupers in anyway shape or form, its giving us something to achieve. Also the way it was worded made it sound less like a sit around and camp and more like the named were going to be individual events. < I could have misunderstood what was said tho
    Elricvonclief likes this.
  8. Slasher Augur


    They were not 1 groupable by 99% of groupers in a conventional group setup. I.E no pet tanking i cant stand it when you're forced to have a mage to pet tank a named or it cannot be killed reasonably.
    Leerah likes this.
  9. Ravengloome Augur

    I didnt pet tank them...

    Sk Paladin Cleric Monk Beast Bard

    We did Huge Mistake, that dorf, and Undefeated Blade about a week after T3 ROF came out. In Group gear. No mage pet required.
  10. Falos Augur


    Funny thing about the undefeated blade, pet tanking him actually isn't an advantage given how the adds work. Generally a group that pet tanks is gonna be a caster heavy fragile group. Everytime the undefeated blade spawned adds they would ignore the pet and rush towards random casters. It's actually a lot harder for mage pets to pickup agro on all the adds and still successfully tank the named mob himself. RoF had a few things though that were kind of anti-pet based. that was one of them, and the chapterhouse mission 2 boss is also another example of something i'd consider "anti-pet tank"
  11. sojuu Augur

    I just hope this 2 group concept doesnt turn into hard for 2 groups but easy for casters. I would love to see the mob turned into a mob that reflects 100% of spells at range. Or does an aura that does dmg at like 50-300 range. Maybe even both.
  12. Beimeith Lord of the Game


    For spite?
  13. alidan Lorekeeper

    some people aren't good at the game and are envious of others.
    for melee dps you need a solid tank, but there are so few people who can pull that off that its sad.
    for casting dps, all you need is something to hold aggro, even though players are better tanks than pets, so few know how to do it right that it makes pets look good.
  14. Daedly Augur

    Like someone previously mentioned this zone is going to be packed. Which is cool to have a lot of folks in the same zone, but that means there wont be a lot of places to be in there. So I started thinking of some ways that the zone could be made to support more people. Allowing more people enjoy the zone. So here is my list of the things to see done to the zone that I think could solve the issue.

    1. Increase the HP of all the none rare mobs by 100% to 120%.
    -To slow the kill rate of groups which would allow more people experience the zone.
    2. Double the base experience of the zone.
    -This is to compensate for the increase in HP of the mobs.
    3. Increase the number or rare mob placeholders in the zone.
    4. Increase the spawn rate of the rare mobs.
    -To compensate for the increased number of rare mob placeholders.
    5. Spread out the placeholders of particular rare mobs across the zone so that 1 group is unable to kill all of them.
    -This is so that more than one group can hunt the same rare mobs making the zone capable of supporting more groups.
    6. Reduce the number of mobs of mobs required to be killed on any quest that requires a kill count of a particular mob.
    -Compensate for the increased HP of the mobs.
    7. Any tradeable loot should be zonewide/mob type random drop loot. Not anything that is gotten soley from rare creatures.
    -Reduce the likelyhood of a rare being camped for long peroids by the same person(s).

    Anyways, those are the things that I believe would allow some zones to support much larger populations than what we often run into with new content.
  15. alidan Lorekeeper


    did the zone ho live yet? or are you just making assumptions
    Obiziana and Xianzu_Monk_Tunare like this.
  16. Drathus Augur

    I agree with everything you just said 100%. You stated my own sentiments in your second paragraph.

    The suggestion to eliminate mercs was not not really suggested to cripple anyone, but more to encourage cooperation. Are the 4 + 2 and the 5 + 1 groups really going to have a hard time finding real people to join them? Will they be more inclined to allow the LFGs to join them if mercs are not available? Again, it wasn't really suggested to cripple anyone. Mercs were not originally available in PoP . . . the only reason I even thought of the suggestion. If the zone is permanent, it's probably a bad idea overall though.
  17. Drathus Augur

    What makes a chase item less desirable to a group of six people over a box group? You think that only boxers camp stuff to use or sell? Why won't a group of six people continue to camp a spawn. On the progression servers, groups would form up to camp named and as one person left, another LFG would replace them. Some camps had waiting lists and the camp never really opened up. A single person camping a spawn has to sleep. The waiting list camps never truly broke up.

    Either way, there are ways to prevent this. Simply don't have PHs. If the rare named can spawn in many different places (within the designated areas), everyone in the area has a chance to spawn it. Also, if there are a few of the rare named, you are looking at several people per named. The zone is going to be able to support a large number of people quite easily.

    I'm on FV btw =P So items being tradable is not an issue.

    Also, I may have missed it, as I skimmed over the posts, but I didn't see anyone state that these two group named were going to drop raid quality loot. They were going to drop loot that is superior to current group loot?
  18. Drathus Augur


    This is very similar to what happened in the recent HHs. Every single area of the dungeon was camped regardless of the named that spawned in them. Respawn rate allowed for a large player base in the zone.
  19. alidan Lorekeeper


    in my experience, yes, you will be hard pressed to replace a merc with a player.
    we had a 100 wizzard join group a while ago, and a level 97 bst
    the wizard put out 7kdps
    the bst put out 9k and was under geared.

    a wizard merc hits 10k minimum and goes up to 12 or 14... i forget what the highest across a large number of mobs was.
    the group im normally in doesnt even value the mercs as decent, they just value them as better than the alternatives.

    if i remember right, we also grouped with a 100 cleric who got out healed by a 100 bst... so yea... mercs arent good, but there are plenty of real players that make mercs look fantastic.
  20. Siddar Augur

    Two group content is a bad idea.

    Two group content for groupers always ends up being default single group content for raiders.

    Groupers not able to kill two group named but able to kill trash for chance at chase items end up spawning rares for raiders.

    Having rare chase items means there is a large incentive to keep group size small so as to increase chances of acquiring those items.

    Two group content makes splitting a single group into two group with three mercs each happen.

    Many group geared tanks will under perform mage earth pets causing formation of no melee all ranged groups.

    If you want to have two group content you need to provide a reason for people to group not make two group content and then reward people for keeping there group as small and as merc heavy as possible.

    You should drop the rare part from rare chase items and just go with chase items. let most everyone spend time in zone and leave with the zones chase item after a reasonable length of time. Make a zone quest using a drop that drops from every named in zone so players have reason to group up and farm named in raid format.