Wonderverse not so wonderful for solo/duo players

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by Robert-Vim, Jul 31, 2020.

  1. Robert-Vim New Player

    I usually don't post on the forums. I've been here since day one and my family has maintained 5 accounts the entire time. We however, do NOT raid. We play the game to spend time with each other as a family. My son and I can be found almost every day on one or more of our alts. This being said; the new Wonderverse isn't geared for anyone that plays solo/duo. Everything has been geared to run in a pre-made raid setting group. This is an insult to those of us that have been loyal for years. It's almost as if the Devs said collectively" Screw those that don't/won't raid! If they want to do anything THIS time they'll have to or they can just shut up and pay for the game to sit on the sidelines." The open world "bounties"? Shall we REALLY go there? Almost impossible to get even so much as one killed ( which we have not as yet ) with credit let alone all. Ridiculous. Now I understand the Devs and their friends all raid together so they have no clue what it is to duo/solo apparently. Someone on the Dev team needs to step up and remember that many of us don't raid and we still pay for the game and should be considered when making new content as well. Well enough ranting. I felt I needed to say something this time. Please excuse the "venting".
    • Like x 11
  2. SekretVillain Dedicated Player

    This isnt new. Dcuo for most part has always been and will always be about their precious raids and forming groups. It is after all a MMO/RPG
  3. Robert-Vim New Player

    Yeah MANY MMOs out there do NOT require a raid just to play. Matter of fact pretty much all of them unless they're specifically set to it base line. Solo play on MMOs has become a norm over the 20 plus years Ive been playing. Requiring people to form a group or not play has been increasingly frowned upon by patrons. This update was simply for the raid groups. Plain to see. Which was the reason for my post.
    • Like x 6
  4. Trexlight Loyal Player


    Thats honestly more to the point of MMOs is to do the raiding. Its why its the End Game content that is the focus. The Open World is the best bet for what content youre looking for but MMOs surround either leveling to get to End Game but End Game nonetheless is the goal. Its a build up to that.

    I applaud your efforts for how your family plays but that way might not be in the sense what DCUO can provide. Best you can do is take your family and run the Bounties together in open world to get some gear and run the Alert of course.

    MMORPGs are always about the leveling experience and then the raiding and bringing people together to run content. Its not really a place for solo or duo playing in the grand scheme.
    • Like x 6
  5. Wallflower Level 30

    What's stopping you from running the solo/dailies if that's all you like anyway?
    • Like x 2
  6. Robert-Vim New Player

    I do not agree. MMOs are NOT just about raids. Only someone that raids would even say so. MMOs are about all kinds of people playing all kinds of ways. This game wasn't created around raids. It was solo/duo/4man/8man. No one should be pigeon holed into doing nothing but raids.
    • Like x 7
  7. Walvine Well-Known Player

    If you donot track down skillpoints or donot do john constantines artifacts game gets increasingly harder but they is easy alternative way of increasing survival of your character with auguments.
    Take your unwanted loot rewards to the RnD machines (watchtower or hall of doom) ,you can break down armor and weapon parts into Exobyte ,This craft can be used to uprank the augments giving you much stronger stats .
    Patchwork thermiscira map I noticed no difficulty issue with the solo missions other than having to do 30 things for each sigh.
    Remember hold block as enemy leap attacks will stun and reflect some damage back to them.Tapping block breaks you out of stun.
    If cockarice screech leap attack to disrupt them , Using shield power in load out will also allow you to use all interactions with out being interupted turning those rage red light machines into green light machines.
    One enemy interaction will cause some smaller versions of the enemy to respawn ,deactivating the interaction will prevent them spawning , portals just require you to protect amazonian closing them and atlantis ship turrets beware they are a 8 player boss bounty freeroaming on the beach.
  8. willflynne Unwavering Player

    Hmmm.

    Okay, just for the record I'm very much a solo-centric player myself, so I thought I'd just put that out there.

    I'm going to hold off on any real judgement of the main Wonderverse content, partly because running any content when it's brand new/just released probably isn't going to give an accurate view of how it's going to be in the long term but also because it IS brand new. We're talking one day old tops, so the likelihood of changes and adjustments being made is pretty high. I wouldn't be surprised if this first weekend is used to get some data and feedback to use for adjustments.

    Plus I just hate feeling like I'm being crowded, even virtually. LOL

    That being said, the layout of the open world stuff did pique my interest. Being able to run that open world stuff and contribute how I'd like to contribute and earn something for my efforts was something novel, and the idea of being able to jump in and help much in the same way as the South Gotham content allowed was a bonus to me. Hopefully once things calm down and the content gets adjusted I'll be able to check it for myself to see how it goes.

    As for MMOs? My view has always been that they are what you make of them. To me this game is no different. You can go it alone, raid like a crazy person, play dress-up, whatever. Whatever the game developers may focus on for the overall plan or just a specific content release is what it is, but that doesn't necessarily mean you have to follow along with their plans. I'm pretty sure I can count the actual number of raids I've run (as in grouped with seven other players, not just doing a walk-in on an old raid by myself) on one hand. Between that and some pit stops along the way to farm Marks for stuff (Rare Style vendor, mainly) my progress is far from quick, but even so I've got most of my active characters at or just about to qualify for running Age of Justice content.
    • Like x 8
  9. MsTickle Fate Devoted Player

    I didn't see anyone saying anyone else should be forced to only do raids.

    But if you refuse to do anything but solos and duos, that's on you.

    If "no one should be pigeon-holed into doing nothing but raids" is a true statement, logically "no one should be pigeon-holed into doing nothing but solos and duos" must also be true. But you seem to disagree. Which is it?

    "MMOs are NOT just about solos and duos. Only someone that solos and duos would even say so"? Is that equally true? If not, why doesn't it go both ways?

    But, yeah, who else is going to speak up for raids but people who raid? To whom, exactly, is that not perfectly obvious? Do you think there are people who have never raided who think, nevertheless, that the game is all about raiding? Who are these people and where do they post?
    • Like x 6
  10. Trexlight Loyal Player


    Well the game is geared towards End Game Content. Like Willflynne, you can certainly make it as you want but the prime purpose of this Episode specifically is to promote group play. If there are those that are in the Solo category of a Massive Multi Player RPG, this Episode will certainly fall flat for you.
    • Like x 2
  11. Apollonia Well-Known Player

    Maybe it was true 15 years ago. It's not true anymore tho.

    Imagine thinking that forcing people to play with others (who they might not want to have anything to do with), and gating their ability to progress in game and experience a product they're paying for, are fundamental to the MMO experience. The design philosophy behind MMOs is simply to bring people together and allow them to play cooperatively (as they choose) in a persistent immersive world. That's it. That's all. That's what MMOs are about. Period.

    As a whole the genre has matured and those early players of MMOs have grown up and have work family and friends to juggle. The entire industry and genre has realized that forcing players to play their way on their terms drives away players. Devs still taking that approach to development shorten the lifespan of their games.

    MMOs have used a variety of tactics and techniques to "engage" their players over the last 15years plus; over inflated grind, loot boxes and so on, are widely accepted by players in the genre. These are tropes of MMO development but they're not fundamental to the experience or genre. Things change. In fact, these are now accepted to be unethical business practices and laws are finally adapting to acknowledge that.

    MMOs being persistent in nature are organic with new content being added all the time. "But it's about endgame" is really a failed position since the game doesn't end. Again, that's old school thinking from 15-20 years ago. All new content should be easily experienceable by the playerbase. The term "Endgame" is meaningless [in the context of MMOs] now.
    • Like x 4
  12. Mepps Sr. Community Manager

    Nothing is gated based on needing to play with others or not, and while you may find more success working with others in the open world, you can go it alone and do your thing.

    I don't think it is accurate to say this episode (from our intent) is focused on making people group more. We're focused on providing a new and different experience, with larger fights in an open world vs. smaller fights in an instance.

    It definitely won't be everyone's favorite thing and some will reject a new thing because it is different, but it is just one more part of an already massive game. As with any new thing, we designed it, iterated on it, made assumptions, tested it, and launched it. The live feedback for this episode will do a lot to inform us what could be changed, and what to do or not do next time. We'll keep working on it.
    • Like x 10
  13. nawanda Dedicated Player

    I’ve never met a DCUO player who doesn’t raid. I’ve probably had about 500 different players in my league and I’ve met many more. I’ve never even heard of not raiding as a style of play.

    You can’t cater game design around extremely niche play. This reminds me a little of the thread some religious zealot posted just before JLD launched, where they said the arcane nature of the content was so offensive to them that they didn’t want to play the DLC and demanding that feats be removed so they didn’t miss any skill points. They wanted the rest of us to miss out because it wasn’t right for them.

    You don’t walk into McDonalds and expect them to have facilities for people who can only eat blended food through a straw.

    It’s not an insult to anyone, I think the outrage in the original post is completely over the top. What exactly is it that BOP had that this DLC is missing, for solo players? It has a solo mission and open world dailies. I don’t get it.
    • Like x 2
  14. willflynne Unwavering Player


    While I can't say that I've never raided, the amount of traditional raiding I have done is miniscule. Like I said earlier, I can probably count the number of raids I've done with other players on one hand. Anything else was just doing solo walk-ins to see how I'd fare.

    So hi, nice to meetcha. :D
    • Like x 1
  15. nawanda Dedicated Player

    Hey!

    Fair enough. I do think it has to be a tiny percentage of regular players like this though. Raids are the best thing and the core of the game. I suppose there are people who go to casinos every week for a drink at the bar. You wouldn’t design your casino around them though. I’m probably being a little bit narrow minded, I just really can’t get my head round it. The solo stuff is rubbish compared to the raids.
    • Like x 1
  16. Reinheld Loyal Player

    Not 100% true. I've maintained 999 coins, or kept up on the purple gear on some of my alt account toons just by doing the daily/weekly outdoor stuff and free mark, only hitting the raids on 2x or 3x weeks. The bounties in the previous DLCs were conducive to you just getting in and participating in the general group. These new ones are NOT that way. I ran on an alt just an hour or so ago, ran through the set of bounties and only got 'paid' on 2 of them (Murk and Hydra). I was participating as much as I could, but if you go down and do not get picked up, you are either forced to stay down, or run the risk of not being back by the time the boss dies...assuming it's semi close to dying. If you did not do enough damage, you either get no drop or the minimal 3 Aether. With the fact that the amount of Aether needed to buy the things you will likely need is in the 1000's, this is an issue.

    BTW....that whole process of the dailies and minimally successful bounty run took an hour...for an alt. A single day in Bop WITH doing the bounties for an alt was 10-20 min MAX and I got full pay for it.
    • Like x 3
  17. Snow OwI Loyal Player

    It can be hard as a solo player but it's not impossible:) I did the bounties for a few hours yesterday on my alt and not my main and most of the time I did it without joining a group just dpsing on my own in a heavely populated phase and hopeing for the best.Though the lag was utterly insane some times (was down to 19 fps when usually over 120 fps),the bounties can depend on how lucky you are,how comportable you are with your alts roles and your skillpoints but it is doable,just not very fun at all :) I also wish there were more solo content though.For the most of the times I do things solo when ever I can.
  18. KneelBeforeZodd Active Player

    I don't get what you mean... The world bosses are here to replace 1 raid, if this episode followed the past ones, you'd have the same amount of content to play, since you don't play raids. Except that this time you have the chance to kill the world bosses and get the best items just by standing in a area full of players. The solo/alert content is still there for you. Except for the Fractured god raid, you don't need to get a full group for anything (unless you want to farm the world bosses quickly).

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there are no issues with the open world, lag is pretty common and there were plenty of bugs on launch, but I don't see how any of that fills in your complaints. They didn't swap solo/duo content for the world bosses, they swapped 1 group content for another.
    • Like x 2
  19. Light Bender92 Well-Known Player

    This is the weirdest “feedback” I’ve ever seen. You’re crying about this dlc being to “group” centric when there’s literally as much solo content as previous dlcs.... you say you’ve been here since day one, so did you complain about origin crisis? Hand of fate? Battle for earth? Hell I’ll even go recent. Did you complain about Metal pet 1&2? B.o.P? Because if you didn’t complain about any of those then you’re a hypocrite and are just looking for something to complain about. The bosses aren’t perfect but again there’s just as much solo content as literally any other dlc, and to get credit for the bosses you can literally just kill a few adds or do the side stuff lol. Metal part 2 and BoP only had 3 solos and 1 solo/duo instance respectively. I don’t remember seeing a thread like this for those dlcs. This dlc now has 4 (FOUR) solo missions, an instanced solo, AND bosses that you can get credit for simply by being in the vacuity (even if you fail). I’m not seeing how your play style is being attacked when you actually have MORE content to access this dlc... the open world bosses replaced what would be a second raid anyways, it didn’t take the place of any solo or duo content. If you were really this upset about this you would’ve long quit dcuo because this dlc (as I stated earlier) has literally just as much (if not more) solo/duo content than any other dlc.
    • Like x 2
  20. Brit Dedicated Player



    I think it is more that the world bosses do not just replace a raid; they also replace the open world Bounties of previous episodes. Those open world bounties were an area that you could go and hang out nearby while waiting for a group, do your dailies, and when a group assembled, you jump in for just a little bit and you get 8 marks for completion of a weekly. This was a very efficient time investment for players, allowing for alts to get full Episode gear and requiring little time and no real interaction with other players.

    The World Bosses of Wonderverse are on a 30 minute timer, and have a 3-4 minute window before they "win" and despawn. You cannot simply wait nearby; you MUST coordinate with other players or you will be stuck waiting forever. Most frequently, you will be required to phase to overly populated shards in order to find an instance where the boss is actually up and where a group is actually going to kill them. This means you're required to, at the very least, open some of the overly obnoxious chats or make lengthy friends lists in order to have people to phase with. Then you have to hop into these absurdly swamped shards that will lag you towards disconnect, so that you can hopefully get credit for a bounty. And ultimately, you will receive reduced rewards because your DPS isn't as good as the people who are in a group (especially if you're playing as a Support role).

    The World Bosses take far more time than the previous bounties, and require a lot more interaction with other players. This isn't even about people just being antisocial and wanting to solo. Those people using a computer that cannot handle large groups who prefer to stick to small group content to avoid crashing, they're pretty much doomed because of the way these World Bosses lay out their very narrow fight windows with ridiculously long spawn timers.
    • Like x 3

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