What's villain content like

Discussion in 'Gotham City (Gameplay Discussion)' started by megamanzero, May 17, 2018.

  1. megamanzero Loyal Player

    Is it still a copy of hero content or is it unique ?
    I used to play both sides cause it was different but after a while they became too similar for me. Was thinking of picking up the game again. How is the content for AF3 and on
    • Like x 1
  2. 9001BPM Loyal Player

    It had been pretty much the same, BUT starting from Deluge and Death Of Superman they’ve been starting to address it. I don’t think we’ll ever get HOF levels of divergence again, because they’re trying to make as much stuff cross-faction as possible, but Death Of Superman is at least as Divergent as pre-30.
  3. Shark Dental Loyal Player

    Let's put it this way. If you've ever wanted to stomp Guy Gardner in the stomach, while he's down and injured, this is your chance, lol. :D
    • Like x 1
  4. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    Looks like there may be a coup, with Calculator set to oust Luthor and show the Heroes what a Villain really is :D
    • Like x 4
  5. 9001BPM Loyal Player

    That initial com from Supergirl and Calculator was practically leaning on the fourth wall the way it summed up the recent situation for villains. I hope they make good on his call to arms in the long term, I didn’t realise quite how much I’d missed having a different experience with my villain until we got it back. :D
    • Like x 2
  6. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    It's about damn time villains started acting like Villains! :mad:
    • Like x 1
  7. megamanzero Loyal Player

    How is this new content different
  8. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    Different solo missions, bounties, slightly different feats and com speeches, that's about it. Both factions still have to fight doomsday Supermans Wifey said so.
    • Like x 2
  9. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    Wait, Soupcan finally married his cousin? Knew she was into weird things (her first boyfriend being a flying horse was just the start...)
  10. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    Ew no not her, apparently we only answer when Lois Lane barks.
  11. TITAN ephemeral Loyal Player

    it is what it is...take it or leave it
  12. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    Hmm, was sure the request came from Soupgirl... o_O
  13. megamanzero Loyal Player

    What kind of things can i expect from those DLC
  14. Fatal Star 10000 Post Club

    It came from her, but calculator revolted. We ended up fighting doomsday anyway cause Clark wifey asked us to
  15. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    No, Calcie may be revolting, butt he still agreed to help, he is planning a coup against Luthor, who has grown soft and non-villainous
  16. bigbadron alt Committed Player

    I have to admit, earlier this evening I quite enjoyed kicking Power Girl while she was down. :D
  17. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    Damn, have only come across Gardner and Gold :(
  18. Great Architect Committed Player

    As has been mentioned, Villain and Hero group content has been subject to the Suicide Squad / Task Force X rule: - A well-meaning, but ultimately self-defeating attempt to deal with population imbalances - Feats must be cross-faction, goals must be cross-faction. I can see some logic to this - inasmuch as it would be impossible to complete a Feat in a cross-faction group if both sides were attempting to do opposites (which is the usual unimaginative execution of Villain vs. Hero feats)

    This has resulted in a watering-down of the distinction between the factions, and has (IMO) contributed to the decline of population on the Villain side. There's nothing that makes Villains more attractive than Heroes, other than your predilection to play one or the other - and once that population shifts heavily in favour of the other, there's no way to address that imbalance *other than (e.g.) making Villains much more attractive to play*.

    If you do that, then you end up with the same issues, but on the other faction.

    It's my belief that to play as a Villain should be a completely different experience to playing as a Hero. As in recognisably different. Which means significantly different - not just a re-skinning.

    This means a fundamental re-imagining by the game designers of what it is to be a Villain, and what it is to be Hero, and what drives that narrative in the comics that this game is derived from.

    In content, Heroes and Villains ought to be presented with choices. Choices that immediately impact on the difficulty of the enemies they face, and the difficulty of the objectives in mechanics. This provides a self-scaling system of content.

    The more self-serving you are as a Villain, the harder the adds and bosses you face.
    The more virtuous you are as a Hero, the same.

    You should be able to (as a group) average the "Heroism" and "Villainy" of the choices you have made *in-content* to define the next challenge you will face *in that content*.

    For Heroes, (e.g.) choosing to not save a victim would give you an easier ride, but lesser rewards.
    For Villains, (e.g.) leaving witnesses alive would have the same effect.

    This leaves the design team free to concentrate on making the challenges of each piece of content independent of group composition - and able to create vastly different, and even imbalanced goals in content for both factions.

    This outright sorts itself in teams composed of all one faction - but in mixed groups then the Villainy vs Heroism ratios would decide which objectives carried more weight towards the next set of encounters.

    Either way, your actions and choices (and whether you defeated the boss without dying) in content ought to contribute to a sliding scale of how evil or how virtuous you are.

    Yes, you would get calls in LFG for "Thoroughly Evil Characters only" - but that would mean that regardless of SP or CR *they had attained that status* - which means they had been in content, the *hard way*, and beaten the boss.
  19. Great Architect Committed Player

    You might ask "why does it make sense for it to get harder to complete content the more like your archetype you are?". Because you are becoming "super-er". More of a Super-Villain, more of a Super-Hero - by sticking to your guns - with commensurately larger rewards.

    Superman only fights Doomsday because he is willing to make the ultimate sacrifice. If he couldn't be bothered, he'd still be throwing cars at low-life criminals. It's often observed that Batman is a street-level vigilante, and yet after a hard day punching muggers in the face (because he definitely still does that, right?) he rocks up and thwarts intergalactic threats. Lex finds the time inbetween being a busy executive and time-hopping Krytoniphobic maniac to lay some smackdown on Brainiac. For personal reward. No other reason. Circe is driven through an entire trilogy of content to seize the crown of Zeus. These are monomaniacally motivated people, and as the stakes get higher - and the more they are tested, thwarted, and defeated... The stronger their resolve becomes.

    And that is the situation players should be put in - to advance their agenda for more gain, or to slink off with (relative) scraps. This is a Superhero/Supervillain game - and the design concept ought to be "Go Big, Or Go Home". And if you go home, you only get second (or a participation) prize.
  20. DarkVisor 10000 Post Club

    Nice write-up (both posts), butt... don't blame this on the Suicidal Squirts or X-Team for this watering down effect on being a Villain, it's been that way from the start, the only difference made with X-Squirts is both factions can group together

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