The real reason why Prec needs a NERF

Discussion in 'War Room (Powers, Artifacts, & Builds)' started by Zeljan89, Dec 12, 2023.

  1. Green Action Well-Known Player

    Your on another thread telling people they haven't added to anything, LOL Holy moly, arent you the guy that i just rolled in the artifact swapping thread?, Please dude get out of these threads, they don't need sub -par dpser trying to telling them what to do lol,

    to anyone that wants to argue with this person, They do no do any research, they have little to no experience in high end game content where prec and might matter,
    as you can see through out this thread https://forums.daybreakgames.com/dc...asnt-been-stopped.330343/page-15#post-4622247
    he has stated he is a casual gamer on dcuo, so why is he debating about dpsing? you have no ground here mate Lol.
    • Like x 1
  2. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    Got rolled? You just posted 4 post back to back within 24 hours. You spend more time trying to get validation from guys in a video game to feel good about yourself lol. I think I’m ok if you don’t approve of me.

    Back to the topic. Would you like to help the guy out and actually show any proof of his claims? I would assume not and instead you’ll keep crying with making baseless claims because you’re too worried about not being able to do what you claim and lose approval from those players lol
  3. LowFlyingMoon Loyal Player


    Lol... macroboy001 still talking. Any evidence for your claims yet? No? That's what I thought...
  4. Green Action Well-Known Player

    Sigh,
    What exactly elite plus have you done mr 800 sp? right None, you stated yet again in this thread you do not swap, you do not try in dps, you doa normal rotation that anyone can do, but your on this thread talking about dpsing? again, you are 90% of dcuo players, Lazy Who do not want to get better, grind, complete hard content, who do not want to challenge themselves at this game, for what ever reason, But you've been playing it for so long, you havent completed everything?, Because again you're a lazy player, who rather belittle and crap on players on the forums who actually put time into the game and want correct change to the game.

    Here's tsd e crit, https://clips.twitch.tv/ShortPolishedCurryMau5-69ugLu7SuvsvAtpG with swapping as a healer and doing the content, now do i exactly care what you think?, no you don't play dcuo, you just get it on,
    So how about you hop off the forums and go run some hard content and tests yourself in those raids, because you haven't, you've said it your self,


    again you don't run with anyone in the elite plus community, we all know you don't, you don't play dcuo, you get on to stand around and say look at me everyone I am long time player who stands around the HOL all day, again, When you get to those tsd e crit feats, I CANNOT WAIT FOR YOUR REACTION, Because you aren't getting those feats done, and i know you wont.

    also this thread: https://forums.daybreakgames.com/dc...ct-swapping-hasnt-been-stopped.330343/page-15
    Show's your true colors deity, Mr I don't wanna run hard content.

    so again, why are you on forums where people want change saying they shouldn't change things? that things shouldn't be nerfed? you don't care you are a casual player who has no pull in the game, just like everyone else here.

    its fine and dandy to put your thoughts on the forums, but you attack an berate anyone who disagrees with you, then when you finally lose an argument you pretend that the thread isn't there, "you posted to yourself" no i posted to you saying why don't you go attempt these feats that are hard, and get back to me, which you said, why don't you show me videos of you doing it then, Okay great, threw clip up of me doing tsd e crit third boss with the boys back in the day, Again you aren't apart of any elite community On dcuo, you are a casual part timer on dcuo, Get it? or is still hasn't sunken in,
    • Like x 3
  5. Wallachia Devoted Player

    (Poorly done) Strawman.

    Someone who makes a claim must carry the burden of proof and demonstrate that their claim is true.The little kid came here, made a claim and refused to elaborate. Instead, he only pointed fingers and berated others as if they were "in denial". As such, his claim is false, and since he claimed that "precision is op", his claim being false means that, at the moment, precision is not op.

    I am not "TrEaTiN mY oPiNiOn As A fAcT" because not even once I have stated any opinions of mine as facts, unless your reading comprehension is SO BAD that you consider my answer to him as "an opinion", which would take us back to square one: strawman.

    Besides, both sides are mutually exclusive, so when you say that the opposite is also true, you are being fallacious, because it is as absurd to say that something is wet and dry at the same time.


    Generic claim = anecdotal evidence = dumb. I too can invent some random bullsh*t to fake an argument.

    As it stands, "precision is not op" and no strawmen will change that. Please provide any evidence that disproves what DeitySupreme has provided.
    • Like x 1
  6. LowFlyingMoon Loyal Player

    The really funny thing is - it doesn't say anywhere in the game, that Prec and Might DPS must be exactly equal in all situations. This is something players decided. Technically, you can be a DPS with a Hybrid Focus and use both - how come nobody's crying about that not being top scorer in E+ raids? Game is broken! Nerf both Might and Prec! Buff Hybrid! :rolleyes:

    Different specs have different advantages and are more suited for different applications. It just so happens that current content, especially at the highest difficulty, seems to be more suited to Prec playstyle, because it rewards mobility and flexibility to switch between ST and AOE. On the other hand - Might players can art swap more easily and efficiently during channeling, when situation permits it, which is why we're seeing things like Ebon/DKS swaps.

    For a newer player, with low SP and little experience - Might is pretty much always a stronger option, because you don't need to spec WM combos, your power pool increases with every SP you put into Might and with most powersets you don't have to worry about timing clips - you can just press your 1-2-3-4. Is that "fair"? Of course, newer players don't tend to lose their minds over a few percent difference on the scorecard, which is why no one is making a big deal out of this.

    When you have enough SP to fill 4 weapon trees, max out Prec and have a good amount in Might/Power, and you develop muscle memory and some dexterity - Precision begins to shine. So it would make sense for players to progress from Might to Prec as they have more SP and become more experienced and skilled at the game. It would make sense that more experienced and skilled players would on average do more damage. And it wouldn't be surprising, that many players, seeing their damage would assume, that it's purely because of Precision, or art swapping, or whatever.

    Unlike questionable ways of having an advantage, like macros - both Might and Prec playstyles are available within the game to all players, you don't even need to buy a respec token, or nothing. And meta arts like Trans/Strat/Quislet, as well as most allies will work fine for both. So if you're obsessed with your placement on the scorecard and you think you'd do better as Prec DPS - just switch to Prec. Or start swapping, or whatever you think is OP.

    Or - just maybe - get over it and find some other ways than video game scorecard to make yourself feel like the size of your junk is adequate... :p
    • Like x 1
  7. Raven Nocturnal Devoted Player

    That is what the entirety of the Xbox elite community has become, not just him. And you wonder why I stopped playing? What I've been trying to tell ya the whole time? Why I get excluded for being more "casual" and not art swap and/or like to play other roles/alts (even though I can and have them)? The proof is in the pudding.

    Even so, I understand his perspective and it makes sense. This is not me "taking sides", either.

    There might not be any proof to prec being OP, but on Xbox prec players are highly sought after and respected. One could only wonder why that is. I've also seldom seen a might player beat a prec player in DPS.

    Edit: This is not me asking for any kind of nerf, either. Just general statements and observations as per usual.

    I do wish other movement speeds could move faster in-combat tho. Having to always use the speed ring for certain feats is quite annoying lol. Or even, as the troll, being ridiculed because I can't pick up the tank on the opposite side of the arena in TSWE when they go down cuz I'm skimming type.

    I also think weapon tree shouldn't use SP, and more importantly Cog should be activated with any combo move, not just a special mastery one.
  8. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    I know the elite community isn’t like him. However he does bring a bad name to those players. I’m sure the people he runs with are just like him but they aren’t a representation of the community as a whole. I do know the Xbox (and switch) community are far smaller so the loud ones are stick out that much more.

    It’s like if you have a crazy guy on a nearly full train. They are obviously there. But you can easily ignore them by just staying with those you are with or keeping to yourself. But if the same crazy guy is in a nearly empty train he is far more apparent and harder to ignore lol. I can understand why the switch server is so low but I honestly never understood why the Xbox server was so low. I get that it was added later compared to the ps/pc servers. Maybe that was all it took. It’s unfortunate but until Microsoft, Sony, etc can start playing nice together it would be hard (impossible) to get more cross play.
  9. Raven Nocturnal Devoted Player

    You wouldn't know unless you actually played on Xbox. It wasn't always that low, certain features that were implemented the population simply couldn't handle. Not saying it's a reason, but it certainly didn't help. Between those implementations and the sheer toxicity (festered from other decisions), many players just simply stop playing rather than to deal with it all.

    I could obviously be wrong, but why else would people not want to bother to stick around? Seems like it should be important (as a business) to figure that out...
  10. lamourboy001 Well-Known Player

    Thanks to the two smart people, one of whom reported my posts and they were deleted. So after that, I ask them to not comment on my posts, and I won't comment on theirs either. I don't want to prove anything to them, just ignore me. Thanks!

    First test:

    No points spent on Skill points at all. No base or any mods, artifacts or allies. Nothing! Pure gear stats. I tried to produce similar damage times and in each case might took a bit more time so it should do more damage than prec (in theory). I used damage total instead of dmg/sec to get as real numbers as possible. I didn't use Quislet because it would have constantly attacked the sparring targets distorting the damage time and amount.

    Base stats:
    [IMG]

    Single target base precision:
    2,8sec - 26024 total (0% crit)

    Single target base might:
    3,3sec - 12407 total (20% crit)

    Multi target base precision:
    3,1sec - 38406 total (0% crit)

    Multi target base might:
    3,4sec - 24085 total (4% crit)

    Base stats + srtifacts:
    [IMG]

    Single target (with trans+strat) precision:
    8,9sec - 42255 total (35,7% crit)
    Without strat proc:
    2,9sec - 31797 total (35,7% crit)

    Single target (with trans+strat) might:
    3,3sec - 13972 total (20% crit)

    Multi target (with trans+stat) precision:
    9,6sec - 53197 total (32,1% crit)
    Without strat proc:
    3,2sec - 43064 total (32,1% crit)

    Multi target (with trans+stat) might:
    3,3sec - 25897 total (20% crit)



    Conclusion in numbers:
    Single base: 26024 > 12407 (209% damage by prec)
    Multi base: 38046 > 24085 (158% damage by prec)
    Single with artis: 31797 > 13972 (228% damage by prec)
    Multi with artis: 43064 > 25897 (166% damage by prec)

    Of course due crits they don't reflect pure numbers but the differences are huge which even crits cannot influence. I know different loadouts can cause different numbers but based on the video of rage might guy used Outrage (best heavy hitter) for single target in solo elite speed run, I found it a good choice to do. But if you have a better abilities which can be performed in 3 sec, let me know, I'll test it.

    As might, as you can see I used Vortex Trap (1 tick) to clip Outrage and to get extra damage. Also Relentless Anger grants PI.

    Adding skill points, mods, allies, artifacts, etc, can significantly affect damage. So this is just the first round but prec has won by a lot.

    Next test: precision full loadout vs migth full loadout (base and with trans + stat + skill points spent). If you know very good single and multi rage might loadouts, let me know please, otherwise I'll use same one like the guy used in his speed run video.

    I welcome any suggestions as long as they are civilized and not pedantic. This is only the first test but need to start from 0 and going forward step by step.
    • Like x 1
  11. C3alix Committed Player

    I can see prec being more dominate than rage-might, but is your round 2 going to possibly have prec vs might w/ power interaction?
  12. lamourboy001 Well-Known Player


    A few days ago I was about to do r2 but test was down. :(


    And yes rage might will have PI like it already had in the mini test.
  13. Proxystar #Perception

    In this thread, dude who is bad at might and anti precision tests a bunch of highly selective crap to spew his narrative, while desperately seeking to confirm his own bias.

    [IMG]
    • Like x 1
  14. LowFlyingMoon Loyal Player


    Shhh... Let him do his tests. It's a day off for somebody... ;)
    • Like x 1
  15. lamourboy001 Well-Known Player


    Thank you for the constructive criticism and fact-free accusations. ;)

    [IMG]
  16. Proxystar #Perception

    Oh no, please, by all means, finish your story Cody Rhodes.
  17. lamourboy001 Well-Known Player

    So test 2. Base stats are same no changes. I tried to timing both prec and might attacks to 8-9 seconds to perform the whole rotations. As you can see in each case prec attacks have shorter durations so it has to have less damage than might ones. In theory. But the end of the day, prec wins despite the smaller difference.

    Single target base precision:
    8,1sec - 62322 total (8,3% crit)

    Single target base might:
    8,9sec - 35763 total (4,3% crit)

    Multi target base precision:
    7,6sec - 99828 total (1,4% crit)

    Multi target base might:
    8,5sec - 66436 total (9,5% crit)

    Single target arts + sp precision:
    8.0 sec - 173816 total (60,9% crit)

    Single target arts + sp might:
    8,9sec - 114043 total (53,8% crit)

    Multi target arts + sp precision:
    15,4sec - 436841 total (46,6% crit)
    Without strat proc:
    8,7sec - 322159 total (46,6% crit)

    Multi target arts + sp might:
    14,9sec - 203641 total (40,6% crit)
    Without strat proc:
    8,1sec - 165849 total (40,6% crit)

    Conclusion in numbers:
    Single base: 62322 > 35763 (174% damage by prec)
    Multi base: 99828 > 66436 (150% damage by prec)
    Single arts + sp: 173816 > 114043 (152% damage by prec)
    Multi arts + sp: 322159 > 165849 (194% damage by prec)

    Prec stats with 328sp spent on Precision + Strat, Trans artifacts:
    [IMG]

    Might stats with 328sp spent on Might/Power + , Strat. Trans artifacts:
    [IMG]



    Of course due crits they don't reflect pure numbers but the differences are huge which even crits cannot influence. I know different loadouts can cause different numbers. In test 2 Precision wins again!

    In test 3 I'll try to use full artifacts, sc, full loadouts with 10sec pharsers.

    I welcome any suggestions as long as they are civilized and not pedantic.
  18. Quantum Rising Dedicated Player


    If I have a bow and arrow and I'm competing against a gun does that mean I just have to get better to do the same damage? The gun is always going to do more damage. The devs have handed the precision users s gun and the might users the bow and arrow.

    I have multiple armories on every toon I have. My main has 3 precision armories with multiple might armories as well. The precision armory always does better with much less effort.
  19. DeitySupreme Steadfast Player

    Terrible analogy. Just utterly terrible. A gun is designed to do more damage than a bow and arrow. It’s like saying “well if you use a tank against a water gun than the tank will do more damage”… obviously. A tank is designed specifically to destroy while a water gun is designed to soak people. If some came along and made a high pressure water gun that is DESIGNED to have the same amount of destructive power as a tank and you then have one person who never drove a tank and compete against someone who learned how to use the high pressure water gun, who do you thing would have a better chance of destroying things?

    Just because you say say you have multiple armories doesn’t necessarily mean each armory is optimal. It just means you have multiple armories.
  20. Quantum Rising Dedicated Player

    It's a perfect analogy. Yours is fallacious because in your mind they're equal to begin with and until you overcome that bias (likely because you're a prec user) you'll always argue against the balancing because you don't want to be nerfed. Using your example prec users were given the tank and might users the water gun.

    I've been playing this game since Nov 2010 in Beta. That comes with certain perks one of which is the time and overall ability to eventually max ALL DPS arts. The armories are perfectly balanced in terms of arts and skill points.

    You like to critique others on their might load out but I don't recall you ever putting your load out and set up. Perhaps you can enlighten us with this info.

    Nevertheless this is a moot point. DB had proven they care very little on balancing but instead introduce allies as a patch job to actual balance. My argument for weapons has always been a SLIGHT nerf to dual wield, brawling and a BOOST to other weapons. The fact that all prec users use two weapons and only two weapons is pathetic and the fact DB has never addressed this is a shining example of how they care little for balancing.

    @OP I did this thread 2+ years ago. DB didn't care. When you queue into an instance just remember that DB gave them a gun.