Hello everyone, for those who still care about PVP I am here to propose what should be changed about PVP that would bring veterans and new players alike back into the PVP spectrum while balancing powers, gameplay, and gear curve. Please read everything offered here and list your constructive feedback. Thank you. The Initial Breakdown PVP is in a state of unbalance due to some key missing features as well as simple fundamental problems. Healers and Tanks currently keep themselves alive indefinitely. Controllers and DPS have a supreme disadvantage in arenas. Gear does not feel enough of a improvement between others that do not have gear. PVP craft-able items currently do nothing. Too many maps to choose from lead to bottle necked map choice to speed up queuing. Hackers are rampant within PVP. Shields need some sort of adjustment within PVP as that is the meta currently. Listing these problems, here are some initial proposals to fix some if not all of these. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Restore the Role Counter System Restoring the role counter system will address several problems within PVP. First it will address the problems with tanks and healers indefinitely staying alive within arenas. For those who do not know what the role counter system was let me explain it to you. Healers could remove shields and defensive abilities from Tanks, Tanks could remove Power over Time and power restoring abilities from Controllers and Controllers would suppress healing abilities from Healers. The counter role would also deal extra damage to their counter role. DPS characters would support their parties' roles by dealing extra damage to enemies that have been countered or could craft a PVP De-buff Grenade to temporarily counter a role without playing said counter. Likewise a role could also craft a PVP Immunity Serum that would protect themselves from being role countered for a small period of time. This needs to be restored to prevent further imbalance of Healers and Tanks as well as allowing matches to end naturally through players being defeated and learning to play as a team within Arenas. Encourage the use of crafting in PVP by re-introducing the PVP consumable items. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Make Gear Matter Currently we have a few problems with gear in DCUO's PVP system. Gear is not pointed out to new players who wish to PVP, currently a player must explore, be told or learn on their own where PVP vendor gear is purched. Players do not feel empowered by their gear, there needs to be a advantage that a player achieves through their own gear acquisition, currently the stat difference is minimal and does not show a sense of accomplishment. Newer players will currently not see much of a difference in gear gaps as the stat raise system does not ENCOURAGE new players to gear up. Currently the gear climb is too great because there are too many tiers of PVP equipment. When a PVP season begins or resets there should be a base PVP set and then a set to earn, that is it. There should never be 4-5 sets of gear to obtain and earn, this leads to players giving up during their gearing. There needs to be a tutorial mission pointing out PVP vendors to newer players showing where to acquire PVP gear. Remove the tiered system of equipment for PVP and keep it to two tiers. One base set that can be bought with Cash and one set that should be earned with marks. Encourage new players to gear up by giving a clear sense of improvement in stats and performance. New gear should be earned in a reasonable amount of time, currently some pieces require 25-50 matches to earn. Reduce the amount of wins needed to earn a piece of gear to 15-20 per piece and lower for lower piece of gear. (Trinkets, Neck, Face, etc.) ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Re-introduce Cycling Maps As states above a big problem with PVP currently is with its queues which is due to the sheer amount of maps available. We need a rotation system that will allow faster queues. How can this be implemented in a better way than previously? Cycle the maps randomly per queue. PVP should randomize the map that players are put into. For example: Player A queues for a 1v1 Arena Match. Player B queues for a 1v1 Arena Match. The system will put both players into the queue system and process that both players would like to play a 1v1 match. The system randomly selects from the 3 available 1v1 maps which are, Batcave 1v1, Lair Battles 1v1 and Shadowlands 1v1. The same system would be put into place for each map type. How do we overcome the feats that are attached to winning select maps? In a perfect world I would remove those PVP feats and change them to win 1v1 maps 50 times, 2v2 maps 50 times etc. To overcome the feats attached to select maps, rotate one specific map per week within the queue system. For example the queue system would look like this. 1v1 2v2 4v4 5v5 8v8 1v1 Lair Battles (On Rotation Per Week) This way players looking to knock out their specific map feats can do so. Also the system should only pick maps that have feats attached to them on this weekly roatation, for instance maps like Isis should never be on that rotation cycle but can show up in the 4v4 map queue. This system will fix the long queue times and will force players to learn each map as well as randomizing and keeping PVP fresh as players will not know what maps they will play in until it is entered. -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Introduce PVP Seasons Every 4 Months We need to have a new gear climb every 4 months. Why? To keep PVP alive. Once players earn the top gear half of the population will stop PVP. This is because players will want to earn their feats and continue PVE content. PVP players will continue to PVP to their hearts content however. To overcome the drop in PVP play, every 4 months the gear needs to be reset to that players can be encouraged once again to gear up. Then the question becomes what happens to the old gear sets and styles? Put them within the style vendor that PVP already has so that players can earn them and continue to earn feats within PVP. Developers can't create new style sets fast enough? Create enhanced versions of older PVP sets with extra colors or style effects or introduce PVP styles that are hard to earn in current content like the Gorgan Slayer style, giving PVE players even more of a reason to PVP. Give players reasons to continue PVPing or to come back to PVP. By introducing these systems players who are looking to continue improving their character will PVP as well as keeping PVP centric players happy by keeping the PVP population healthy. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Overhaul Ring War and Diamond Heist To be fair Ring War and Diamond Heist work in a general sense. It gives players a PVP setting within the open world allowing for 50 vs 50 fights potentially or even more. However, the rewards within said events are incredibly outdated. First off the amount of marks rewarded is pitiful in its current system. We need to combat this with a simple update. Increase the amount of marks earned from said events to a reasonable amount in conjunction with the current season set. Include unique rewards only earn-able within said event vendors that encourage players to participate more often in said events. Items like unique styles, weapon styles, items, trinkets, etc. Reduce the amount of time needed to wait before the next event. By increasing rewards and providing more unique rewards this will encourage players to participate in Open World PVP more often. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Restore the Influence Currency For those who do not know what influence is, Influence was a currency earned within PVP that would accumulate through defeating other players. Players could spend influence on PVP items that would help them in PVP arenas or Open World PVP. Why does this need to return? Simple, it shows that players are constantly being rewarded in PVP even if they lose. What should influence be spent on if restored? Simple. Use influence as a system to buy PVP quests. What do I mean by that? Currently if you do not PVP you may not know this. But when you win a match you have a slight chance to receive other an Order Directive Quest or a Checkmate Directive Quest. These quests when completed reward Marks of Legend of PVP marks. This system should be retooled to allow players to earn quests to play by spending their influence to give their PVP play even more rewards. So with a new system like this who should give the quests? Resection parts of the Watchtower and Hall of Doom to have NPCs that will provide these quests. In both the Hall of Doom and Watchtower we need Amanda Waller introduced as a NPC that will give a daily quest that is free out of the pool of PVP quests. The additional NPCs that should be there should be different for each faction. For Villains we could have Harley, Captain Boomerang and Killer Croc. For Heroes the NPCs could be Robin, Nightwing and The Atom. Ultimately it does not matter. This can be monetized. Want to monetize this system? For players who do not want to wait to earn the amount of influence needed to receive a quest from said NPCs, simply spend replay badges. You can only have up to 5 active quests at once. In theory to have a quest reflecting one for each map type. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Give Membership More Perks Currently most would agree that membership does not have enough perks. Have members earn influence twice as fast. Also give members 3 weekly legend characters instead of 2. Which leads me to some of my next points. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Slow But Steady Updates Want to show the player base that you support PVP? Start introducing more Legend Skins. Ever wanted to play as Mist Infused Powergirl? Don't see why that can't be a skin for Powergirl. Love the way Hal Jordan looks in his Black Lantern suit? Add it as a Hal Jordan skin. There is way too many additional looks that each character can have within the game. Best part? It can also be monetized by adding each character within the market place. But don't stop at new Legend skins, remember that new seasons will reset every 4 months so PVP will in theory, burst every 4 months. Why not also add some new feats to earn as well? The ideas are endless. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- In Conclusion We have so many things we can add to PVP if it was just receiving some attention. I am hopeful that with some slight adjustments that I have been seeing that hopefully we will soon see a revamp. Balances between power sets will come we just need a first step in PVP. Thank you for reading and let me know what you think.
i agree: they should give at least one new PVP feat with each DLC. personaly, i PVP only for the feat point of the styles, and stop after. if there would be allway something new, i'd play more entusiastic... a new PVP style each 40 months sure would be possible, i mean: every 8th week is a new set of gear coming out with time capsules! a dayly PVP quest sounds good aswell... i am not sure about influense...
Good ideas. Especially the new pvp season is something, that we really need sooner than later. Last time we got something new to do in pvp (Belle Reve). Queues went though roof to get those skill points. That shows there is still lot of people just waiting for new pvp content.
With so many PvP threads being made lately, you would think they would start to consider it. I use to love PvP and PvE. Now its just PvE all the time. I like your idea. More threads need to keep being made. PvP was the backbone to this game for me.
I agree with most of the things you said, you forgot to say that healers struggle to heal 4v4s and 5v5s due the weak AOE healing and the extreme damage coming from other support roles instead of just dpses. I agree with he rest tho, good ideas.
Thank you for reading and let me know what you think.[/quote] Someone from Theybreakgames, opps i mean Daybreak games should give this bloke a job because its obvious he knows whats best for the pvp side of things rather than focusing on how pretty your character looks. Just saying.
As much as I'd love to work for Daybreak it would never happen lol, in the meantime I just try to do videos and stream.
Sounds very good. Also need another update for Legends PvP to balance weapon dps/combo damage, counters etc. I cant see Batmans spaming Blockbreaks just because they deal 600+ damage anymore. Its pathetic
I wanted to list the bugs in PVP but for some reason I can't edit my posts? Anyways we need more support on this thread, if we can get it to pages and pages of players interacting and asking for these changes maybe the devs will listen.
Vagrant, well done....just, fantastic thread. Very well thought out and articulated brilliantly. Hats off to you sir.
These are all great ideas and would help alot to restore some sort of desirable quality to PVP. Below are a couple of things in favor against a couple of your ideas. To add to this, bring back role specific PVP gear instead of this generic PVP gear with rainbow mod slots junk. To me, that was one of the biggest signs that PVP was about to take a nosedive to where it is now. I never understood why this was done or what uninformed persons they listened to that said this was a good idea. This I took exception to. When I started playing DCUO and got into PVP, tier 3 had just come out. This was back when you bought the "T0" Archangel gear for cash, I believe T1 was bought with influence, and T2 and T3 were bought with 2 different marks I believe. The point is, PVP was a looooong grind. It wasn't easy. You got demolished over and over and over again, saving up every precious mark or influence you got so that you could get that next piece of gear. And then the next piece and the next piece all the while learning and developing your skills. So that when you reached full T3 gear, you were hopefully decently skilled and not by today's cheese standards, but legit skill. You felt like you actually accomplished something. You went through the ringer and came out the other side better for it. Notwithstanding the current state of PVP which is pure blasphemy and should be complained about, the problem isn't how many tiers of gear that somebody has to go through, the problem is that it's just broken. It's all shortcuts and exploits. The simple answer today isn't "get good", its, be one of the cheese powers too and you can win just like the rest of them. Use shortcuts and exploits and you can be a "top" PVPer too. It just goes to show that there's no honor in PVP anymore, no more, you against me straight up, and may the most skilled person win. And that's sad. The players I see on the forums now days want everything made easy for them because the DCUO they play today has conditioned them to expect that. Those were the kind people that cried because PVP was in fact hard back then and they were tired of losing all the time to people that paid their dues and were fully geared. They got demolished continuously and didn't like it. Boo hoo, you're going through what every person that came before went through, get over it. But unfortunately, they listened and PVP was set on the downward spiral it's been on ever since. Call me old-fashioned, call my opinions out of date but shortening the number of tiers a person has to go through to reach endgame PVP gear would just add to the terribly long list of problems PVP already has.
Depressing reading pvp threads like these, good ideas are proposed by players and ignored by the devs. If it doesn't make them a dime, what's the point in working on it? Last I remembered most their revenue from power tokens came from pvpers constantly swapping powers lol. But anyways, threads like these are unfortunately a lost cause...
Great thread, agree with many of the ideas. We need role-PVP gear to return too, and maybe some PVP bonus marks weekends once a month at least. If only we could time travel PVP back to 2011-2013. Only issue is always going to be whether it is worth it, as many PVP players have long quit the game and are far from guaranteed to return to the game (even with an update), let alone resume playing semi-regularly/actively again. And of any players who have started playing in recent years, would they welcome a PVP Stats Revamp at all? Let's hope for the best for PVP but expect the worst, or rather little or no meaningful update to PVP :/
There is SO much potential in PvP. And I agree with the pcp.in 2011. It was phenomenal! It made the pvp in other mmos seem like child's play. I have to wonder with a name like DC backing this game, how have the CEOs at DB screwed this up so bad?
I love everything about this, except for PvP gear. I don't think it's a needs a revamp, I think it needs to go away. Instead, add 2 mod slots to our already existing gear. These mods would only be effective during PvP content, and would be crafted using new recipes. Adding a PvP mods slot to the generator would also be cool. The trouble with Arena PvP has always been the barrier to entry. Simply put, the Toughness stat is dead weight, and only leads to confusion. This type of thing would also reduce the need for new tutorial content with regard to PvP gear and vendors. Sometimes less is more. Well done Vagrant!
