Thanks Devs! PvP phase is officially dead!

Went to the PvP phase again this week only to see literally 5 heroes out of the "ENTIRE" metropolis and only 2 other villians in the hod. It's official PvP is gone and I think I'm done as well. This literally shows me that most of the PvP community was on the PS3 console so them being cut off caused an extreme cut off to the majority of our PvP players.

I just can't anymore. People keep saying that PvP isn't where they make money but who's fault is that? The devs could easily make PvP episodes or Events with new gear, feats and progression. If they would actually take time and fix it and give PvP players something to do I'm almost positive they would make twice the money they are now.

Stop neglecting the PvP community because there are plenty of other games that have all of that and deserve my money a lot more. You expect me to spend $15 a month on this? A pve only mmo that has no pvp? April 1st was a few days ago so this joke is no longer funny.

Anyway, now is the time to come together and talk out ideas to fix this mess because now since the PvP community is gone I don't have the drive to play this game anymore and that's being honest.

One of the things that brought me to this game was it's incredible PvP gameplay back in 2012-2014. Especially around the time when weapon master and your pvp gear actually mattered. Now its full of broken exploits, exploiters, powers, etc. Make PvP great again!

Weapon Mastery wasn't good for PvP nor the "true" PvP community, just saying.

That being the case I don't think you can say that because PvP is dead that means the majority of the PvP community was on PS3 (because the ones that I know were part of the "good ol' days" switched to 4's when they came out... they stopped for other reasons and awhile back at that). If anything it does show that people left in the game care less of PvP, although who can blame them it plays horribly at the moment.

Well, PvP mechanics and the PvP phase are kind of 2 different things. I agree with the premise of your post though, with the exception of the ps3 comment.

Any easy fix for PvP phase would be to attach feats to PvP phase only. Seems simple to me. The mechanics is a while other comversation.

At 150pm on a Tuesday, I'm sure it is very dead. I've seen a few threads like these as of late. Why do you think the phase has anything to do with PvP? If you PvP, do you have to stand in that phase?

Check back tonight in the Watch Tower. Maybe the people who like phase work days?

They have done a PVP centered episode before and from what I understand it was not very well received as evidenced by them not doing another PVP centered episode since.
I am sure there are players out there that play this game primarily for the PVP and just PVE on the side. However, I believe that the vast majority of players are the opposite with many never even touching pvp outside of maybe getting some feats. If this wasn't true then their internal numbers would show it and we would have more PVP content coming out.

If you mean "The Last Laugh" DLC then that did excellent when it came out. It had PvP feats and even introduced the shield weapon as a bonus. I miss those days...

There are a few reasons why The Last Laugh episode failed at being a smashing success.

That DLC was when they tried to monetize PvP (which of course a was a turn off) and it got flack for that.
Than since the entire DLC (other than the invention of the shield weapon and the nightclub/safehouse duo) was PvP related if
folks weren't interested in it they had nothing to do for awhile.
There are a few other things that were said at the time that I can't recall.. and if I remember I can always double back and add them.

Also, PvE players have always been a larger population of the overall system but the devs (well those in charge actually) have always made their PvP community shrink constantly by letting groundbreaking things happen for in PvP without fixing it. This game had a strong and extremely loyal (paying too) PvP playerbase. Their decisions and actions caused them to lose the majority of them.

If it did so excellent then why has their not been another since?

Correct. I am sure that they won't touch PVP again until they figure out how to properly monetize it. They tried to monetize it that one time but the community seriously disliked it. So until they can figure out a way to monetize PVP in a way that will satisfy the community and still make a profit then there will most likely not be any major future updates to it.
At this point, I find it highly unlikely that anything will ever be done with PVP since much of those loyal PVPers, like the ones that you mentioned, have moved on to greener PVP pastures. The devs probably realize this and will continue to focus on developing PVE content since those players are still around.

I agree they probably won't touch PvP since they can't monetize it and I think that's a shame for so many reasons.

Just one example is there are a ton of skill points behind PvP. With the current incarnation it's hard to work on those who haven't gotten them and for those who always try to say that the gap between TC feats and overall feats... well let's just say are they thinking about the whole logic about where all the feat points actually are and how "obtainable" they are.

Honestly the game would probably be better off just removing what little PvP is left in the game and just focus on other aspects, at the very least to take away what "false hope" is left for those who want to PvP have left for this game.

Haha..... try getting into a pvp arena match on xbox servers lmao. If you're lucky enough you might see some elite league looking for players to boost pvp but it ain't real pvp fighting is it.

What killed Open World PVP in this game (different from Arenas I might add), was the steady decoupling of PVE progression having impact in PVP. That along with preventing low level players from actually using the PVP instance at start (such as disallowing making characters there or venturing there before level 10), there is no reason players want to join in the PVP instance or even really know about it.

They made a massive mistake in Arenas by removing the use of items (like Home Turf) in those and setting up PVP gear to be completely separate from and useless in PVE, unable to use any addons (trinkets, HT items, soders) that one would get from actually progressing a character in the game. This removed any pride in making your character stronger to compete against others in Open World, as the gear sets did not match up well at all.

Not to mention there are no definable goals in PVP phase / PVP open world quests that actually have impact in the game itself, thus removing motivation to participate in it. If they want to 'fix PVP', they need to reintegrate PVE progression with it, allow the use of all the tools players earn while progressing..and make open world PVP events / quests actually mean something again.

I agree. But if they scrapped it then they would have the problem with the pvp feats no longer available. Unless they just awarded those to everyone. But then they would have the issue with the players that are disgruntled because they earned them by playing.

However, I would not mind if they kept Legends. I have always been more of a Legends pvper than arenas anyway.

In fact, I wish the game started with Legends pvp only. That way they could focus more on that and not having to worry about balancing the player powersets for pvp. I am sure many would disagree with me on that but I still think it would have been the best for the game.

I would be the first to tell you as a PVPer who takes pride in building my own character, that I despise Legends 'PVP' and am of the opinion that the increased focus on Legends PVP post 'Home Turf / Last Laugh' was what led to the slide that killed off PVP in this game.

Basically the DEVS thought they should 'balance' OW and Arena PVP to the Legends model, so that gear, skill sets, basically any progression / work you put in your unique character meant nothing. Basically someone could make a fresh 30 and be near as strong as someone who had been playing since release and refining their character build / items because the DEVS thought that they should remove gear / PVE progression from PVP to make it 'more like Legends'.

That was a stupid decision that led to the increasingly lack of attention to PVP and the 'dumbing down' of competitive arenas or actual RPed open World PVP fights.

IMO Legends should be a niche part of PVP for those that want 'generic' (i.e: beginner level / dumbed down) fights.

I totally see your point with Legends being what kind of ruined arena. I, however, feel the opposite way about it. I know you enjoyed arena more and that's good. I enjoyed Legends more. Legends, at least to me, felt like a more pure pvp and is much more easier to balance. Plus, balancing Legends would not impact the balancing of PVE (regular player PVE, not Legends PVE).

I feel what has been a detriment to the ongoing development of the game throughout the years has been their attempts to balance PVP by nerfing and/or buffing certain powers which would in turn impact PVE. If my memory serves me correctly, it seems it wasn't until much later in the game's life cycle that they figured out how to make changes in PVP not impact the PVE side of things (If they ever did make those changes. I do not know for sure since I left for a couple years so PVP changes might still effect PVE). My point is that, since I have mainly been a PVE guy, I strongly dislike how changes to powers were made because of PVP balancing. If we only had legends then this would not have been a problem.

What you do not seem to realize is that making PVP like Legends is what has / is killing it. PVP and PVE SHOULD be integrated, so that working on your character in the PVE game should improve your power, skill and gear in PVP as well..and vice versa.


The idea that they should be separate and that PVP should be 'balanced' to be as generic as Legends, so that you character choices / work you've put means nothing is precisely what is wrong with PVP (particularly open world) right now...because it means nothing and you gain nothing from it.

This is why true PVP should never 'be like Legends'.

I do realize that and I even agreed with you about that in my previous post.

I, however, do not agree that PVP and PVE should be integrated. My main complaint about PVP is how it impacted PVE. People are spamming a power too much in PVP? A power has a slight advantage in PVP but not so much in PVE? Lets nerf it for everyone in PVP and PVE. I wish they had separated PVP and PVE so they could balance each independently. Why should a PVE only player be adversely impacted because of a game mode that they have do not want to play?

Like I mentioned before, I always have favored Legends over the Arenas because if everything else was equal then it was pure. Pure in that the winner was who could more skillfully use his or her legend to beat the others. The problem was that there has always been one or more Legends characters that are flavors of the month for one reason or the other. Because of that it was never truly balanced.

Again, you are simply not grasping the fact that is what they did..and that is what KILLED PVP. By decoupling it from the PVE game, it became meaningless. As to 'Legends being pure'? Only if you were a basic player who put no effort in the game other than to buy a desired 'iconic' and then played against people on the same level who put no effort or true thought into the other aspects of gameplay. Where everything is absolutely the same and there is no 'spark' of RP / character you built it, thus no true competetion or reason to advance in it. Why bother when all you wind up doing is playing someone else's character and not even your name is important?

'Pure PVP' is that in which your custom character was a result of your efforts in advancing them through all aspects of the game..to compete with all the tools and abilities you had in the game. Where your effort and RP actually meant something.

In the end I have nothing but loathing for the 'Legends' game..and disdain for any that think it was any form of PVP / RP.

No, I can totally "grasp" that Legends killed Arena pvp. I just don't care that it did since I do not care for Arena pvp.
You can say what you want about Legends in that Legends players are "Basic". I accept being a basic player. I hope they further decouple PVP and PVE from each other. PVP balancing messes with PVE balancing when they are tied togther. Many players barely touch PVP so why should their experience be hampered by PVP balancing? That is not fair to them. There is a way to balance PVP and PVE separately and still make both viable. They devs, unfortunately for PVE players, decided to not go in that direction.

Not just arena PVP. Open World PVP and RPed PVP. But feel free to keep on assuming. And they already decoupled PVP from PVE. That is apparently what you do not get...and it is why PVP is dead. At least PVP that counts, unlike 'Legends' aka - 'play someone else's character'.

Oh so they have decoupled PVP nd PVE fully? I honestly did not know that (I mentioned before how I took a couple years off from the game. Came back in January). That's great!
I honestly do not care that the "PVP that counts" is dead. Like I said previously in this thread I never really liked the Arenas.
I suppose I'll play some one else's character.. erm.. I mean Legends when I get home. Us discussing it has made me want to go and play it some more.