Tank Pulls

Discussion in 'War Room (Powers, Artifacts, & Builds)' started by catplaysxoxo, Oct 18, 2021.

  1. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    Climb down that latter so you can properly understand what I was saying. I never said 360 pulls fling enemies across the room. I said pulls like Inescapable Storm, ragebringer, engulf and so on do that. I know they do because I seen it and I experienced it. There are other powers that can juggle adds it doesn't mean it's mandatory to have backdraft because of that reason. The loadout you gave is very common and is just a copy and paste for other tank loadouts. I never said I'm doing just elite content. Both pulls are just that PULLS. The fact you're saying that my mindset about 360 pulls and engulf are the same really seems narrow-minded. 360 pulls such as Backdraft and Without Mercy are mid to close range abilities. They heal you, juggle enemies and pull them to you. I get that. I don't use it just because it can juggle adds. As I said there are other powers you can place in your slot besides it and if it pulls then why do I need two pulls. I can just put 1 pull and the other slot could be a juggling ability or anything for that matter.

    I was playing on my fire tank last night for hours and engulf literally flings them across I have to keep activating engulf just so they can be near me instead of somewhere else. Not sure what some of you aren't understanding about it. I don't think it's working as intended for them to be flinged across the room. The tool tip says it pulls enemies towards you but in actuality it flings them across you at times. I remember a long time ago when FOS was a good example of actually liking the fact that you can use Inescapable Storm to fling across the spider robots off the edge. Your last comments are coming off as egotistic no offense. You didn't understand my point but i hope you do. Don't assume I'm just doing event or normal content. I done elite as well and still I had no need for a 360 pull that you are adamant it's for juggling. This isn't about juggling adds or doing content that has a lot of adds to justify your opinion. This is about those tank pulls that flings enemies across the room.

    1. You have two pulls because the regular pulls flings them across the room, could be used from long range and the second pull pulls them to you in a 360 pull but mostly the real reason it's because it juggles them......

    2. Fix the fling part of those pulls, use a different power if you want to juggle enemies without it even being a pull hence not needing two pulls.

    Everyone has their own skills and playstyle. Copy and paste loadouts like that one for example doesn't really show you truly understand the potential of what you can do. It just shows it doable because every tank powerset can use the same format in their loadout. 3 shields heck you can even use personal dampening shield making it four. I forgot the weapon mod. That's five shields. That's overkill. You can just keep Mass Density and a personal dampening shield so you can have a free slot. You can go about it in many ways but as I'll say once more this thread isn't about tank add content or needing both pulls so that the 360 pull main function is to juggle adds. This thread was made because the pulls I mentioned flings enemies across the room. Not always but it happens and when I have to activate that power again and again just so I can have them all near me instead of them being somewhere else could really be used in that time to do something else.
  2. Hunted2468 Well-Known Player

    Tbh i think most people who replied to you understand what you're asking for perfectly. Although some are being unnecessarily rude/presumptuous about it.

    To Summarize: You like Atomics pull because it brings enemies right to you instead of throwing enemies in one direction. You've come to the conclusion that other Tank Pulls are bugged/bad/broken and want them to work like Atomics.

    That will never ever happen. The assumption that they need to be changed is incorrect. You havent taken Balance into account asking for this. As explained in my first reply, other Tank powers have different Pulls, and that is 100% intentional.

    - Ice has outragiously strong shields compared to any other Tank power, as well as higher defence. Give it Atomic-like Pull and its too powerful.

    - Earth has a great mechanic with its pet sharing dmg received and a close range 360° Pull. Give it Atomic-like Pull and its too powerful.

    - Fire has middling shields but an arguably OP self-heal mechanic. Give it Atomic-like Pull and its too powerful.

    - Rage has its insane Rage Crash mechanic which heals back nearly all dmg received once you time it right. Give it Atomic-like Pull and its too powerful.

    The reason they dont have the same Pull is because they all have mechanics that Atomic doesn't. Its a Balance. Atomic cant match shields with Ice, it cant pass off dmg like Earth, it cant Self-Heal as well as Fire and it cant Regen lost health like Rage. Balance. As for having to Pull enemies 2 or 3 times? You should never need to do that. Once you pull them once you've got aggro, they'll literally run straight at you from where they were pulled to.

    I'm sorry but its not going to happen. It cant. Ice cant teleport things, neither can Earth or Fire or somebody's Rage. Thematically it just wouldn't make sense, but more than that, it would create imbalance among Tank Powers. We're already stuck with Gadgets being broken, we dont need to add to that pile.
    • Like x 4
  3. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    What I gathered from that is its intended for the enemies to be flinged across room so that you have to put a second pull ability but in reality that second pull is to juggle adds. I don't see the merit agreeing it's intended to work like that. They don't need to teleport just like atomic has it all I'm saying is for them not to be tossed across the room.
  4. Hunted2468 Well-Known Player

    Its intended to work as a "Normal Pull". It works as a Normal Pull. Most Tank powers have a Normal Pull, Atomic does not. Atomic does not because it makes up for a Balance shortfall compared to other Tank mechanics. Other Tank mechanics surpass Atomics mechanics by a small margin. That small margin needs to be made up somehow. Its made up by giving Atomic a slightly superior Pull.

    As for "adds tossed across a room"? I've been honest and polite in my replies and all I ask for is the same. Thats either an extreme exaggeration, or you're doing something very very wrong when you pull adds. Theres no 3rd option here. I tank adds with Ice in FRe daily, in Central City, out in the open, with no walls in sight, and i've never seen adds get flung as far as you claim with any pull. Its never required a second pull either as literally 2 secs after they land they're running towards you. You must be constantly jump-pulling if this is a problem for you because thats the only possible way to even try to achieve launching adds past you. If this is the case then you need to get out of that habit, not ask for working pull powers to be changed. Plant your feet. You're a tank. The only enemies that should ever require jump-pulling is Bosses, and even then its only a few select Bosses in Elite content only.
  5. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    As Lorax pointed out I believe about one theory as to why they would be flung is possibly because I might have jumped. As I was playing many hours last night I wasn't jumping. I can't just accept the only reason is because of that. I'll just have to record and show it.
  6. Zamara Dedicated Player

    I feel like engulf is on a weird spot, because yes, the description puts it on the pull category but that's it, if you read the power description itself it doesn't have the word pull anywhere else, it says "Enkindle your target and nearby enemies causing a small explosion at their feet, damaging and pushing them toward you.", when you use it you can kinda see when it throws the enemies towards you so them not landing exactly on you or if they aren't staying on you does kind of make sense if you come from that idea. Even the power animation doesn't make it look like a pull, it just looks as if you were doing mass detonation.
    • Like x 2
  7. Melusine Midnight Rainbow Phoenix

    Each conical pull has its own innate vector for the movement of npcs, and each responds to your current trajectory as well. Play around with moving sideways, jumping straight up, jumping while moving in a line, jumping while moving along a curve etc. Each pull will respond to these changes and inputs in a slightly different, but very predictable and controllable way. Earthen Grip can be a bit an exception in that you may also have to deal with collision, but that can be controlled for in most situations.

    For me, this is way more fun and engaging than if all pulls were the same. I have multiple tanks and I really enjoy engaging with these differences and the ways you can (or can't) manipulate NPCs with each particular pull. I love how I get a different result jumping vertically, if I pull while going up or coming down, even at the same height. I love how a diagonal jump with a pull at its zenith is going to be a different manipulation than a curved jump to the exact same location.

    To the OP, I think you're just used to one and so the other feels wrong right now. As you get more used to each pull you'll begin to click with its exact properties and the frustrations will disappear, replaced by the possibilities. It's certainly jarring to switch from the direct linear response of Atomic to the launching arc of Engulf. However, you gain a period of control while the enemies are travelling that you don't really get with Atomic pulls, and this allows for additional (or at least different) strategies. That means you can kite or juggle in different ways with each power, and I wouldn't want to lose that. Hopefully it will become more enjoyable for you over time.
    • Like x 2
  8. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    That was well written. Thank you for your input. :)
    • Like x 1
  9. Black Prime OG Devoted Player

    Honestly, without seeing how you tank. One of the biggest mistakes newer/inexperienced tanks do is jump and pull. Jump pulling will fling NPCs all over the room. It's something you have to make a conscious effort not to do.

    Imo, this is the most aggravating kind of time. One that jump pulls and keeps spamming pulls down a hallway. Don't even try to say something. They will get all pissy for trying to be told how to tank.
  10. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    I admit I only ever shown me tanking as Atomic but once I started playing around with fire and earth I'll have to make a new with one of them in mind specifically speaking with fire as I love love AH lol
  11. Monkeyboy Committed Player

    Every tank power has similar pulls/taunts. People debating a ST taunt is not a pull is splitting hairs. It still forces the mob or boss to you.

    Ice: Inescapable Storm, Resonating Gale and Frost Snipe
    Earth: Earthen Grip, Epicenter and Pebble Blast
    Rage: Without Mercy, Rage bringer and Rage Blast
    Fire: Engulf, Backdraft and Fireball
    Atomic: Atom Splitter, Atomic reorganization and Particle Beam (Interrupts suck!)

    All tank powers are similar. They're literally cookie cutter with a few different mechanics. How are adds getting flung around? Are you pulling then moving? Are NPCs, henchmen, sidekicks or pets blocking adds from getting to you?
  12. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    Did save the universe alert with my fire tank you can literally see the add go sideways even though you're facing the add and are grounded. The enemies have their arms up when you pull them with Engulf. Same situation when fighting Diana with all those adds. At this point I'm just like whatever I'll just keep spamming Engulf anyways.
  13. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    How can I upload a video here without it being Youtube?
  14. Trykz Dedicated Player

    I would love to add some insight to this discussion, as a tank who has tanks round 15 in two different survival modes I know my load out works. However, with the toxicity level of this thread I refuse to contribute. If the OP would like to message me I am a long time atomic tank and would gladly discuss options and strategies with you. There is some serious misinformation in this thread about atomic tanking lol.
  15. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    I appreciate your input. I just have to say your loadout is it only for survival mode? Because there are many ways you can go about it in different instances. Since normal content isn't hard you really don't need a pure tank loadout but if you want to do elite and survival then that is where most would have the same loadout that I seen many times both in videos and in forums. I'm not trying to do elite content and survival mode (when it's available again). Besides if I did, I need to level up the most important tank arts and I have none at the moment. If you have input on tank pulls because it seems I'm the only one in this thread that has noticed adds being flung. Until I find a way to upload a video without it being from YouTube I'll just have to ignore it and move on.
  16. Trykz Dedicated Player

    Sent you a dm.
    • Like x 1
  17. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Sorry....I just have to say this.....'FLUNG'.


    But, I fail to see why a tank having 2 pulls is an issue...unless you are trying to also do damage and want the extra slots for 'battle tanking'. Pull across room + gather around you is tanking 101. If Atomic has a single power for that...great, not every tank powerset should be exactly the same.

    A far larger issue was the fact that fire had neither a long distance group pull OR a shield for many years. Both were added a few years ago finally.

  18. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    If I wanted every tank pull to be like Atomic Atom Splitter which is to bring them to me I wouldn't have brought up Engulf, Inescapable Storm and so on. Most if not all of you are ignoring the fact that those pulls aren't like Backdraft, Without Mercy and so on and when you have two pulls like Engulf and Backdraft it defeats the main purpose of the pull since both pull enemies. I don't need two pulls. One should be enough and I can make great use of a free slot. The players here who are confused about my thread are stating that they use two pulls because one pulls them to you lol and backdraft gathers them to you while also healing and possibly juggling. There are other powers that also juggle adds. I'm stating and many times that tank pulls like Engulf, Ragebringer pulls enemies to you yes I get that but there are times they aren't pulled to you they are "flung" either sideways or above you even if you are not jumping and just on the floor. I'll say this once more. Once I figure out how to post a video here without it coming from YouTube I'll show you why I keep repeating myself. Thanks.
  19. Reinheld Devil's Advocate

    Yes. I know what you are saying happens. I'm fire and yes, sometimes when I use engulf (or when I used to use 'low pressure' flight pull), sometimes the adds didn't drop right at my feet, but it does generally pull them in my direction, where I then hit Backdraft and gather them close and juggle a bit. Even ones that are flung across the room or sideways a bit, they are agro'd now....they will come to me anyway unless someone else stuns or pulls them away another direction.

    My question was why do you see that 2nd pull power as a big problem? Are you battle tanking so that loss of a power slot means you can't have a 'damage' power instead?

    And hey, maybe by pointing out this disparity, they will change Atomic's pull to match the others and you will be flinging everything around as well. Easier to change 1 power vs to update the other powersets. Be careful what you wish for....you might get that 'same' effect in the wrong direction.

    BTW... when running COU or SG, I absolutely love flinging all the adds off into the abyss when I tank with fire....don't take that away from me please. It's fun.
    • Like x 1
  20. catplaysxoxo Loyal Player

    Thank you at least someone acknowledge it. I do agree as well that I might need just practice with pulls like Engulf since I main atomic and Atomic pulls are different. I see it the 2nd pull as a problem not big just as a problem because I don't need a second pull. If i want to juggle adds I can use Flashpoint or some other power. Stoke Flames and Absorb Heat already give amazing heals. Hmm didn't think about that scenario but I did mention that I noticed many years ago an ice tank flinging ice spiders off the edge. No one acknowledge that maybe they just forgot or haven't been in an instance where an ice tank does that.
    • Like x 1