Survival Mode and Speed Hackers.

Discussion in 'Gotham City (General Gameplay)' started by Caroline, Feb 16, 2021.

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  1. SugarHoneyIcedTeaMix Well-Known Player

    This just reads as a self confession.....why else get disgruntled over something that technically shouldn't even bother you or players you play with...unless
    • Like x 7
  2. Jaelia Well-Known Player


    That’s not fair though what if you have no idea
    • Like x 5
  3. Apollonia Committed Player

    Adults understand the ethical implications of cheating in a multiplayer game which impacts others both directly and indirectly.

    You can't sit with us.
    • Like x 5
  4. AV Loyal Player

    If someone is in a group doing back to back to back 5min day 1 elite clears where most of the group is afk, virtually ALL the damage is from a random throwaway character doing basic attacks at the speed of light, bosses die in seconds, and they effortlessly get every feat in content.... Then it's impossible to believe they're ignorant of what's going on and they deserve to be banned.

    There are way too many scumbag players hacking in private with complete impunity, abusing the fact devs will apparently only ban their free throwaway garbage account running the hacks and not the characters those players are using the hack account to benefit in the first place. They're so emboldened that we've already got some in this thread decrying "snitches" for expecting something to be done about cheating.

    Nuance is also possible. New player gets random queued with a speedhacker in random content doing a daily? Obviously not grounds for a ban. Same player keeps running with speedhackers over and over again or does super specific, otherwise challenging thing with hacker? Probably merits investigation and likely ban. Same leagues continually hack the living **** out of new content for years in a manner that isn't the least bit subtle to the point their names are filth? Obviously should be a permaban.
    • Like x 5
  5. Dark Soldier Dedicated Player

    Not gonna lie, i dont care if someone cheats in pve its pvp that I care about... what your mad tgat they’re gonna have feats that you wont? Styles?

    Also to me this is a bad idea. Sorta like in real life when people are riding together in a car n get pulled over and all the sudden someone is freaking out because they secretly had marijuana on them, now the whole care is going to the station.
    So what u que into sm and see they’re frying the boss n your supposed to turn off you playstation mid fight? Listen.. dont mess up this game anymore because people are crying on the forums.

    Instead look for changes that would actually make a difference! Lets be real theres not a army of speed hackers in dcuo. the only real gameplay glitch i ever encountered in the 9 years ive played is the paradox one... dont implement nonsense anti cheat mechanics until they’re actually needed..

    I play this game called smite, and in ranked if you lag out at the character selection the game reads it as u ducked the match. This will be the games read 100% of the time even if everyone in the lobby disconnects. This makes playing ranked very risky after they release updates for the game bc the severs are always trash. But they never compensate you for the lag out loss, it stays on your record. This was implemented because just like in this thread people were crying about people ducking games after they saw the competition... when the crazy thing is, all that would happen if someone ducks a match is you would re que and have to wait 5mins till the next que.. in my opinion theyre anti cheat system does more harm then good.

    meanwhile I have a pretty popular thread about hand blasters in combat pose that has around 15 likes that you should check out.. thanks
  6. AV Loyal Player

    Sure is "weird" the number of players in this thread who simultaneously believe that hacking in this game isn't a big enough problem that it should be adressed.. yet are also concerned about how disruptive it would be if they had to not play with hackers.... HMMMMMMM...
    • Like x 8
  7. Illumin411 Dedicated Player

    If you meant “what if you have no idea of the policy change”, I would hope that the developers are smart enough not to be overly draconian when in the transition phase of a policy shift. But eventually, this crap does need to be stomped out as much as possible.

    If you meant “what if you have no idea someone in your group is speed hacking”, what AVTV said pretty much covers that.
    • Like x 2
  8. Pinky Well-Known Player

    That's good to know. But does Daybreak have the will and the resources to enforce the future new policies?
    Saying all this is good and well, but implementing it is another matter.
  9. Dark Soldier Dedicated Player

    Or hear me out,,, large sweeping legislation meant to make every offense equal to any offense no matter the severity never works the way its intended. Well, i guess thats a matter of perspective..

    Hacking shouldnt be weighed the same as being in a group with a hacker. Like i said ive never met anyone who had these abilities, i almost believe that they don’t exist and this scenario may just be someone tryna get a popular post... but i will always oppose legislation that weighs non violent crimes the same as violent.

    Also, if they have the tech to work out a anti cheat system this complex they should be able to give us a simple ui update or anythinggg that we’ve actually been asking 4 for the last 5 years
    • Like x 1
  10. AV Loyal Player

    Then you're:

    - Not understanding what this would be. It would not be "indiscriminately ban every poor noob who random queues with a hacker and doesn't know any better." It would be, "finally ban the players who use a hack account to power through elite content on day 1, cheat feats/SM, etc, flaunting the current ban policy by having a throwaway account carry their real accounts." Ie. Banning the ppl actually responsible for the high-tier hacking that's going on.
    - Not really experienced enough to comment if you don't understand how bad hacking in this game is right now. Hacking in this game is prevalent publicly and MUCH worse privately... Has been for a long time now, with there being well established hack leagues repeatedly exposed by reputable players and apparently even rent-a-cheaters. There are videos of feat IDs proving where people have cheated on the release of new content (and they aren't banned explicitly because they were using burner accounts to do the actual hacking and carry all their mains). It's ******* everywhere, and there are a lot of particularly dishonest and sleazy players trying to pass cheated feats off as legitimate.

    Current ban policy is that they only kill the account that's actually using hacks... And everyone knows this, especially the cheaters... So all they have to do right now to cheat with impunity is take a burner account, where they don't gaf if it gets banned, and carry 3-7 other people through everything with it. It's so bad that there are feats reputable people are hesitant to even bother with because of the asspain of having to upload proof it wasn't cheated combined with the fact people will just assume it was cheated at a glance. Worse, the continued inaction on this has led to more and more public hacking to the point we see it on a pretty damn regular basis these days in random pugs and have to force a wipe to kick them. It's an endemic issue to the point that anyone arguing against taking action to address it looks super ******* suspicious.
    • Like x 3
  11. Proxystar #Perception

    I agree, I think the odd occurrence of being in an instance with a speed hacker should be overlooked to an extent, these people are at first likely innocent victims. It's possible the odd person might inadvertently get feats or complete some regular content before they realise they've accidentally taken advantage of something.

    It should become relatively obvious pretty quickly though who the real offenders are, the ones completing elite content day 1 and obtaining the difficult feats, it's almost like the feat itself is doing all the work for you, it creates a nice little red flag list where everyone on it simply automatically gets investigated, reviewing the scorecard details, if logged, would quite quickly prove the guilt.

    There's a part of me too that's tempted to say don't ban them on the first detection, strip the feat and warn them, second time, delete all their feats, gear, inventory items, bank items and money, third time perma ban :D
    • Like x 8
  12. PHNTM Well-Known Player

    As stated above (slightly changed):

    - First instance with a hacker, remove the feats obtained in that run
    - Second instance with a hacker, remove the feats obtained and issue final warning
    - Third instance, punish as if they are a speed hacker

    I think 3 strikes would be more then enough (could even limit it to 2). Nobody can say it's an accident when they have acquired the same feat or completion three times via speed hackers. The rest of the group would need to be aware and vote to kick the speed hacker before completion.
  13. Lord Illusional New Player

    This most likely is going to get hate but the truth is the only way to do it is to SPLIT THE SERVER!

    Let me help you all out... it really is a bigger issue on both sides than just "ban them". Banning players is a LOSS OF REVENUE to DCUO and increased expenses. Banning people opens the door that they will not come back. As the base player pool falls, either because "you banned my friend" or "you banned me and I didn't know.." etc... they lose revenue. Revenue keeps the lights on and pays for licensing and developing new content. Speed hackers spend money as well a lot for these toons for artifacts and gear. Banning the hacking toon and not their main means they most likely will come back and spend another $300 on a new hack toon, but if you ban their main, they are gone forever.

    So ban a whole raid group that's 8 to 7 paying members... then look at how much the average DCUO player spends monthly. Lets use small numbers to play with. Lets say that is $100 a month per player on average and add in membership... then that's $11,040 a year (Not accurate by any means but lets say). You are asking based on this model to give up $11,040 a year per banned group. Not mention the addition of staff to manage complaints and customer service about being banned cause you were in a group with a hacker.

    What is the pay off for you the player? Reality is that it is so your feats mean more emotionally and or you get to brag. FACTS are that Skill points don't matter anyway. Speed hackers have been in the game for years, it doesn't not stop the average person from spamming content, opening 569 time capsules or paying for membership. So why disrupt the majority to please the minority?

    Only suggestion I have is then if someone wants a pure DCUO server with no hacks and less glitches then, switch to XBox or Switch.

    I say if we are chasing ghost, lets get anyone who has EVER ran with one and see if these "key players" survive. That would THANOS the whole server. lol

    **Snap**
    • Like x 1
  14. Darth Piper Loyal Player

    I think you also need to mitigate these strikes with the following:
    1. Was the "ride along" a random queue-in or part of a pre-formed group?
    2. Was the hacker invited in after the instance started and another player left the instance?
    If the answer to the first was "random queue-in," that person has no control over it and should not receive a harsh punishment. Strip feats? Sure. Strip renown and other rewards? Yeah. Count it as a strike against them for this? No. If, however, they were part of a pre-formed group then it is 100% a strike if they made no attempts to leave once they identified the situation.
    If the answer to the second is yes, then you have to break it down... as with the random queue-in, you strip feats, renown, and other rewards. Those who invited and voted yes should probably receive a strike unless they have made an effort to leave once identified (yes, it's possible to invite without knowing) as well as anyone who remained in the group.
  15. AV Loyal Player

    If it was such a big deal that it actually hurt their bottom line to ban full-on speedhackers, something every remotely reputable multi-player game would do, then it's a big enough deal it's already hurting their bottom line via the revenue lost by players noping tf out, in various ways, from dealing with devs that are tacitly ok with cheating. Not banning cheaters is openly advertising that your game has zero integrity and that anyone playing legitimately or paying to play the game normally and progress regularly is worse off than some scumbag POS who hacks his way through everything and actively detracts from the community.

    Every single argument defending cheating in hear is pulling this crap, where it's simultaneously "not a big deal" but also apparently "so much of a big deal that if we get rid of it the impact will be huuuuuuuge!" Schrodinger's BS.

    The fact you think banning hackers would disrupt the majority is telling. It really sounds like you're either cool with hackers or run with them yourself, from your last para. Also, you do realize that consoles are where the TC dupe and money cheats came from right? No, splitting platforms would not fix anything and a game's integrity demands there simply not be cheating allowed in the first place. This is super simple stuff and really just a fundamental axiom in general that cheating is, by definition, not allowed.
  16. AV Loyal Player

    Unless they keep "accidentally," "randomly" queuing with speedhackers and consistently getting renown and challenging feats with them in group. It's reasonable for a player to not recognize speedhacking for one boss, as it'll be dead before most will realize what's going on... It's not reasonable to keep going without kicking the hacker at that point. There can't be a "oh... We timed our queue so this would look random" loophole that lets sleazy players keep doing what they're doing now with a minor inconvenience thrown in.
  17. Cordelia Active Player

    No uses the word "snitches" in seriousness unless they are about 10 years old, or a criminal who doesn't have the mental capacity of an adult.

    From your language, you are about the farthest thing from a "grown up" that exists. If the only way you can win is to cheat and call other people "snitches" for trying to get rid of cheaters, then you probably suck at everything.
    • Like x 5
  18. Darth Piper Loyal Player

    Agreed... but that is also why I say that even the random queue-in ridealong should still have all feats, renown, and other rewards stripped for that instance from any boss that was defeated while the speed hacker was present. You still gain no benefit other than you completed the instance and are now loot locked and have the "reward" of either waiting for that loot lock to reset or spending replay badges to reset it yourself. If you're found to have a high percentage of these "random" meetings with a speed hacker, then yeah... you need to look at whether they're timing things to "randomly" show up in there.
    • Like x 1
  19. Darth Piper Loyal Player

    Side thing... I've heard several people attempt to "justify" running as a ridealong with a speed hacker... "I don't have time to do that stuff" or "I don't need the headache" tend to be large chunks of that. Here's the thing... you speed hack your way to all of the feats and full renown... but when you are asked to run some older content (or maybe even the current elite stuff), you make rookie mistakes. I've watched people who got their stuff by speed hacking unable to run DME successfully in the past month. I've watched some of them make those rookie mistakes (dropping a supply drop or orbital, consistently not dodging an avoidable one-shot, etc) in CTE, FGSE, and COUE. This is because they never actually learned how to do it.

    And then we wonder why we have things like "bountyverse online" in these past two DLCs... because many of those same people are the loudest complainers when it comes to, "There's nothing for me to do." They bring this on because it's an attempt to slow down how quickly these folks achieve "everything."

    Ultimately even if no bans are issued to the ridealongs.... if all you did was a daily flagging of instances via automated means (automated Splunk or ELK analysis of logs, for example), review those flagged instances (final decision should require human intervention), and then take away the rewards, renown, and feats earned by those in the instance which would subsequently invalidate any armory imprints due to an SP mismatch and possibly the presence of now unearned gear while leaving any loot locks in place you will now discourage people from doing it... and no, you don't get any replay badges refunded. Call it the cost of cheating.

    Of course there's also the, "Well those who ride along spend a lot of money" angle... but how many players do we all know who have given up on the game because of the failure to deal with the speed hackers and ridealongs? How many of them would come back if and when they hear that they are actually stepping on the speed hackers? Enough that it would make up for the loss of the few big spenders who like to cheat? Maybe... maybe not... but that decision is "above my pay grade."
    • Like x 3
  20. AV Loyal Player

    Yep. Every single one of these mfs think they hardcore then when push comes to shove they always play worse than a one-handed, brand-new, drunken CR skip player. The "I don't have time" argument is bs because players that aren't cheating garbo and with less overall playtime still get stuff done without being a script kiddy.
    • Like x 2
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