Stats Revamp 1.7: Mental

Discussion in 'Stats Revamp Archive' started by Shin-O-B, Jun 9, 2017.

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  1. Shin-O-B Developer

    Hey everyone, we’re back with another set of Stats Revamp updates! This thread is for feedback specific to Mental powers. Before testing, please read the notes for our general changes here.

    The biggest concerns from Mental players were a lack of crowd control and overall pacing. Several adjustments, including to power interactions, have been made to improve both.

    • Lack of Crowd Control
      • Thought Bubble returns!
      • Encasements options:
        • Thought Bubble, Cryokinesis
      • Levitation options:
        • Telekinesis, Mass Levitation
      • Stun options:
        • Psychic Shock , Telekinetic Pull, Pyrokinesis, Phantom Flames, Terror Tendrils, Mass Terror, Psychic Prison, Ambush: Sleep
      • Other options:
        • Horrific Visage
    • Pacing
      • A variety of Spammer options available:
        • Telekinesis, Telekinetic Push, Cryokinesis, Psychic Shock
      • Damage Over Time options available:
        • Telekinesis, Mass Levitation, Pyrokinesis, Phantom Flames, Psychic Prison
      • Invisibility mechanics adjusted:
        • Now Detaunts and Ambush: Pain Blast converts Daze into Terror
    • Power Interaction conversion abilities have been implemented to increase the synergy and flow between the Daze and Terror power interactions, opening up ability combinations for Mentalists. To help with this, the Burning and Frostbite power interactions have been removed.
    • Mental players will find plenty of crowd control options available in Control Role, with reduced options (but greater damage output) in Damage Role
    • Mental players will also find a variety of instant damage and Damage Over Time ability options, allowing them to stack the DOTs or burst as they please.
    • Daze interacting abilities
      • Abilities that apply Daze
        • Telekinesis now deals Damage Over Time
        • Mass Levitation now deals Damage Over Time
        • Thought Bubble now deals instant damage, targets 8 enemies, and has a reduced cooldown
      • Abilities that exploit Daze
        • Telekinetic Push
        • Telekinetic Bolt
        • Telekinetic Pull
        • Pain Blast now converts the Daze interaction to Terror
        • Pyrokinesis now converts the Daze interaction to Terror
    • Terror interacting abilities
      • Abilities that apply Terror
        • Terror Tendrils
        • Horrific Visage target count increased to 8 from 4
      • Abilities that exploit Terror
        • Psychic Shock now deals instant damage, instead of Damage Over Time
        • Phantom Flames
        • Mass Terror now deals instant damage, instead of Damage Over Time
        • Cryokinesis now converts the Terror interaction to Daze
    • Other abilities
      • Terrorize no longer exploits the Terror power interaction
      • Psychic Prison’s cost and output have been increased
      • Cryokinesis will also encase targets that are Dazed or Terrified
    • Like x 1
  2. PSYL0CKE X8 Well-Known Player

    So far so good
  3. stärnbock Devoted Player

    wait, still no combos (smashing to the ground, pull, push, tossing around) while targets are levitated?
    anyways, i do like what i read, time to test it! how did you remove BURNING from pyrokinesis??? dots?
    • Like x 1
  4. Jacob Dragonhunter Devoted Player

    The Dot from Pyrokinesis is still there, I can confirm this after testing out mental through-out with two separate loadouts that ulitize Daze and Terror respectively.

    The only thing that's gone from Pyrokinesis is the Burning PI which I won't miss from it, I actually appreciate the changes that they did allowing you to make use of Pyro and Cyro to switch from Daze to Terror Effects on the fly(And vice versa Terror to Daze); it opens up a lot more doors for variety in a Mental Loadout imo.

    Very impressed with Mental DPS. I ran it through "Seeing Shades" again on my CR 166 test toon and it was a very solid experience. For the purpose of testing out Mental I used these two loadouts.

    Terror Based Loadout:
    Terror tendrils, Mass Terror, psychic prison, pyrokinesis, Psychic shock, and I carried the good old Telekinetic Shield.

    I noticed something was a miss with this loadout, and that was because the Dot from Mass Terror is no longer there; but since we have the option to convert Terror Based Enemies to Dazed enemies on the fly that's really no longer an issue in my eyes.

    This loadout gave me the best experience and the best results, high damage, good use of conserving power, tons of Crowd Control, it was really fun using this in a PFTT setup.

    Dazed Based Loadout:
    Mass Lev, Telekinetic push, Psychic prison, Pyrokinesis, Telekinetic shield, and I carried the "Convalesce" Healing supercharge.

    The Dazed PI loadout was not bad; but it was also annoying too. Mainly because Telekinetic push would (as it implies) pushed the enemies out of my Psychic prison, this happened to me multiple times through-out seeing shades again and it was quite annoying to deal with.

    If Psychic Prison could perhaps become a long range AOE field dot(Like Sorcery's COD) This issue would be improved.

    Overall: This experience convinced and sold me on keeping my Mental Villain, and I will gladly level him up and enjoy him once this revamp hits live. Great work.

    Edit: Refer to Starnbock's post below, If Psychic Prison get's a damage nerf; then I don't want it changed.
    • Like x 1
  5. stärnbock Devoted Player

    problem is: as it is a melee ranged attach (applied in a field surrounding you) it may deal more dammage. if it would be a long range dot (mass levitation is now, and i like it!) that would need psychic prision to get nerved down dammage... so, i guess it is ok now ^^
    • Like x 1
  6. Lithiumz Well-Known Player

    Please get rid of the interrupt on Mass Terror. I don't know why Daybreak wants to keep this ability vulnerable to interrupt. Please remove it. It ruins mental.
  7. Alrighty Then Loyal Player

    I am liking what I am see here.
    I would like to see Mass Terror hit like Mini Nuke in Munitions; and possible with an increased range.
    I would like to see Mass Lev, Lev in Mass, up to 8 NPC's; and possibly hit harder at a further range.
    Much improved, thanks for Thought Bubble - so much fun!
  8. mexmex Dedicated Player

    Can we change deflect power for something else, like a pet mirror of yourself for example, or a ghost decoy or something, or at least put some animation on it, as a shield ( not bubble) or a mental whip or whatever please please
    • Like x 4
  9. Alrighty Then Loyal Player

    I'd like a Mini-Grodd Pet!
  10. stärnbock Devoted Player

    devs, you made my dream come true (it just took a while for me to find it out)!
    remember when i always asked for mental to be able to toss your targets around?
    now you can! and the clue is thought bubble (encases enemies, making them weaponizable),
    using telekinesis after, it lifts one target and hurls the other adds at it and into eachother ^^
    not sure if intentional: adding the executer (35%) to the mix lets you toss the enemy into walls
    or slams them to the ground, some times it pulls them (looks cool, maybe bugged though) ^^

    try it out in the war torn village: use thought bubble, telekinesis, terrorize and feel telekinetic!!!
    it is the closest thing you can get to what i allways wished for, and i think it is AWESOME!!!
    • Like x 1
  11. stärnbock Devoted Player

    it is great that telekinesis and mass levitation are DOT now, keep it that way, pls! however:
    mass terror has lost its DOT for burst, it is not applying terror and is interruptable... why?
  12. stärnbock Devoted Player

    since they do no longer exploit PI, are executers now weaker in general or did you increased theyr dammage to make up for it?
  13. Isif Committed Player

    How is the trolling aspect? Anyone!?
  14. Isif Committed Player

    Is auto-PoT still a reality?
  15. HymnOfMercy Dedicated Player

  16. Heart Well-Known Player

    I'm liking most of the changes and Mental feels much better on damage with these changes than in the last version! :)

    Only change I don't like is changing Psychic Shock to burst damage spammer ability because it felt very unique in the last versions being 1 of the only spammer abilities with damage overtime style damage compared to other Mental and other spammer abilities from other powersets. I think it would be unique even with shorter stacking bursty damage overtime like 4 hits over 2 seconds than another 1 hit ability... There already are Cryokinesis and Telekinetic Push that are burst damage spammer abilities . :(

    Phantom Flames was little confusing at first because the cooldown doesn't match the duration of the damage overtimes and the damage overtimes from 2 Phantom Flames don't stack with each others so you will do a lot less damage and use a lot more power if you use it everytime it comes from cooldown (every 3 seconds) instead of waiting the full 6 second duration....

    I also wish the phantom pets from Mass Hysteria supercharge would stay a little bit longer than 15 seconds.If you removed the critical buffs could they stay for 30 seconds? ;)
    • Like x 1
  17. Alrighty Then Loyal Player

    I threw a Gag Glove in there just to bounce them around some more; also Mass Lev and Telekinetic Pull.
    I'm not sure of the damage; but everyone is flying around! I want to try them as Troll with some serious Dom.
    • Like x 2
  18. stärnbock Devoted Player

    Yes, phantom flames has cooldown of 3 seconds and the DOT lasts longer, however: this is kinda ok, because its effect doesnt hit much targets and with the cooldown on 3 seconds, you can attack again faster if you missed... I guess that must be the reason for its effect vs cooldown time...

    What i like is that you can fly in mass hysterias SC ghost form now. I just hate the look of the form itself ^^ lol! However: i would realy wish that there would be SC's that are not consuming a sertain amount of it, but instead would slowly drain your bar as long as you are not changing back to normal mode, and if xour bar is empty, you would change back automaticly (or get knocked out)
  19. stärnbock Devoted Player

    schouldnt better mass terror set up the terror PI and terror tendrills exploit terror? i mean: terror tendrills is slow, and if mass terror is used to early, the terror may not be applied yet, if targets are hit too early with mass terror and used directly after tendrills... also: i think that mass terror should also better be a DOT again... just my oppinion...
  20. FlreMint Active Player

    Hello! Im FireMint, I have played Mental since I first began playing DCUO 5 years ago, switched to Quantum almost 2 years ago since its stuns made it a superior controller to this day...

    I hoped on test to find that mental is actually pretty good, quantum stuns have been nerfed and are now balanced compared to other controllers's stuns, this makes me extremely happy. But I found that mental is now overpowered... and as much as I like the power, I want it to be balanced compared to other powers, I will list all the irregularities regarding my testing, note that I am a noob when it comes to PC, and, of course, PC testing, regardless I believe that my methods and results are valid, this will be a very educative reading, here they are:

    I tested using only Controller Area 51 vendor gear + OP ring from cr190 gear box on controller stance. No SP, no mods besides base ones.
    12855 Might. I went into New Genesis open world and used my powers on one of the group of 6 adds surrounding the teleporter parts for the operation, non of the powers I tested got close to killing any of the adds so i got full damage every time. I mostly tested mental exploits that were present during the pre-WM era.

    Using expected powers and PI combo:

    Using Thought Bubble I got around 10k total damage.
    Using Pyrokinesis I got 9.5k total damage.
    Mass levitation (sets Dazed PI) + Telekinetik Bolt (Dazed take more dmg) I got a consistent 22k total damage.

    Now the irregularities:

    Using Thought bubble (Note that I am in controller stance with controller gear, therefore adds get encased) and then pyrokinesis (explodes encased adds) I got up to 80k total damage, this damage is similar to what I get from Electricity's Megabolt and Quantum's Vortex, both being 50% Supercharges. Also note that encased adds are still being protected from player damage, this is an issue with a very long hsitory that should be solved by now...

    Using Terror Tendrils I get 25K total damage. I believe this is because the 3 tendrils do not split damage, each one of them seems to hit up to 2 times. However, to get this damage you need to use them in a way that the 3 of them hit 2 or more adds, also their animation cannot be canceled by jumping, in that way they could still be considered balanced.

    Using Invisibility: Pain Blast I am getting a total damage of 24-28k. I noticed 2 ticks of damage of around 13k and I believe only 1 is intended. This is a single target and melee range power that can only be performed after going invisible and should prove more effective against single targets than multi-target abilities and even regular single target ones, but it makes no sense for it to put more damage in 1 add than a PI combo does on 6 adds.

    Using Bolt Barrage 100% Supercharge I got 145K total damage which is a very low ammount compared to Quantum's Oblivion which hit for a surprisingly consistent 225k and also Quantum's Vortex 50% supercharge and Electricity's Megabolt 50% Supercharge which both hit for around 80k dmg... This is the one mental ability I found to need a buff, and it was expected since it has always been a very bad power.

    Non-damaging abilities

    I tested grandeur, telekinetic shield, enhanced invisibiliy´s shield (white mod) and Bastion.

    Grandeur: Shields about 8k dmg, provides immunity against control effects, can be casted while moving. Seems OK.
    Telekinetic shield: Shields about 30k dmg, can be jump cancelled to allow movement. Seems OK.

    Reflect pain: Shields for 15% of your max HP... so about 4,5K for me, the damage reflects onto the nearest foe. This power feels useless in my opinion...

    Enhanced Invibility is the odd one here, it provides some extra movement speed (compensateslosing movement mode), 6 seconds of immunity against control effects and what seems like an invulnerable shield for the same 6 seconds, I got up to 60k damage and the shield wouldnt break, it has a quick cooldown too, this makes it a better option than Grandeur and Telekinetic Shield without a doubt.

    Bastion: I compared it to Quantum's Event Horizon. Bastion shields for about 8% more damage than EH... when I compared Mental's Telekinetic Shield to Quantum's time bubble they shielded for the exact same amount, and thats how it should be since they have the same effects (just shields...). I tried to compare the power outputs but I found it dufficult since power now has a passive variation just like damage and heals do... I believe they should have the same power output given the same vitalization...

    Personally... I would like to see every shield's formulas and current shielding ammount. I would like to see every heal, power heal and damage ability base ammount ± variation, crit ± variation, total expected ammount ± variation.

    Yours truly.


    Stay fresh my friends.
    • Like x 1
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