Stats Revamp 1.5: Quantum, Earth, and Celestial

yeah but, the events are clamped for everyone the same, no matter how you play...
i have doubts that pfft will do well with the exact same stats as weapon users...

Or maybe the clamp will be wide enough to allow for PFT by default.

I have some question for you regarding weapons, weapons combos & the number of clicks needed for each combo.

This is an general question about all the weapon combos but I am using shield as an example.
If you look here at Devastating Kicks. The Two Footed Slam & the Handspring Kick.

Two footed Slam & Handspring Kick are 6 TAP HOLD & 7 TAP HOLD respectively.

You guys can shorten these combos by adding another input.
Why not make the combos use TAP HOLD + ↑ or TAP HOLD + ↓ ???

SHIELD UPPERCUT
This one is 5 TAP HOLD
Why not TAP HOLD+ → ???

This is one thing that is really holding back weapons IMO.

Every weapon has some really awesome animations that never get used because they have so many clicks associated with each move. Adding more inputs like is done done with Rifle would make weapons and their combos a lot faster and actually useful within the game.

No, just doing 10 times flip slash and observing the numbers vs spin chop's numbers/damage.Yes counting only the final hits, single target.

So they should either increase power out by trollers or reduce power costs of high cost powers?

I thought that the whole dove tail thing was the devs way of addressing it

The first option. Controllers need more potential in my opinion. They are the players that command all the group. No mana = no heal = no tank = no dps.

Devs, please increase the performance from Controllers on at least 25%.

This is a really good point. Currently on Live, these moves hit very hard-- but not hard enough to justify the amount of time you spend vulnerable to block. In content it's pretty hard to pull those off consistently. Even slightly shorter combos wind up being quite a bit better.

On test, the longer combos got a slight buff but are still underperforming.

I always liked how you could substitute holds for taps and get to the longer combos in different ways, but in terms of a damage rotation that was never very effective either. Shortening these combos in the way Winter suggests here is, in my opinion, a very elegant way of addressing this.

Just a thought for stats revamp 1.6. This might be a good time to introduce water powers set to the test server. That way you don’t have to rebalance the water power at a later date to match all the other power sets. This way you can balance all the abilities across all the power sets at the same time. And you can release the water powers with the finished stats revamp.

That will be done when Water goes on test itself. They won't just launch Water without putting it on test first.

Im bringing this topic here not only to get away from the quantum specific feedback thread but also for general discussion for others.

The whole superhero mmo argument is silly because no other superhero mmo combat system has been dynamic as dcuo made theirs. Hybrid was dominate for years, then it got the shaft. WM was dominate for a year, then AM slowly started to push it aside. Now we are here with AMs that will soon get the shaft(Ironic. Almost as if dcuo devs staged this all along ).

And how can you know if PffT, though wont be beating hybrids, but it'll be like a hundred away from a hybrid chart? Noone has yet to fully grasp what a true PffT can do or look like at its fullest potential. And also why should someone who decides to play a style that excludes one of the game combat mechanics, be on par with someone who is using both?

That statement really isn't completely correct either - as of right now Hybrid beats PftT with certain Powersets, the ones that are not innately reliant on Ability-combos. These "Combo Powersets" will likely end up being optimally played with PftT - or fundamentally changed. (Rage, Celestial, HL..)

A simple answer to that is - they shouldn't.
If you as a player capitalize on every mechanic the game has to offer to its best use - you should outperform someone opting not to do so.

To break down the kind of balance people are unrealistically expecting with this revamp, here's what some people think is possible:

Nature: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Celestial: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Electricity: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Sorcery: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Earth: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Ice: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Atomic: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Rage: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Munitions: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Gadgets: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Hard Light: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT
Vs Vs Vs Vs
Quantum: Hybrid Vs Weapon Vs PftT

Yea.. all those "Vs" aren't a mistake, each playstyle needs to not only compete with another, but with another powerset using the same playstyle or another playstyle.
These kind of expectations are - unrealistic.

In all fairness the devs themselves set these expectations. They are the ones that laid out the 3 different play styles and claimed they would be able to balance all 3.

It's not silly at all. Who cares about other games, we're talking about this one. And what does a dynamic combat system have to do with not making PftT competitive? People who PftT are still participating in a dynamic combat system.

Also, it's "dominant" not "dominate" (sorry, pet peeve of mine )

They weren't able to balance a single playstyle between all powersets from the day this game lunched. (Hence FoTM Powersets for Dps, later dictated by the most efficient AM..)
If they really made a statement claiming they'll be able to not only create true balance between completely different powersets, but between playstyles each powerset utilizes and then again between said powerset and other powersets using each different playstyle.. They did set themselves up to fail.

Only way that is happening is if all Powersets become identical practically, with different aesthetics/animations.
True balance always comes at the cost of diversity and variety..

Also, considering Moja's recent response:

It doesn't seem like it's their aim, whether that statement was made or not.

Just going by what was originally stated but please continue your rant of how everyone should play how you see fit.

How did you interpret what I said as me prefering one way of playing?
What are you even on about?

Tbh Soul is right. Unless I have a gap in my memory the devs never said their aim was to achieve complete balance between all three play styles. They said their aim was to make all three viable. They don't mean the same thing.

Your pragmatic approach with regards to less than perfect balance must be infuriating to those with unrealistic expectations.

Tbh I didn't say complete balance either