Stats Revamp 1.5: Quantum, Earth, and Celestial

Discussion in 'Stats Revamp Archive' started by Avair, Mar 31, 2017.

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  1. Avair Administrator

    The Stats Revamp: Status Update

    Hello! Stats Revamp 1.5 time! Here's an update on where the overall revamp is at in the development process, and then after that, a look at what's going onto the test server today.

    Before moving on to further adjustments to the big-picture systems and concepts that are still under review, we want to get all powers in a revamped state on the test server, so that we have all perspectives weighing in. Today we are releasing Quantum, Celestial, and Earth. Next, we will finish up with Munitions and Fire.

    Our focus in the short term is in getting these remaining five powers to the same state as the previous nine. Next, our focus will be to take a step back and look at the larger topics and feedback about the revamp overall, make adjustments, and address all powers. Finally, after that, we expect to have a period of time to refine and polish the revamp as a whole, including fine-tuning content across the game.

    Your feedback will be essential for us as we move through each of these steps. We will use a variety of forum threads and surveys to gather and respond to it. At this time, this thread will remain open for general discussion, which we will continue to review as we look ahead to the next steps. Our immediate focus will be on your feedback in the powerset specific threads for quantum, earth, and celestial.

    Below are our overall goals and initiatives, coupled with their status as of today.

    Stats Revamp Cheat Sheet

    Green = on track and in good shape.
    Yellow = our current and immediate focus.
    Orange = to be addressed later in the revamp.

    On Track:
    • Remove Combat Rating Differential - check!
    • Adjust where player stats come from and smooth progression - check!
    • Adjust NPC stats - check!
    • Revamp skill tress/skill points - check!
    • Remove Advanced Mechanics and Weapon Mastery bonus damage - check!
    • Remove Power Points - check!
    Ongoing and Under Review:
    • Revamp the final two powersets to work in the stats revamp
    • Balance powersets post-AM/WM
    • Balance and adjust roles to account for new stat numbers
    • Balance playstyles (PftT, Hybrid, Weapon)
    • Adjust ability cooldowns (for balance and combat pace)
    • Adjust ability power costs (for balance and combat pace)
    • Make Power -the stat- important (adjust stat points, controller PoT changes, passive power regen, weapon power regen)
    • Address content bugs and adjust specific content as needed for difficulty
    • Address powerset-specific bugs
    • Make Crowd Control more impactful (used less often, strategically, to greater effect)
    • Enhance supercharges and supercharge builders
    Stats Revamp In More Detail

    You will have noticed that some of the bullet points or topics above are new in this post, some are broken out and expanded, and some are crossed out. Here's why.

    • Balance powersets post-AM/WM
    • Balance and adjust roles to account for new stat numbers
    • Balance playstyles (PftT, Hybrid, Weapon)
    • Adjust ability cooldowns (for balance and combat pace)
    • Adjust ability power costs (for balance and combat pace)
    These are all ongoing processes. We know that we still have a few outlying abilities and outlying powersets, but also know we're very close and much closer than when we started. Further adjustments and refinements to already-revamped powers will come after we have all powersets on the test server.

    • Make Power -the stat- important (adjust stat points, controller PoT changes, passive power regen, weapon power regen)
    Power (again, the stat) is has been part of our vision in making stats matter in the stats revamp. Actually doing so has been rather complicated, incorporating changes to skill points themselves, controller PoT, how passive and how weapon power regeneration works. All of the above is still under review and will be addressed after all powersets are on the test server.

    • Address content bugs and adjust specific content as needed for difficulty
    • Address powerset-specific bugs
    Bug-fixing is an ongoing effort, and one that will continue until we are wrapped on the revamp. In regard to content specifically, we expect to move onto content comprehensively with the assistance of the content design team towards the end of the revamp.

    • Make Crowd Control more impactful (used less often, strategically, to greater effect)
      1. We focused crowd control onto fewer abilities.
      2. We decreased the duration of crowd control, since abilities never actually reached the set durations anyway (due to breakouts).
      3. We adjusted breakout profiles on all NPCs to create more standard CC times and impact.
    An initial goal of the revamp was to make crowd control more of a choice and less spammy, so that when it happened, you meant to do it. In doing so, we made changes in the three major buckets above.

    Based on feedback, the first change is still under review, especially for controllers. The second change is effectively no different from live, due to how NPCs break out, so we have left it for clarity and standardization. The third change was received negatively, and has been undone entirely minus a few bug fixes. This will make it feel the same in the revamp as it does on live when you CC something.

    • Enhance supercharges and supercharge builders
    An initial goal in the revamp was to fundamentally make supercharge usage and building supercharge more rewarding and more impactful. While we wanted to go further than we have, the player response and enthusiasm going in this direction was mixed. In light of that, we do not plan to further extend their usage now, and will move on to other initiatives.

    Quantum, Earth, Celestial, Iconics, and Weapons

    Today's test server update primarily adds the revamped powersets of Quantum, Earth, and Celestial. Additionally, we have updated and re-enabled iconic powers and further adjusted weapon abilities. For more information on these topics, please see their specific threads.
    Thank you for testing!
    • Like x 2
  2. PSYL0CKE X8 Well-Known Player

  3. Winter Sabel Dedicated Player

    How is Dominance going to affect CC, stuns etc?

    This is how Dom use to function.

    Dominance increases the potency of certain defensive and healing abilities, and the duration of certain control effects (stuns, roots, levitations and encasements) from powers.
    At high levels, Dominance must be higher than enemy Willpower to be effective.
    The recommended Dominance for an Alert, Raid or Operation is needed to affect opponents in that content when using power based control effects.
    4 points of Dominance increases base healing by 1% .
    Power Control Effect duration is increased by 1 second for every 500 Dominance.
    Controller, Tank and Iconic Shields prevent damage equal to Restoration + Dominance.
    Dominance is doubled in Tank role and Controller role.
    Fire Tanks gain 2.2 points of Health for every point of Dominance after a power is used.
    Earth Tanks gain 1 point of Defense for every point of Dominance after a power is used.
    Rage Tanks increase Health by two-thirds Dominance for each nearby enemy after a power is used.
    Dominance is an important stat for Tanks and Controllers.

    Are you going keep this or are you changing?

    If you are changing.
    What are you changing?

    Some explanations and a breakdown like above would be awesome.

  4. Mepps Sr. Community Manager

    For all those testing this weekend, for clarity, we will be stopping in a bit to check on feedback tomorrow and Sunday, but we will be reviewing as a team and primarily responding and answering questions on Monday.
    • Like x 1
  5. DCUO Addict Committed Player

    I've run into one minor UI issue. In order to open a menu, I have to hit the key twice (e.g., to open my inventory, I have to hit "I" twice to get it to open. I haven't been on test for a while, so I don't know if this is new.
  6. Absolix Loyal Player

    Thank you! I hated the idea of the supercharge builder mods with the supercharge builder powers. It could easily be balanced for those without the mod, but would become to strong for those with the mods, creating a divide in the community over something from time capsules. If it was made to be balanced for those with the mod, it would be weak for those without which would make players that would like that play style feel weaker.

    Frankly, as long as those head mods are in the game it is impossible to implement that kind of playstyle without creating a divide between those who do and do not have the mods.
    • Like x 1
  7. The Anxient Loyal Player

    So supercharges will remain similar to live where some powers have extremely beneficial ones (sorcery, ice, munitions) and other powers are just better off not using an SC at all?
  8. DCUO Addict Committed Player

    Thank you for undoing the third change - really, really appreciate you listening to the feedback on that!

    I have some feedback on content balance. Not sure if there's a better place to post it, given that the focus for 1.5 is the newly revamped powers. I've been playing through the solos, starting at T1. I'm trying to set up my character similar to how my toons are on live when they hit lvl 30. I don't have any proficiency and am only using tactical mods. I've also only spent ~40 SP.
    • The T1 solos were pretty easy. I wouldn't adjust them up too much so as not to stonewall new players, but they could be a little more challenging. Doctor Psycho took a while to take down, but I didn't have any trouble with health or power management.
    • The difficulty jumps noticeably when going from T1 solos to T2 solos. I had a lot more trouble with the final fight in the Poison Ivy solo than I would have expected. With all of the control effects in that fight, it might be appropriate to consider toning the damage down slightly.
  9. Cold Fusion Well-Known Player

    Exactly my question...

    People may not like the super charge builder on a specific power limiting load out options... and some may not like SC mods..

    but I'm very sure no one in their right mind was like... Hey Devs please leave 90% of the SC's in the game useless...

    The SC is and should be 1/3rd of the equation of our setups... Powers weapons and SCs. Otherwise why even have the SC bar there.

    Right now only a few Powers on live have a truly viable SC... The community has been complaining about this forever...

    Furthermore why do this huge revamp and leave such a big piece of the BALANCE equation out?

    Example 1.. 2 DPS are out of power.. The Sorcery Dps uses Grand Summoning and uses his weapon while the Hard Light only uses his weapon because his SCs are not viable enough to put in load out... Balanced?

    Example 2... 2 DPS both with power ... Ice uses a might trinket and supply drop then uses a burst might based super charge and continues rotation... Celestrial does the same trinkets but just has main rotation without a burst might base supercharge... Balanced?

    You want to get rid of SC builder and loadouts focusing heavily on SC... Ok no problem.. But the Supers still need major love for all powers so they can function as intended... Not useless for some powers and instant win buttons for others.. *Cough* Munitions..
    • Like x 4
  10. Crimson Mayhem Loyal Player

    Those Gadgets changes look great, but I'm seeing a trend here that worries me a bit. Seems like there are tons of powers now behaving differently depending on your role. I hope offensive supporters and supportive DPS hybrids will still be viable.
  11. stärnbock Devoted Player

    You made neo venom boost into an SC...? Makes sense, now we have a normal power as weapon buff and neo venom for an SC buff. I guess "weapon only" will make some good use of the SC builder (especially earths unstoppable, wich is also possible to clipp with). A shield is allways hepfull for melee situations i guess, but since theyr cooldowns are beyond anything... I guess i rather have something else instead in a "weapon" loadout, maybe another SC... However: thats pretty much it when trying to imagine this playstyle... And i can not believe that this would make it compairable in dps when thinking of hybrid: clipping powers in your combo or WM should, does and hopefully will allways be the better option.

    Suggestion: why not giving weapon players a buff if they are not using powers in theyr loadout wich directly can hurt the target (just using buffs, shields, imunities etc.)?
  12. Maxwill Dedicated Player

    Gadgets' supercharge's generator is also a defense debuff while other powers don't have it ?I mean Stasis field is a defense debuff + supercharge generator and defense debuff is the main debuff trollers will use.Makes sense to have a power that defense debuffs + being a supercharge generator in each troller powerset.

    50% sc for battle drone while others are 100%...How about you troller supercharges(that give power out) have same supercharge cost?

    weapon hits are too weak , they could use and need to do at least 30% more damage

    power costs of powers are too high so PLAY FROM THE TRAY IS NOT AN OPTION,NOT VIABLE .Only hybrid can be done to achieve very good dps, using just weapon is too low dps, playing from the tray will make you run out of power after using 5 high costs powers....
    • Like x 1
  13. Absolix Loyal Player

    Is it possible to get some clarification on whether the formula for calculating Might-based damage has changed?

    The in-game description seems to indicate that it no longer works like it does on live. On live it works as:
    Base Damage Value Range * ( 1 +0.045 * Might )

    Based on what it says on test it would seem to say that it looks more like this:
    Base Damage Constant + ( Multiplier * Might )
    Assuming that the Base Damage Constant is probably 1 just to make sure that powers still do damage at 0 Might.

    If the formula has changed it would be nice to know how to make comparing powers easier.
    • Like x 1
  14. Crimson Mayhem Loyal Player

    Battledrone was always cheaper than the other troll SCs because it's not a group shield and has slower power heals.

    How about investing into Power and not using 5 high cost powers? PFT isn't meant to be able to spam expensive powers, that's what cheap spammer powers are for.
  15. Penryn The Gadgeteer

    I did some testing today to compare the damage for Weapon-Mastery and Play-from-the-Tray builds for Gadgets. For these tests, I was CR 189 using Home Turf/VIII mods. For the purposes of testing, I did not use any league proficiencies, buff sodas, trinkets, or any teammates to provide power.

    Weapon Mastery Test
    Weapon: Two-Handed
    Attack: Spinning Punch (this is one of the highest parsing group weapon attacks I've seen)

    Battle Display - Weapon Buff
    Cryo-Field - AoE DoT. Supplementary damage
    Robot Sidekick - Single target supplementary damage. Nerfs passive power regen while it is active, but wasn't a big deal with only two powers to maintain.


    Demonstration Video

    Using 10 second parses, I saw the following:
    23073/s ( think I clipped too early here)

    For the PftT test, I went with a power-heavy build.
    Paralyzing Dart - Cheap spamming power
    Gauss Grenade - Sets up the PI for Paralyzing Dart
    Cryo-Field - AoE DoT damage


    Demonstration Video

    Using 10 second parses, I get the following:

    That didn't last too long. I run out of power after 30 seconds using a soda! Dropping Cryo-Field and using a soda allows me to run a Gauss Grenade/Paralyzing Dart rotation for about 90 seconds. Spamming Paralyzing Dart by itself without any PI setup gives me 12-15k/s.

    There was another Gadgets PftT build that I was testing that was giving me 20k/s, but I run out of power in 20 seconds with it.

    I don't think Replenishing Adapter procs for Gadgets powers like it does for other powersets.

    Spinning Punch Mastery is the winner here for group damage. It would have beat any of the PftT builds using only weapon damage and the weapon buff.

    I haven't done enough testing with Gadgets to figure out its current peak Hybrid build. I've been dissatisfied with everything I've tested so far on Gadgets Hybrid.
    • Like x 1
  16. Maxwill Dedicated Player

    How do you know that PFT isn't meant to be able to spam expensive powers? did a developers say it? where? post me the link if there is one coz i haven't found it.
  17. Winter Sabel Dedicated Player

    From what I am seeing, it looks like clipping needs to be addressed.
    The reason why I say that is if damage is going off of animation times. Then that means clipping the animations for more damage is an exploit.
  18. Penryn The Gadgeteer

    Here are somrelevant quotes:


    There is a whole section devoted to PftT in that last link.
    • Like x 2
  19. Maxwill Dedicated Player

    So you both want to say that they shouldn't reduce power cost of some powers nor increase the power out the trollers give?
  20. Penryn The Gadgeteer

    Let's take this one part at a time:

    Supercharge Costs:
    Gadgets Battle Drone: 1000
    Light's Group Shielding: 1000
    Mental's Bastion: 1000
    Quantum Event Horizon: 1000

    Word of Power: 1000

    All of the group power heal supercharges have the same cost so far.

    For the record, a "100% Supercharge" costs 2000. So that makes all of these "50%".

    Can you post the research that you've done on the topic? It would be nice to see the numbers you are getting and what you are using for comparison. I posted some of my stats, results, and videos in this post:

    This type of comment isn't very helpful for the developers. They need to know specifics about what you're seeing.

    You were asking for quotes about high-cost powers and Play-from-the-Tray. I provided them. Interesting that gets changed into this statement.

    My feedback on Controller power output is that I think Controller group power heal supercharges do not return sufficient power out. It is really bad at high tiers if you are playing with people that are heavily specced into power. The supercharge power heals are barely noticeable on some players.
    • Like x 4
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